993TT Ruf Conversion
11-22-2003, 03:00 PM
#16
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Bill
when my ECU was mapped on the engine dyno, they said they would map is to be optimised for Euro 98 Ron fuel, but that if I wanted they could map it to work with octane booster for even more performance. They said if I had to put Euro 95 Ron in then it was imperative to put a can of 104+ black in, in fact they gave me a pack of 6 for my trip through Italy following collection of the car. Bearing this in mind I am interested that your motor is even safe to run on US 91 octane, I presumed there was not enough "adaptability" for the ECU to work optimally with such a range of fuels - hence RS giving me the octane booster
when my ECU was mapped on the engine dyno, they said they would map is to be optimised for Euro 98 Ron fuel, but that if I wanted they could map it to work with octane booster for even more performance. They said if I had to put Euro 95 Ron in then it was imperative to put a can of 104+ black in, in fact they gave me a pack of 6 for my trip through Italy following collection of the car. Bearing this in mind I am interested that your motor is even safe to run on US 91 octane, I presumed there was not enough "adaptability" for the ECU to work optimally with such a range of fuels - hence RS giving me the octane booster
11-22-2003, 06:37 PM
#17
TB993tt,
Ruf told me that his ECU will work with ANY fuel (except maybe alcohol).
Apparently the Ruf ECU uses the knock sensor effectively to adjust timing, air/fuel and boost to accept the lower quality fuel. So, although the engine feels weaker over 3500 RPM with US 91, it will never knock.
When I put in US 100 (which is higher than your Euro 98) the car requires several full-acceleration runs before it adapts to the new fuel. Then it feels much more powerful. The ECU is apparently "learning" the characteristics of the new fuel by listening to the knock sensor. It then makes the required adjustments.
I observed this behavior several times, especially on the track. It is very noticeable. I would guess it feels like a 50 HP difference.
I don't believe all aftermarket ECUs are as adaptive as the Ruf system, which was developed with Bosch. The one downside is that you need to wait for the Ruf ECU to learn the new fuel, while the other ECUs require no wait or "training" period.
Ruf told me that his ECU will work with ANY fuel (except maybe alcohol).
Apparently the Ruf ECU uses the knock sensor effectively to adjust timing, air/fuel and boost to accept the lower quality fuel. So, although the engine feels weaker over 3500 RPM with US 91, it will never knock.
When I put in US 100 (which is higher than your Euro 98) the car requires several full-acceleration runs before it adapts to the new fuel. Then it feels much more powerful. The ECU is apparently "learning" the characteristics of the new fuel by listening to the knock sensor. It then makes the required adjustments.
I observed this behavior several times, especially on the track. It is very noticeable. I would guess it feels like a 50 HP difference.
I don't believe all aftermarket ECUs are as adaptive as the Ruf system, which was developed with Bosch. The one downside is that you need to wait for the Ruf ECU to learn the new fuel, while the other ECUs require no wait or "training" period.
11-23-2003, 02:11 AM
#18
Burning Brakes
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TB993tt
Are you a twin plug? If so what ecu are you running?
Bill S.I'm curious as to the ecu that RUF uses in their CTR which I understrand is a twin plug. If you know.
I'm running a programable ecu and I'm looking for someone who has setup a Motronic ecu wit a twinplug 993tt. Thanks for your help.
Are you a twin plug? If so what ecu are you running?
Bill S.I'm curious as to the ecu that RUF uses in their CTR which I understrand is a twin plug. If you know.
I'm running a programable ecu and I'm looking for someone who has setup a Motronic ecu wit a twinplug 993tt. Thanks for your help.
11-23-2003, 08:26 AM
#19
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JJayB
Mine is a Motronic running twin plug - I don't know any specifics of how it works but RS obviously have the knowledge you are looking for. The electronics whizz Gunther Mandel who now works for Sportec (apparently) comes to the US from time to time. I am pretty certain he did twin plug using Motronic when he worked for TTP.
Mine is a Motronic running twin plug - I don't know any specifics of how it works but RS obviously have the knowledge you are looking for. The electronics whizz Gunther Mandel who now works for Sportec (apparently) comes to the US from time to time. I am pretty certain he did twin plug using Motronic when he worked for TTP.
11-23-2003, 10:57 AM
#20
JJayB,
The last CTR2 I saw had the twin plug and second injector disconnected.
When I asked Ruf about this, they mentioned they've been having a tough time getting twin plugs to work correctly with the Motronic. This is why it was removed and they don't generally offer twin plugs.
Also, in discussions with their techs, the twin-plug does not make much of a difference when you have good Octane. So, it seems Ruf is not really interested in getting maximum performance on a 993 with our 91.
By the way, there special order 550 HP 993 TT does not even use twin plugs. Here's what they told me:
"For your Turbo R we could offer you an upgrade to 550 bhp for $ 56,000. This includes: titanium conrods, new cylinder heads, total rebuilt of the engine, new charger, new exhaust system and new motronic".
This work can only be done in Germany and is apparently very extensive.
The last CTR2 I saw had the twin plug and second injector disconnected.
When I asked Ruf about this, they mentioned they've been having a tough time getting twin plugs to work correctly with the Motronic. This is why it was removed and they don't generally offer twin plugs.
Also, in discussions with their techs, the twin-plug does not make much of a difference when you have good Octane. So, it seems Ruf is not really interested in getting maximum performance on a 993 with our 91.
By the way, there special order 550 HP 993 TT does not even use twin plugs. Here's what they told me:
"For your Turbo R we could offer you an upgrade to 550 bhp for $ 56,000. This includes: titanium conrods, new cylinder heads, total rebuilt of the engine, new charger, new exhaust system and new motronic".
This work can only be done in Germany and is apparently very extensive.
11-23-2003, 11:48 AM
#21
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When speccing my engine, I was given the option of twin plugs - the advantages were said to be better throttle response and bigger torque in the mid range - no effect on maximum power.I have never driven a single plug 993tt of similar spec, but my throttle response is VERY sharp. I think its easy to underestimate just how much work RS did on developing their knowledge of the Motronic systems on the 993tt engine - the fastest twin plug EVO GT2s ran with their Motronic managed engines. Whilst Ruf is obviously an acknowledged gold standard in Porsche tuning, their lack of exposure to the extreme environment of motorsport must put them at a disadvantage.
11-23-2003, 09:12 PM
#22
Burning Brakes
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Bill and TB
Thanks for the input.
We saw 30-40 ft/lbs torque with the twin plug conversion on the dyno which confirms TB993tt comments.
I was contemplating changing my ecu, as my motor seemed off at my last track event. Guess what? I changed diverter valves and bingo, this thing rocks, which I confirmed with a Passport G-tech on 0-100mph. I'll test some more early Thurs.
Thanks for the input.
We saw 30-40 ft/lbs torque with the twin plug conversion on the dyno which confirms TB993tt comments.
I was contemplating changing my ecu, as my motor seemed off at my last track event. Guess what? I changed diverter valves and bingo, this thing rocks, which I confirmed with a Passport G-tech on 0-100mph. I'll test some more early Thurs.
11-24-2003, 09:42 PM
#24
Burning Brakes
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911/Q45
Yes, I went with the Bailey d/v's.
Interesting side note, The replacement valves for Porsche 996tt are aftermarket metal valves not plastic Bosch units. Don't know if they are Bailey or EVO units.
Yes, I went with the Bailey d/v's.
Interesting side note, The replacement valves for Porsche 996tt are aftermarket metal valves not plastic Bosch units. Don't know if they are Bailey or EVO units.
