Stock intercooler size?
02-03-2005, 05:00 AM
#1
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Stock intercooler size?
Can someone tell me how thick the stock intercooler is? Is it based on a 3.5" core?
I noticed something interesting today. After driving home and parking the car in the garage, I let it sit with the engine off for a few minutes before heading to the back and touching the intercooler. To my surprised, the intercooler was cool to the touch (wasn't even slightly warm)!
I also have a STI, and when I had the stock top mount intercooler, it would always get heat soaked when I park the car... and when you combine this with poor ECU logic and 91 octane fuel, you get lots-o-knock until the intercooler cools off. The problem finally went away when I replaced the top mount with a giant front mount.
Anyway, summary: thickness of the stock intercooler and am surprised it doesn't seem to suffer from the common top mount problems.
I noticed something interesting today. After driving home and parking the car in the garage, I let it sit with the engine off for a few minutes before heading to the back and touching the intercooler. To my surprised, the intercooler was cool to the touch (wasn't even slightly warm)!
I also have a STI, and when I had the stock top mount intercooler, it would always get heat soaked when I park the car... and when you combine this with poor ECU logic and 91 octane fuel, you get lots-o-knock until the intercooler cools off. The problem finally went away when I replaced the top mount with a giant front mount.
Anyway, summary: thickness of the stock intercooler and am surprised it doesn't seem to suffer from the common top mount problems.
02-03-2005, 12:22 PM
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Hatchy,
I cannot tell you the thickness as I do not have access to my car now, however Just like to mention that there is much more than the thickness in an intercooler that will make a difference in heat soak especially if you are comparing between two different cars that run different turbos, intercooler placement, etc...
IMHO the engine temperature play a big role, depending how your turbos are running with respect to their efficiency, or in which condition your engine is (checked through a leak down test for instance), the health of your valve springs, the usage before you shut down ( coming from a spirited drive or traffic), etc... I don't know if the Subaru is water cooled, but if it is , then the engine will be running tyically slightly cooler than the oil cooled engine as oil heats up more than water..
As far as intercooler core, there is much more than the thickness of it.. A big core length X width is typically better cooling than a thick and smaller one, as there is more area in contact with air. However you don't want a too large intercooler on a stock turbo or vice versa, they need to be in sync, whether the design is front to back or side to side has an impact, typically on our cars a side to side is better as it keeps the charge in the core for longer, the design and flow of the tanks, the quality of the fins, etc..Porsche 993TT I/Cs are VERY good.
Maybe on your STI the AFRs were out of shape?
I cannot tell you the thickness as I do not have access to my car now, however Just like to mention that there is much more than the thickness in an intercooler that will make a difference in heat soak especially if you are comparing between two different cars that run different turbos, intercooler placement, etc...
IMHO the engine temperature play a big role, depending how your turbos are running with respect to their efficiency, or in which condition your engine is (checked through a leak down test for instance), the health of your valve springs, the usage before you shut down ( coming from a spirited drive or traffic), etc... I don't know if the Subaru is water cooled, but if it is , then the engine will be running tyically slightly cooler than the oil cooled engine as oil heats up more than water..
As far as intercooler core, there is much more than the thickness of it.. A big core length X width is typically better cooling than a thick and smaller one, as there is more area in contact with air. However you don't want a too large intercooler on a stock turbo or vice versa, they need to be in sync, whether the design is front to back or side to side has an impact, typically on our cars a side to side is better as it keeps the charge in the core for longer, the design and flow of the tanks, the quality of the fins, etc..Porsche 993TT I/Cs are VERY good.
Maybe on your STI the AFRs were out of shape?
02-03-2005, 12:58 PM
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Hey Jean,
I am asking about the size (thickness) to see if my intercooler on the 993TT is stock or not. The end tanks appear to have a porsche part number in the casting, but the core looks different than what I can remember from other 993TTs.
I agree, intercooler selection is more than just size. You would want something that gives you enough contact time without being too restrictive.
The STI suffers from a placement problem and size problem. The intercooler sits right on top of the motor at the back of the engine bay. Heat v1.0 still rises.
