Rufus needs rear tires (again!!!!!!)
11-03-2010, 02:58 PM
#1
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Rufus needs rear tires (again!!!!!!)
Dang it... it seems like only yesterday I mounted 4 new Toyo Proxes T1R tires on Rufus (15 mos and 8000 miles ago). I made the mistake of looking at my rear tires, and sure enough, the inside edges are gone. Again. Outside edges look good, and fronts are like new. Damn it. The tire size is 315x25x19 and the cheapest I've found these tires is at discountedtires.com at $364 per tire. I guess I have to add tax, shipping, mounting, balancing to that. My local guy wants $1000 out-the door for the pair, installed.
Should I do an alignment after I mount the new tires? Does this wear sound about right... I actually think I have a very non-agressive rear camber on the car. I worry about who in Santa Cruz has even heard of "kinematic rear toe", let alone has the equipment.
Any other ideas about where to find these tires cheaper?
Thanks in advance.
Should I do an alignment after I mount the new tires? Does this wear sound about right... I actually think I have a very non-agressive rear camber on the car. I worry about who in Santa Cruz has even heard of "kinematic rear toe", let alone has the equipment.
Any other ideas about where to find these tires cheaper?
Thanks in advance.
11-03-2010, 06:53 PM
#3
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Excellent... its "treadeopt.com" and their price is $305 each. No sales tax, and shipping for the pair is $67. Even with disposal fees, mounting and balancing, I should be able to get out the door for $750 or less. Thanks for the link!
. Oh and BTW......did you remove the window tint?
11-03-2010, 09:45 PM
#6
Drifting
Join Date: Mar 2002
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Scott: 8000 miles would be, what, 100 years of driving for you?
Steve is probably conflicted about removing the tint, since he still drives around wearing only a thong and rollerskates, despite the restraining order.
Steve is probably conflicted about removing the tint, since he still drives around wearing only a thong and rollerskates, despite the restraining order.
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11-04-2010, 01:37 AM
#8
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Scott Shepley: I'm in no hurry to remove the tint. I don't think they can write a second ticket while the first is "pending".
Scott Mellor: You promised not to mention the thong.
MSW: I used Custom Alignment many years ago for Waldo. They DO know their stuff. Good idea.
Scott Mellor: You promised not to mention the thong.
MSW: I used Custom Alignment many years ago for Waldo. They DO know their stuff. Good idea.
11-04-2010, 02:23 AM
#9
Racer
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Steve, it does sound like you have a little too much negative camber on those rears. If for instance, the car does the majority of its miles on the freeway, this is what you'll get especially with that width. Add a little more spirited back road driving and you might find more even wear. I suspect it will be 0,5 degrees more than you need for your application. You can dial it out, but I'd advise driving that beautiful baby much harder with the current setup and get your even wear that way! (Disclaimer: this will result in even faster overall wear, but it will be more EVEN).
11-04-2010, 03:00 AM
#10
Rennlist Member
11-04-2010, 11:53 AM
#11
Rennlist Member
Steve,
Just FYI, you can get a ticket every time you drive in violation. Regardless of how many "pending" cites for the same violation.
Regards,
Enrique
Just FYI, you can get a ticket every time you drive in violation. Regardless of how many "pending" cites for the same violation.
Regards,
Enrique
11-04-2010, 01:36 PM
#12
Rennlist Member
QUOTE=ScottMellor;8027702]Scott: 8000 miles would be, what, 100 years of driving for you?
Steve is probably conflicted about removing the tint, since he still drives around wearing only a thong and rollerskates, despite the restraining order.[/QUOTE]
Steve is probably conflicted about removing the tint, since he still drives around wearing only a thong and rollerskates, despite the restraining order.[/QUOTE]
11-04-2010, 11:35 PM
#14
Three Wheelin'
Hi Steve,
Long time no see.
I'd be willing to bet your car is set to stock camber settings in the rear, which is very negative, in the range of -1.5 degrees in the rear if I recall correctly. This is great if you live on mountain roads and drive them aggressively all the time, but not so great if you do any kind of freeway or city driving in a straight line.
