Exhaust Valve Guide wear major issue with 993tt
07-19-2002, 12:38 AM
#16
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[quote]Originally posted by Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems:
<strong>
Bond:
IMHO, this is something that should be be checked on any used 964-993-TT car as part of the PPI.
If the technician discovers excessive side-play in the valves, then an allowance should probably be made in the price to accomodate a valve job sometime in the near future. At least this is what I advise my customers to do.
From what I've seen so far,...GT-3 engines, this is not confined to the air-cooled models.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Steve:
What is the total cost to rebuild the top end on a 97' 993tt?
Bond
<strong>
Bond:
IMHO, this is something that should be be checked on any used 964-993-TT car as part of the PPI.
If the technician discovers excessive side-play in the valves, then an allowance should probably be made in the price to accomodate a valve job sometime in the near future. At least this is what I advise my customers to do.
From what I've seen so far,...GT-3 engines, this is not confined to the air-cooled models.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Steve:
What is the total cost to rebuild the top end on a 97' 993tt?
Bond
07-19-2002, 02:19 AM
#17
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Bond:
I cannot tell you what other shops get for this job but here, you'd be looking at something around $ 4000 if nothing else was found.
I should comment here and tell you (and others) that is not an issue and cause for concern unless the engine using oil at more than 1000/quart.
I would not recommend to any client that this ought to be done until the oil consumption became excessive. I'd tell you or anyone to drive and enjoy these magnificent cars until there IS a a problem. In general, these things are damned well bulletproof.
I cannot tell you what other shops get for this job but here, you'd be looking at something around $ 4000 if nothing else was found.
I should comment here and tell you (and others) that is not an issue and cause for concern unless the engine using oil at more than 1000/quart.
I would not recommend to any client that this ought to be done until the oil consumption became excessive. I'd tell you or anyone to drive and enjoy these magnificent cars until there IS a a problem. In general, these things are damned well bulletproof.
07-19-2002, 02:33 AM
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Somehow I was thinking that it would have been considerably more than the 4000.00 - if this is the cost, then its really a minor issue (I spent 2700.00 on my wife's Q45 last year and its worth only 12000.00!). Thanks for everyone's help on this.
Bond
Bond
07-20-2002, 04:51 AM
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Well, very interesting. I happen to be Kevin Kelly from Andial and it's funny how you get a phone call and you are trying to help out a person and you tell them alot of the information at hand and only some of it gets posted! Other info. I don't recall speaking of some how has come out of my mouth and made it on a "Porsche Discussion" board. Don't get me wrong the board is a great place for exchanging info., but you must also be careful. Someone could just as easily log on to a medical discussion board and post their .02 there, all the while having non meds reading it and taking the info for the written word.
Steve, I thank you for posting your reply, but had this person put ALL of our conversation on the post you would not have had to waste your time. Most everything you posted I had discussed with him in our phone call.
Kevin Kelly
Steve, I thank you for posting your reply, but had this person put ALL of our conversation on the post you would not have had to waste your time. Most everything you posted I had discussed with him in our phone call.
Kevin Kelly
07-20-2002, 05:52 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by My Q Ship:
<strong>Well, very interesting. I happen to be Kevin Kelly from Andial and it's funny how you get a phone call and you are trying to help out a person and you tell them alot of the information at hand and only some of it gets posted! Other info. I don't recall speaking of some how has come out of my mouth and made it on a "Porsche Discussion" board. Don't get me wrong the board is a great place for exchanging info., but you must also be careful. Someone could just as easily log on to a medical discussion board and post their .02 there, all the while having non meds reading it and taking the info for the written word.
Steve, I thank you for posting your reply, but had this person put ALL of our conversation on the post you would not have had to waste your time. Most everything you posted I had discussed with him in our phone call.
Kevin Kelly</strong><hr></blockquote>
Kevin -
What words did I put in your mouth and what words were left out? I reviewed the thread here and it covers our entire conversation no more and no less. I do not rely 100% on a single source for information and therefore made the oroginal post for a sanity check regarding what you told me over the phone since I have not had any first hand experience dealing with you/ANDIAL. It is also possible that the customers that ANDIAL services does not represent a prefect cross-section of typical Porsche owners and this would also be a good reason for the post.
Since the board is a public forum and ANDIAL in is in the customer service business, it is really a good idea to suggest that I have wasted someone else's time with this thread?