As long as the car is moving, its fine. But as soon as you stop and park (to get a cup of coffee, for example), when you come back, the intercooler is hot to the touch. IAT for the first few minutes is high (150-180F) and the motor starts to ping. The AFR looks okay (around stoich--not on boost, low rpm, very little load) and I don't see the ECU dumping fuel when it pings, either (I have a wide band AFR meter on the STI).
I was thinking about building a intercooler sprayer for the TT (which is was kind lead up to this), and was really surprised how cool the intercooler was!
I am asking about the size (thickness) to see if my intercooler on the 993TT is stock or not. The end tanks appear to have a porsche part number in the casting, but the core looks different than what I can remember from other 993TTs.
I agree, intercooler selection is more than just size. You would want something that gives you enough contact time without being too restrictive.
The STI suffers from a placement problem and size problem. The intercooler sits right on top of the motor at the back of the engine bay. Heat v1.0 still rises.
As long as the car is moving, its fine. But as soon as you stop and park (to get a cup of coffee, for example), when you come back, the intercooler is hot to the touch. IAT for the first few minutes is high (150-180F) and the motor starts to ping. The AFR looks okay (around stoich--not on boost, low rpm, very little load) and I don't see the ECU dumping fuel when it pings, either (I have a wide band AFR meter on the STI). I was thinking about building a intercooler sprayer for the TT (which is was kind lead up to this), and was really surprised how cool the intercooler was!
02-03-2005, 04:52 PM
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Hatchy
I have read from Kevin before that the water spray or Nitrogen provides good results.
Your temps seem too high on the STI, I am not too familiar with Fahrenheit but if you are cruising off boost and seeing these temps, then your I/C has a very poor thermal efficiency or your engine is not running properly as the temperature the turbos put out is aorund 40-45 C (110F) while the temps you are seeing are higher rather than lower.
On full boost, you might see initially some high temps as the heat that the turbos generate is close to 80 degrees C (175F) but you should soon see them dropping to less than 110 F with an efficient I/C, provided your turbos are running within their right range and the I/C is properly matched. Keep boost for too long and things will change.
To cut a long story short, if your STI is seeing those temps off boost, either their I/C is not good at all or the engine needs a serious check up. I do not have first hand experience in this, it is just based on reading and research, so I might be wrong.
I have read from Kevin before that the water spray or Nitrogen provides good results.
Your temps seem too high on the STI, I am not too familiar with Fahrenheit but if you are cruising off boost and seeing these temps, then your I/C has a very poor thermal efficiency or your engine is not running properly as the temperature the turbos put out is aorund 40-45 C (110F) while the temps you are seeing are higher rather than lower.
On full boost, you might see initially some high temps as the heat that the turbos generate is close to 80 degrees C (175F) but you should soon see them dropping to less than 110 F with an efficient I/C, provided your turbos are running within their right range and the I/C is properly matched. Keep boost for too long and things will change.
To cut a long story short, if your STI is seeing those temps off boost, either their I/C is not good at all or the engine needs a serious check up. I do not have first hand experience in this, it is just based on reading and research, so I might be wrong.
02-04-2005, 02:46 PM
#7
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Hatchy,
I know that Andial does an upgrade to the stock intercooler that uses the stock end plates, but a thicker core. It looks stock, unless you see a skinny stock one side-by-side. If so... you are a lucky dog, this upgrade is supposed to be pretty nice.
I know that Andial does an upgrade to the stock intercooler that uses the stock end plates, but a thicker core. It looks stock, unless you see a skinny stock one side-by-side. If so... you are a lucky dog, this upgrade is supposed to be pretty nice.
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02-04-2005, 06:49 PM
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Andial IC
Here is a pic of the Andial IC. Since they use a thicker/denser core and stock end tanks, notice that the core is thicker than the end tanks, making it necessary to cut part of the IC shroud opening so that it has no "lips" anymore.
HTH,
HTH,
Last edited by PramTT; 02-04-2005 at 09:15 PM.
