AnthonyGS

I've been a car guy all my life. I've had the pleasure of driving and riding in cool cars before I could drive including a real Pantera, a Plymouth Superbird, tons of muscle cars, and some P cars, lots of Audis some BMWs and some of Japan's best offerings. I've owned so many cars in 45 years I'm not sure I can count them or remember them all.

One thing I remember reading about the 3rd gen RX-7 (dad drove first pre-production one in US), was that they aimed for a power to weight ratio of 10lb/hp. At the time this or better offered race car like performance potential.

10lb/hp... it's enough to get into trouble but it's also manageable, even friendly to some extent. You can go fast, but you still have feel, control and predictability. Any car with this power to weight ratio is a blast to drive. Most N/A 911s including the 996, the C5 Corvette, the Audi S cars usually fall here, a lot of BMW m cars, and the Dodge Challenger scat pack cars. Ever notice how everyone loves driving the scat pack but is simply scared of the Hellcat? It's too much power to be fun. You have to concentrate more, it's not forgiving.

Sure there are way faster cars, and I've driven some but white knuckle driving isn't as much fun.

Now that we have an ideal power to weight, we need a car that handles great. The Miata fits the bill but it's so underpowered and a V8 Miata is an overpowered white knuckle ride.... tried both. The 3rd gen RX-7 is a dream and may be my next collector car, but the ride is harsh.

So really the cars that fit this bill and get the handling right are the 911, m3, boxster s and cayman s. I can't wait to own a boxster s or cayman s someday too.

So back to my 996. It has the us M030 suspension and it's a 2000 C2. It has 300 hp and weighs right at 3000 lbs. it's a 6 spd, and has most trouble areas addressed by POs. It rides firm but forgiving. It's nearly as tosssable as a Miata. The old fashioned steering gives great feedback. The view of the instruments and from the cockpit is almost perfect. The car feels small yet solid. It behaves itself in all conditions including ice and snow ( I was shocked). It's friendly enough my wife loves to drive it. It still looks modern. And whenever you desire you can confidently go faster, turn faster, and enjoy the performance.

Sure there are many faster cars, but do they balance performance, handling and fun as well? Most do not. If you've never driven a 996 N/A car, you really just don't know what you are missing.

Chicago6MT

Very well said. It's easy to go fast in almost immediately. The first time I drove one I was 27 and had it at 160mph on the Autobahn. I came back stateside telling everyone I knew that it felt more planted and more confidence inspiring at high speeds than at low speeds. It was a C4S, but it handled wet roads, light snow, switchbacks, 0-60 dumps, and two inexperienced driver's going well beyond their limits. Amazing car, and the reason why I still want one 15 years later, despite all their idiosyncrasies.

Nickshu

What's the saying? ....It's always more fun to drive a slow car fast than a fast car slow.

Audidude

Exactly why I bought my car ('03 C2 manual).

It was bought purely as a weekend recreational driving tool - I love driving and here in NZ we are spoilt for access to great tarmac country roads at our doorstep. There was no requirement for any concession to commuting comforts, just pure driving specs.

So that meant reasonable price point, light weight, manual, 2WD, normally aspirated engine, steering with great feel and feedback, and useful performance (I'm not interested in times/speeds -past the bragging age!). With a checklist like that, the 996 C2 manual chose itself.

Especially now that I have fitted H&R lowering springs and Billy B8s.

Driving the car now I feel at one with the chassis (hard in a non-caged car without a 6 point harness, which is where I get my other driving thrills - tarmac rally, circuit, including 3x Nurburgring 24 hour), the steering feedback is sublime - feels as if you are massaging the road with your hands - and the instant throttle response of the normally aspirated engine made the loaner Cayman S (the mech shop lent me while fitting the suspension) feel as if there was cotton wool between the throttle and the engine response. Brilliant car none-the-less!

Modern cars are simply too refined and heavy to give this kind of driving experience - yes they are amazing pieces of technology, but you are left admiring the technology rather than directly controlling and experiencing the car's responses.

I also love the pure and simple clean lines - to my eye the C4S looks heavy and cumbersome in comparison - still an awesome looking car, don't get me wrong please, but style is all about individual personal taste preferences.

The title of this thread nailed it for me.




'03 C2 Manual, H&R, B8s

Volkert

Yep, agree to all points mentioned. Mine, a 1998 C2 with RoW M030, no sunroof, no rear wiper, turbo hollow spoke wheels I calculated to be below 1300kg, so 2850lbs just feels so planted. With access to Autobahn I am just amazed how well this car drives at very high speeds, also in rain or wind. I love the steering and feel I am still only at the beginning of a very long learning curve!