Bond
<strong>Well, very interesting. I happen to be Kevin Kelly from Andial and it's funny how you get a phone call and you are trying to help out a person and you tell them alot of the information at hand and only some of it gets posted! Other info. I don't recall speaking of some how has come out of my mouth and made it on a "Porsche Discussion" board. Don't get me wrong the board is a great place for exchanging info., but you must also be careful. Someone could just as easily log on to a medical discussion board and post their .02 there, all the while having non meds reading it and taking the info for the written word.
Steve, I thank you for posting your reply, but had this person put ALL of our conversation on the post you would not have had to waste your time. Most everything you posted I had discussed with him in our phone call.
Kevin Kelly</strong><hr></blockquote>
Kevin -
What words did I put in your mouth and what words were left out? I reviewed the thread here and it covers our entire conversation no more and no less. I do not rely 100% on a single source for information and therefore made the oroginal post for a sanity check regarding what you told me over the phone since I have not had any first hand experience dealing with you/ANDIAL. It is also possible that the customers that ANDIAL services does not represent a prefect cross-section of typical Porsche owners and this would also be a good reason for the post.
Since the board is a public forum and ANDIAL in is in the customer service business, it is really a good idea to suggest that I have wasted someone else's time with this thread?
Bond
07-20-2002, 01:40 PM
#21
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[quote]Originally posted by Bond:
<strong>Kevin, Since the board is a public forum and ANDIAL in is in the customer service business, it is really a good idea to suggest that I have wasted someone else's time with this thread?
Bond</strong><hr></blockquote>
Bond,
I can easily see how this post may bother Kevin a little, since the phrasing of your original post seems to indicate that Kevin (and perhaps Andial in general) is very concerned about this issue.
The overall tone of your post is a bit alarmist, which is fine except that it indirectly appears to be originating with Kevin. You've always got to be extra careful when quoting another individual, to make sure you do so in the proper context.
You're not in the journalism biz by chance?
That industry thrives on sensationalizing an issue and printing quotes out of context.
<strong>Kevin, Since the board is a public forum and ANDIAL in is in the customer service business, it is really a good idea to suggest that I have wasted someone else's time with this thread?
Bond</strong><hr></blockquote>
Bond,
I can easily see how this post may bother Kevin a little, since the phrasing of your original post seems to indicate that Kevin (and perhaps Andial in general) is very concerned about this issue.
The overall tone of your post is a bit alarmist, which is fine except that it indirectly appears to be originating with Kevin. You've always got to be extra careful when quoting another individual, to make sure you do so in the proper context.
You're not in the journalism biz by chance?
That industry thrives on sensationalizing an issue and printing quotes out of context.
07-20-2002, 04:30 PM
#22
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Kim,
I agree. It's pretty interesting to see someone shvitzing so hard about a remotely potential problem of questionable consequence on a car they don't even own. IMO, Bond is over-analyzing the whole sports car purchase decision. I would have sold our 2002 E46 M3 ages ago if I bought into the self-destructing engine hype. Instead, I've fully enjoyed revving and wringing the heck out of it for the past 8,000 miles. I don't doubt that an engine failure could happen, but you can't spend your life worrying about such remote possibilities. "If you break it, they (mechanics, parts, a solution) will come".
As Steve reiterated, 993's are as close to bulletproof as sports cars come. I've yet to see one suffer a significant mechanical failure at a track day, and that's a pretty tough test of a car's durability.
I agree. It's pretty interesting to see someone shvitzing so hard about a remotely potential problem of questionable consequence on a car they don't even own. IMO, Bond is over-analyzing the whole sports car purchase decision. I would have sold our 2002 E46 M3 ages ago if I bought into the self-destructing engine hype. Instead, I've fully enjoyed revving and wringing the heck out of it for the past 8,000 miles. I don't doubt that an engine failure could happen, but you can't spend your life worrying about such remote possibilities. "If you break it, they (mechanics, parts, a solution) will come".
As Steve reiterated, 993's are as close to bulletproof as sports cars come. I've yet to see one suffer a significant mechanical failure at a track day, and that's a pretty tough test of a car's durability.
07-20-2002, 04:58 PM
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[quote]Originally posted by Anir:
<strong>
Bond,
I can easily see how this post may bother Kevin a little, since the phrasing of your original post seems to indicate that Kevin (and perhaps Andial in general) is very concerned about this issue.
The overall tone of your post is a bit alarmist, which is fine except that it indirectly appears to be originating with Kevin. You've always got to be extra careful when quoting another individual, to make sure you do so in the proper context.
You're not in the journalism biz by chance? That industry thrives on sensationalizing an issue and printing quotes out of context.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well, I AM in advertising and my work is known to being results, in this case 24 replies.
