bpoteat

Over the last few weeks I was noticing that the transmission on my 03 C4S was misbehaving some. It wasn't terrible but occasionally 1st would be difficult to get into. It wasn't every time and I could manage to make it work but had to fiddle with it and sometimes I felt I was forcing it more than I should. Obviously I was scouring the forums trying to figure out what was wrong with it (and hoping any type of invasive surgery wouldn't be required). Thought I would at least be looking at doing the 2nd gear detent that seems to pop up whenever anyone has 1st or 2nd gears popping out.

I had a couple of motor mounts (just the rein replacements) I had ordered a while back because a) figured it's about that time and b) the tailpipes were sitting a tad lower than they should (especially the right one). I had a few spare minutes this weekend so decided to switch them out and BAM!

The transmission feels absolutely perfect now. Clicks into 1st like a toggle switch and, once everything is warmed up, just feels so damn good through all the gears.

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Just wanted to put this out there for people that might be having some minor transmission problems. It might not be your silver bullet but it's a pretty simple & inexpensive fix that could help if you haven't done it yet.

details

I appreciate this info. When I got my car this past October there were times shifting into reverse was a real struggle. I bought the shifter adjustment tool and that "fixed" it, but now I wonder if the real problem is engine mounts. I wasn't thinking so because my tailpipes are pretty much okay compared to pictures I've seen (although one is slightly lower). Now I need to rethink this.

Thanks again.

bpoteat

FYI - If you are just going standard and not going to try to get some improved mounts or anything, the Rein mounts are cheaper at rockauto than pretty much anywhere else I found (by a LOT).

FrozenApples

Can confirm the rock auto comment. Mine get here Thursday. Will report backs on any improvements. My shifting is pretty good right now but reverse is sometimes tough to get into. Mostly hoping that the bump I sometimes feel when depressing the clutch goes away.

cds72911

Glad it fixed your issue, but for the life of me, I can't understand why replacing motor mounts would have any impact on shifting. The rear of the shifter cables is fixed in relation to the actuating arms by a bracket bolted to the side of the transmission. The front end of the cables is fixed in the shifter assembly. Neither end can move. Movement of the transmission/motor assembly should have no impact on the shifting. Unless, maybe, somehow, the entire motor/transmission assembly is moving so far aft under acceleration that you are putting strain on the shifter cables themselves - elongating them...? I struggle to imagine that happening. Any better explanations out there?

bpoteat

Me neither. No idea why. The more I think about it, it's kind of confusing and a little concerning. But, from what I've read, my experience is not uncommon. I've seen in a few places mention that worn out motor mounts cause shifting problems.

turbogrill

Combined with a worn transmission mount if could potentially tilt the transmission a bit. Could that cause any issues?

dporto

^^ Exactly^^ even without a worn tranny mount, the transaxle and engine form one long unit - drop the back by 1/2-3/4" and you change the geometry of the cables. It doesn't take much to change the feel and how smoothly it shifts. It may seem confusing but it's real.

cds72911

I see what you are saying. Since the cable sheaths are firmly mounted to the transmission bracket (not the body) on the transmission end, something has to change in the relationship of the cables and sheaths to make this happen. Are the movements resulting from worn out mounts enough to temporarily elongate the sheath on the cable? That is the only way it makes sense to me since the cables’ sheaths are firmly anchored at both ends and the cable itself can’t stretch. If the sheath elongated and the cable inside remained rigid, it would change the amount the actuating arms move impacting how far the shift sleeves move, causing the behavior...

dkraige

I'd also suggest anybody with shifting issues try re-aligning their shifter with the neutral tool:



When I installed my 997 shifter I did it by counting ribs on the end of the cables and putting the cables in the new shifter cable fittings exactly in the same place as they were on the 996 shifter. The stick ended up in a neutral position that seemed reasonable, and it would go into all the gears fine, so I figured that was a safe place to leave it. When in neutral, it was a few millimeters away from where the alignment tool wanted it to be, but I figured it was safer to keep it aligned as original. In hindsight this was kind of dumb because who knows if that was even the original position, or if somebody had taken this apart before and put it back together wrong. The car shifted "pretty good", but was a little notchy in some gears, especially going between 1 and 2. More recently I took it apart again and aligned it using the tool. Shifting into all gears is improved! It's not an earth-shattering difference, but it's clearly enough to notice. The only downside is that it's moved the neutral position slightly away from me, to the right, so reaching for the gearshift is a few millimeters farther than it used to be, but that's okay. The kinematics of the gearshift must be just sensitive enough that if neutral isn't where that green alignment tool wants it to be, shifting is sub-optimal. Here's another good post on the topic:

https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...1-2-shift.html

Although they left out the key step to make sure the transmission is in neutral before disconnecting the cable ends, and then don't move the cables longitudinally at all while they are disconnected; you want the transmission nicely in neutral during the entire operation.

PDX_Kip

Not to thread hijack, but how do you know if the shifting is not right? My newer-to-me C2 can be difficult to shift into first, particularly when cold. To the point that I release the clutch pedal, move it back-and-forth in neutral a couple times, press the clutch pedal again, and push it into first (an old Alfa trick). This seems to help, but seems excessive. Second can be a challenge sometimes too (again, particularly when cold). This is my first P-car, so I have no point of reference. Is there way to check motor mounts since this seems to have an impact (VWs have a visual indicator) ?

dkraige

The easiest way to check motor mounts is to look at the gap between the exhaust pipes and bumper cutouts; if it's big, the motor is sagging because of worn mounts. But this isn't a guarantee since the tips are adjustable and somebody could tweak those to compensate for sagging motor mounts.

If you remove the mounts you can compare how much it's sticking out to a new one; but if you're removing them you might as well just replace them. They are pretty cheap, and very easy to replace. The transmission mount is harder and requires special tools.

FrozenApples

Well got them replaced and definitely notice less nvh from the engine. Biggest difference is at idle when it's the only source of nvh. Nothing much different from a shifting standpoint. My mounts were original and about as bad as they could be.

Next stop is transmission mount which is supposed to be a bigger impact I think.