911Syncro

Me too. I'm 5 months into a C4S and just loving it. Although it is heavier than the C2 (esp. with the Tiptronic) there is plenty of power and the handling is outstanding. In straight, curves, over bumps, etc. the car is always hugging the ground. Have had some other older P-cars, and none perform like the 996. I have always appreciated great handling over raw power, its just more fun because we get to practice driving skills -- anyone can floor the gas pedal on some high powered car but that isn't the same as a spirited drive through the mountains. Unfortunately I don't have the opportunity to compare to a lightweight C2 with suspension upgrades, but I imagine the experience is a bit lighter and responsive. Either way, definitely loving the car.

5CHN3LL

The 996 is a fun car, but if you want a truly forgiving car you can go fast in with no fear of dying, the 986 Boxster is even better. I have NEVER owned or driven any other car that could be over-driven in the worst ways at the worst times and still wind up pointed the right way. The only driving aid in that car was ABS, and it was phenomenal. My ONLY regret re: the 996 was selling my 986. Shoulda kept it.

It's not a particularly ego-boosting story, but one of my first driving instructors, after finishing a "spirited" lap, asked if I wanted to try a lap with PSM disabled. When he realized the car was just that good at soaking up terrible inputs with no traction control, he was blown away. Glowing review of the car; not so much the driver.

Moving to the 996 has been a good thing as far as being a better driver, though...inputs the 986 would have just soaked up will cause PSM to fire on the 996; I have to be far smoother in the 996 to drive as quickly as I could in the 986 without upsetting the car.

AnthonyGS

I'm looking forward to picking up a 986 S in a year or two actually. One I miss top down driving and two the reasons you mention. It's funny we have similar tastes in cars. I have two for sale (or one), but my two keepers are my 996 and my '91 Corvette ZR-1, quite similar to your '96 really.

peterp

My favorite 911's to drive have always been the pre-73 cars, particularly the "e" versions, because they are the last version of a true light sports car in my mind. The newer cars are more refined and faster, so I like them also, but I've never found any found any of them as fun to toss around as the late 60's/early 70's 911's.

At least that was true until I got my 996 (2000, C2, 6-speed, coupe). To me, the 996, at 2900 lbs, has the same light feel of the early 911's but with a lot more power (which, combined with power steering, makes the additional weight disappear versus the early cars) and with creature comforts like climate control that make it a joy to drive daily. Every time I get in it, all I think about is how it is like those early cars, but comfortable enough and modern enough to make it the perfect daily driver.

I love, love, love the 996, which is a surprise even to me. Why? Because I didn't really like my first 996. I bought a C4 Tip back when they were new for my wife and, while it was a reliable car, I did not enjoy driving it all (my wife loved it). The tip adds something like 150 lbs and the early versions of it (mine was 2001) are not sporty as a transmission. The 4wd added roughly another 150lbs to my old car and it just did not feel sporty or fun to drive -- you couldn't toss it around, you just drove it and it wasn't exciting even though it was very competent.

My current 996.1 C2 6-speed is night and day from my prior car. I love it and consider it one of the best driving cars I've ever owned or driven. It think the cab option (which I never owned) adds another 150 or so lbs, so a C4/Tip/Cab weighs somewhere around 500 lbs more and drives radically different than a C2/6-speed/Coupe. If you've only tried the former, I really suggest you drive the latter to get a feel for how great a lightweight 996 is to drive.

I hope nobody thinks I'm trashing the Tip/4wd/Cab options -- they have their benefits obviously and you should buy the car that best fits your needs -- but it is worth pointing out that there is a big difference in driving dynamics between the different versions.

Audidude

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What he said - great sum up!

5CHN3LL

The 986/996 compliments the 1996 Corvette C4 nicely. My C4 has a few tweaks to make more power quickly at the expense of top-end speed - the D44 has 3.73:1 gears, which works with the auto to make ridiculous torque. If I don't back off during the 1-2 shift at the drag strip, the car will burn out for a full second or two. For a mostly-stock base-model automatic Corvette, it's a tremendous amount of fun.

I underestimated just how much psychological effect dropping the top at the end of a long workday has.

Oregoncoaststi

Untill you drive a fast car fast.....

charlieaf92

I used to have a 3rd gen RX-7 (it was a 94). Beautiful car and a blast to drive. I was lucky enough to get one when I was 18. It was very fast and lacked any electronic assist that you'd find in newer cars. No traction control, stability management, etc. Just ABS and a LSD. Very prone to snap oversteer unfortunately.

It didn't prove to be a very practical every day car and I found it sat much more than I drove it. The final year I had it, I only put 1,200 miles on it. That, combined with the fact that they seem to need a new engine every 30k miles prompted me to sell it and get something fun/fast and more daily usable.

I do miss it though. Although the instant throttle response and torque of the 996 is better. Despite the sequential system (which resulted in an insane number of solenoids and vacuum lines) it still suffered from turbo lag.

Chris(MA)

Speaking of driving enjoyment over just pure HP, has anyone ever played around with hydraulic power steering to reduce the amount of assist?

I always liked the idea of perhaps dialing back the liquid pressure in a system so I get more of an un-assisted feeling through the steering.

Spork

Okay, you've convinced me. I am going to go buy one.......oh wait.