Engine braking?
10-07-2017, 10:38 AM
#1
Race Car
Thread Starter
Engine braking?
Noted what I thought to be an odd thread on the 993 forum extolling the dangers of engine braking, suggesting "brakes are cheaper than clutches". I've spent my whole driving life executing rev matched downshifts and only gone through one clutch. That took 86,000 miles. Is not one of the main reasons for a manual, rev matched downshifts and when necessary heel and toeing?....or am I missing something here?
Last edited by ronnie993tt; 10-08-2017 at 11:34 AM.
10-07-2017, 11:58 AM
#2
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No, you're not. Most others in this day are. Yeah, ya not going to throw it in 2nd at 80 mph.... If it's an AT, is does it without much human input. I've always used the whole car. Use the engine to brake, use throttle to set suspension, bracing for dibit. I think uncommon sense/courtesy need to be common again. Then there'd be a bit less questions on sensible issues.
Aloha brah :-)
Aloha brah :-)
10-08-2017, 10:12 AM
#3
Race Director
Impressive that you perfectly rev match every single downshift. i'm a pretty proficient manual transmission user and I don't get it perfect every time.
Nevertheless, every time you release the clutch pedal, you are theoretically causing tiny bits of wear.
Bottom line, there is really no reason to do this when say approaching a light. The brakes are perfectly sufficient.
Then again, this is a car for fun, so if this is fun for you, have at it.
Nevertheless, every time you release the clutch pedal, you are theoretically causing tiny bits of wear.
Bottom line, there is really no reason to do this when say approaching a light. The brakes are perfectly sufficient.
Then again, this is a car for fun, so if this is fun for you, have at it.
10-08-2017, 02:37 PM
#4
Rennlist Member
I have a lot less experience than you track guys - Wild guess I can heel toe match close to perfect 65% but one thing for sure the more aggressive you drive the easier it gets. General rev matching (no brake) probably higher rate of accuracy. Click and Clack seemed to say just use the brake. Scion Xb I drove was the easiest to heel toe, e36 m3, then the TJ jeep (super fun engine and transmission), 993 Turbo probably the most awkward seat and pedal orientation for me.
ETA - Focus RS is kind of a pain to heal toe. Gas pedal is to low, even with spacer, and it never seems to slip into gear like I would expect.
ETA - Focus RS is kind of a pain to heal toe. Gas pedal is to low, even with spacer, and it never seems to slip into gear like I would expect.
10-08-2017, 10:17 PM
#5
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Impressive that you perfectly rev match every single downshift. i'm a pretty proficient manual transmission user and I don't get it perfect every time.
Nevertheless, every time you release the clutch pedal, you are theoretically causing tiny bits of wear.
Bottom line, there is really no reason to do this when say approaching a light. The brakes are perfectly sufficient.
Then again, this is a car for fun, so if this is fun for you, have at it.
Nevertheless, every time you release the clutch pedal, you are theoretically causing tiny bits of wear.
Bottom line, there is really no reason to do this when say approaching a light. The brakes are perfectly sufficient.
Then again, this is a car for fun, so if this is fun for you, have at it.
10-09-2017, 04:57 PM
#6
Race Director
Not sure who ya were referring to being perfect. I know I'm not, never have been. Just relaying that downshifting properly, will not impose premature wear. Yes it may cause wear on opposite sides of gears, but doubt it diminishes integrity, over not properly downshifting.
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10-10-2017, 02:46 PM
#8
Rennlist Member
You are correct. OP - I down shift a fair amount - but I think it does wear out piston seals like any other car. I hate brake dust so I down shift all the time and am prepared to expect an engine rebuild someday.
Like any other car I would just use brakes and not use engine compression to slow the car down if you are concerned. Go into neutral. But I don't believe it to be terrible to use engine braking. I have heard stories of rotary engines where its "just so bad to do" oil issues.
I down shift in gear all the time. I'm not worrying about it. Part of the fun of enjoying such a great car.
Like any other car I would just use brakes and not use engine compression to slow the car down if you are concerned. Go into neutral. But I don't believe it to be terrible to use engine braking. I have heard stories of rotary engines where its "just so bad to do" oil issues.
I down shift in gear all the time. I'm not worrying about it. Part of the fun of enjoying such a great car.
10-18-2017, 02:38 PM
#10
Race Car
Thread Starter
After 40 years of rev matching a 4 speed (large rev match gap) I find the tt 6 speed (small rev gap) extremely easy to execute well and buckets of fun. Even if I thought it resulted in clutch or engine wear I'd still do it. If you're not going to rev match downshift and H & T, might as well get an automatic.