'97 993 Carrera Coupe (Tip)...potentially our first pre-owned Porsche ever...
06-08-2017, 06:27 PM
#16
Instructor
Maybe what the PPI place meant was that they didn't do a "leak down" as part of the PPI. That doesn't mean they wouldn't check for leaks, but that they wouldn't perform a leak down test which is a totally unrelated thing. Some PPI do cylinder compression and leak down to test the engine health.
Price seems high to me for a tip, even with low mileage so I would definitely negotiate a bit. Maybe you can find other cars with similar mileage and tip to compare and use that in negotiations.
Good luck in your quest, you and your dad should have a blast on that road trip.
Price seems high to me for a tip, even with low mileage so I would definitely negotiate a bit. Maybe you can find other cars with similar mileage and tip to compare and use that in negotiations.
Good luck in your quest, you and your dad should have a blast on that road trip.
06-12-2017, 02:43 PM
#18
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Have someone who owns a 993 drive it for you as all sorts of engine, transmission, suspension and other issues will be readily apparent to one who knows how the car should drive. With that number of miles and that it is 19 or so years old you will see some issues related to age if not miles, things like steering rack leaks, window switches that crack internally and need to be fixed or replaced. The Nice thing is the car should be a long way from any major driveline or internal engine work.
As I work on my car and have discussions with others I have compiled a list of items you may run across, some in the distant future. As others will tell you these are opinions of a non-professional so review the document in the context of others opinions here:
As I work on my car and have discussions with others I have compiled a list of items you may run across, some in the distant future. As others will tell you these are opinions of a non-professional so review the document in the context of others opinions here:
06-12-2017, 05:56 PM
#19
Maybe what the PPI place meant was that they didn't do a "leak down" as part of the PPI. That doesn't mean they wouldn't check for leaks, but that they wouldn't perform a leak down test which is a totally unrelated thing. Some PPI do cylinder compression and leak down to test the engine health.
Price seems high to me for a tip, even with low mileage so I would definitely negotiate a bit. Maybe you can find other cars with similar mileage and tip to compare and use that in negotiations.
Good luck in your quest, you and your dad should have a blast on that road trip.
Price seems high to me for a tip, even with low mileage so I would definitely negotiate a bit. Maybe you can find other cars with similar mileage and tip to compare and use that in negotiations.
Good luck in your quest, you and your dad should have a blast on that road trip.
To add to the good advice: since you're looking at a '97, which is an OBD-II car, you'll want the PPI to check for any codes related to the Secondary Air Injection system (SAI).
Lots of threads on this topic on the forum, but the skinny is it's a system that pumps fresh air through a series of valves into passages in the heads where they meet with the exhaust ports. This allows more fresh air to the catalytic converter during the warmup period, which reduces cold start emissions. On the '96 and '97 cars, a failure in this system will trigger a Check Engine Light (CEL), and this will definitely fail a CA smog check.
Common failure points are the valves (1-way/check and diverter), and the head passages themselves. Replacement of the valves is finicky but not impossible, while the head passages can be cleaned out by abrasive cable (the so-called "roto rooter method"). Some shops will recommend a full head refurbish to clear these passages, but unless the car also exhibits excessive oil consumption, I would go with the roto rooter route first.
Unscrupulous owners may have tried to hide the problem by disabling the CEL - make sure the PPI checks for a properly functioning CEL.
Lots of threads on this topic on the forum, but the skinny is it's a system that pumps fresh air through a series of valves into passages in the heads where they meet with the exhaust ports. This allows more fresh air to the catalytic converter during the warmup period, which reduces cold start emissions. On the '96 and '97 cars, a failure in this system will trigger a Check Engine Light (CEL), and this will definitely fail a CA smog check.
Common failure points are the valves (1-way/check and diverter), and the head passages themselves. Replacement of the valves is finicky but not impossible, while the head passages can be cleaned out by abrasive cable (the so-called "roto rooter method"). Some shops will recommend a full head refurbish to clear these passages, but unless the car also exhibits excessive oil consumption, I would go with the roto rooter route first.
Unscrupulous owners may have tried to hide the problem by disabling the CEL - make sure the PPI checks for a properly functioning CEL.
More random thoughts:
If the PPI'er is familiar with 993's they should know this, but just in case, make sure they check for any creaking or movement at the door stop "strap" when the doors - particularly the driver's - are fully extended open. The attachment of the strap inside the door on some cars is prone to weaken and break if the door is flung open too hard and too many times. Fixable but definitely not easy or cheap.
Also, if it were me, I'd try calling the dealer in IL who sold it previously. If they are reasonable folk they might have some info for you. Moreover, if the sale was within the last year or two (for less than $40K!) you will want to know that. $20K+ is a big step up - unless the sale was 2010 - 2013.
If the PPI'er is familiar with 993's they should know this, but just in case, make sure they check for any creaking or movement at the door stop "strap" when the doors - particularly the driver's - are fully extended open. The attachment of the strap inside the door on some cars is prone to weaken and break if the door is flung open too hard and too many times. Fixable but definitely not easy or cheap.
Also, if it were me, I'd try calling the dealer in IL who sold it previously. If they are reasonable folk they might have some info for you. Moreover, if the sale was within the last year or two (for less than $40K!) you will want to know that. $20K+ is a big step up - unless the sale was 2010 - 2013.
Ok fellas, PPI at Goldcrest was just completed. Mike over there has been awesome to deal with along with the Mike at Hennessy Porsche. Mike (at Goldcrest) joked that the lot attendant that dropped the car off said it drove beautifully and just had one issue, missing a pedal hehe.
Mike thinks that for its age the condition is fantastic, really really great. The only thing he said that should be done prior to purchase is replacing all 6 front control arm bushings as indicated on the PPI. He checked the door arm swings and said that they were in great condition. Also said no need for a leak down test, no signs of any issues there.
Post-purchase, we are looking at replacing the radio to the Porsche Classic Radio with Nav, removing the tint, and putting back on the original Porsche springs as the car is sitting lowered on H&R springs which we aren't a fan of. The labor shouldn't be too bad on it since the car will need to be lifted and re-aligned anyways after the front control arm bushings.
My dad wants to pull the trigger, and I am thinking of offering $55,000 for the car. The car has likely been sitting at Hennessy for awhile, what do you guys think? Any and all input is greatly appreciated. I do know that my dad really, really likes the car and we don't want to lose this due to a couple thousand more in asking price. Thanks all - you guys have been a huge help.
06-12-2017, 07:27 PM
#20
Rennlist Member
If it were me, I would have a chat with ^^New911 before pulling the trigger. Don't know if he's serious or what he's got. But, best to know all your options... A wide body is certainly more intriguing than NB...
All the same procedures suggested above would apply.
Good luck!
All the same procedures suggested above would apply.
Good luck!
06-12-2017, 07:32 PM
#21
If it were me, I would have a chat with ^^New911 before pulling the trigger. Don't know if he's serious or what he's got. But, best to know all your options... A wide body is certainly more intriguing than NB...
All the same procedures suggested above would apply.
Good luck!
All the same procedures suggested above would apply.
Good luck!
06-12-2017, 07:53 PM
#22
New911 got back to me just now and I personally love his C2S build but after talking with my old man he is saying that he really wants a NB C2 and as close to OEM as possible (he must not be thinking straight, I am head over heels for the 993 C2S).