I suppose for a 993tt owner to wake up each morning and see new posts from me like "rod bearing failures" and "Valve Guide Issues" stirs them up a bit. Anyhow, thanks to everyone for the input.
Bond
<strong>
Bond,
I can easily see how this post may bother Kevin a little, since the phrasing of your original post seems to indicate that Kevin (and perhaps Andial in general) is very concerned about this issue.
The overall tone of your post is a bit alarmist, which is fine except that it indirectly appears to be originating with Kevin. You've always got to be extra careful when quoting another individual, to make sure you do so in the proper context.
You're not in the journalism biz by chance?
That industry thrives on sensationalizing an issue and printing quotes out of context.</strong><hr></blockquote>Well, I AM in advertising and my work is known to being results, in this case 24 replies.
I suppose for a 993tt owner to wake up each morning and see new posts from me like "rod bearing failures" and "Valve Guide Issues" stirs them up a bit. Anyhow, thanks to everyone for the input.
Bond
07-20-2002, 10:33 PM
#24
RL Technical Advisor
[quote]Originally posted by Bond:
<strong>
(snip)
I suppose for a 993tt owner to wake up each morning and see new posts from me like "rod bearing failures" and "Valve Guide Issues" stirs them up a bit. Anyhow, thanks to everyone for the input.
Bond</strong><hr></blockquote>
Hi Bond:
Internet boards such as these, (and others) do provide a superb vehicle for things to taken out of context and a venue for loads of misinformation. Its a two-edged sword and I don't always believe what I read,...
Many things get overblown and generate a misplaced sense of paranoia about problems that are simply a non-issue, when viewed on a global scale.
Keeping a sense of perspective is the key point here and one should always consider the source when deciding what you read here, as well as any other place, has any merit or not.
Just my opinion but almost ALL Porsches have had issues; some being more than others, however on balance they are all very well engineered and solid cars. One can hardly go wrong with any air-cooled 911 that you might consider.
LOL,..there's even some water-cooled ones that are great, too...
<strong>
(snip)
I suppose for a 993tt owner to wake up each morning and see new posts from me like "rod bearing failures" and "Valve Guide Issues" stirs them up a bit. Anyhow, thanks to everyone for the input.
Bond</strong><hr></blockquote>
Hi Bond:
Internet boards such as these, (and others) do provide a superb vehicle for things to taken out of context and a venue for loads of misinformation. Its a two-edged sword and I don't always believe what I read,...
Many things get overblown and generate a misplaced sense of paranoia about problems that are simply a non-issue, when viewed on a global scale.
Keeping a sense of perspective is the key point here and one should always consider the source when deciding what you read here, as well as any other place, has any merit or not.
Just my opinion but almost ALL Porsches have had issues; some being more than others, however on balance they are all very well engineered and solid cars. One can hardly go wrong with any air-cooled 911 that you might consider.
LOL,..there's even some water-cooled ones that are great, too...
07-22-2002, 06:51 PM
#25
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Bond,
I am certain you intentions are noble, but your quoting Kevin puts him in a delicate position. He does not own Andial, he is employed there as a technician, a master technican at that. Time he spnds talking to you is time away from working on MY car. And when the "meter is running, we don't want Kevin on the phone, we want him doing his magic
.
Let me suggest, if you want Andial's "official" position on an issue, talk to Dieter
. And knowing Dieter, he will not spend much time with you, unless you will be spending money at Andial. This money will be used to pay the bills, wages, keep the lights on etc .
As far as the TT goes, it is a great car with incredible performance. Yes you may replace the valve guides at some point in time...but anybody that can $75,000 + on a used high performance car, must expect a little maintenance now and then <img src="graemlins/bigok.gif" border="0" alt="[thumbsup]" /> .
I am certain you intentions are noble, but your quoting Kevin puts him in a delicate position. He does not own Andial, he is employed there as a technician, a master technican at that. Time he spnds talking to you is time away from working on MY car. And when the "meter is running, we don't want Kevin on the phone, we want him doing his magic
.Let me suggest, if you want Andial's "official" position on an issue, talk to Dieter
. And knowing Dieter, he will not spend much time with you, unless you will be spending money at Andial. This money will be used to pay the bills, wages, keep the lights on etc .As far as the TT goes, it is a great car with incredible performance. Yes you may replace the valve guides at some point in time...but anybody that can $75,000 + on a used high performance car, must expect a little maintenance now and then <img src="graemlins/bigok.gif" border="0" alt="[thumbsup]" /> .