For anyone wondering why Porsche would choose such a ridiculous camber setting in the rear versus less than 1 degree in the front, it is for safety. The end of the car that has more negative camber has more grip in turns. The huge disparity between the front and rear camber settings makes it so that the average unskilled driver won't back the car into a tree the first time he (or she!) takes a corner aggressively. The car will safely understeer, and the rear will hang on in most cases, unless the driver does something very stupid. This is especially important in a powerful rear-engined car like a 911; a large reason the 911's handling has gotten so much more forgiving over the years is a combination of extremely staggered tire sizes, modern rear suspension geometry, and the factory alignment settings. This is also why these cars with factory alignment will understeer like pigs and destroy the outside edges of the front tires on the track in 1 day. You need camber plates to dial in more camber in the front and balance out the handling.
A big reason why the 996 GT2's handling got panned so badly by the press when it came out is the factory set the alignment to be as safe as possible on paper, but it made the car understeer badly to a point, and then suddenly break away in the rear due to laws of physics (almost 500 hp, RWD and no traction/stability control will manifest itself at some point!)
For what it's worth, BMW aligns their cars from the factory with similar camber settings, so that people don't kill themselves (some of them run -1.7 in the rear!!!). The lawyers at work again. We dial some of that out on most customer cars so the rear tires last.
Finally, make sure the place you take it knows how to align these cars; when you change the camber, it can also affect toe to a certain extent, and they need to know about the kinematic toe, etc. Go wherever the RMG guys send you, those guys know their stuff.
Long time no see.
I'd be willing to bet your car is set to stock camber settings in the rear, which is very negative, in the range of -1.5 degrees in the rear if I recall correctly. This is great if you live on mountain roads and drive them aggressively all the time, but not so great if you do any kind of freeway or city driving in a straight line.
For anyone wondering why Porsche would choose such a ridiculous camber setting in the rear versus less than 1 degree in the front, it is for safety. The end of the car that has more negative camber has more grip in turns. The huge disparity between the front and rear camber settings makes it so that the average unskilled driver won't back the car into a tree the first time he (or she!) takes a corner aggressively. The car will safely understeer, and the rear will hang on in most cases, unless the driver does something very stupid. This is especially important in a powerful rear-engined car like a 911; a large reason the 911's handling has gotten so much more forgiving over the years is a combination of extremely staggered tire sizes, modern rear suspension geometry, and the factory alignment settings. This is also why these cars with factory alignment will understeer like pigs and destroy the outside edges of the front tires on the track in 1 day. You need camber plates to dial in more camber in the front and balance out the handling.
A big reason why the 996 GT2's handling got panned so badly by the press when it came out is the factory set the alignment to be as safe as possible on paper, but it made the car understeer badly to a point, and then suddenly break away in the rear due to laws of physics (almost 500 hp, RWD and no traction/stability control will manifest itself at some point!)
For what it's worth, BMW aligns their cars from the factory with similar camber settings, so that people don't kill themselves (some of them run -1.7 in the rear!!!). The lawyers at work again. We dial some of that out on most customer cars so the rear tires last.
Finally, make sure the place you take it knows how to align these cars; when you change the camber, it can also affect toe to a certain extent, and they need to know about the kinematic toe, etc. Go wherever the RMG guys send you, those guys know their stuff.
11-05-2010, 01:17 PM
#15
Steve
Dave at Performance Art used to work for Custom Alignment.He knows more about setting these cars up that anyone I have ever talked to.
I would call them and see if he is still works there.They have recently moved from Gilroy to San Jose.
When and if I ever decide to have PSS 10's installed,he is the one who will do it.
Dave at Performance Art used to work for Custom Alignment.He knows more about setting these cars up that anyone I have ever talked to.
I would call them and see if he is still works there.They have recently moved from Gilroy to San Jose.
When and if I ever decide to have PSS 10's installed,he is the one who will do it.