Jason @ Paragon Products

I'm not aware of any potential design changes at this point.

Bill Verburg

JMO but you can't beat Bilsteins, HD are good, Cup are terrific, both are available w/ all the thread you could ever ask for though Cups are threaded further down and are the way to go for a track car.

Ed Hughes

I think the other key factor, which we'll learn in the future- based on the fact many are going the Koni route, is the durability of the FSD'S.

Magdaddy

interesting analysis...

I bought my C4S with a fresh install of the H&R super sport set up, essentially custom valved HD's, with larger 3 way adjustable sways. The po tracked the car, and had it set to his liking.

For the first couple thousand miles the car felt great, but degraded constantly at the 4k mile mark. It tramlined horribly, and started to become fairly unpredictable. Watching the wear on the tires, it was obvious the alignment was pretty aggressive.

So, off to a very experienced shop, new rubber all around, Walrod bushings because the stock ones were cracked...as well as Wevo's to tighten up the rear. A less aggressive alignment and corner balance was done, for mostly street driving, but an occasional auto-x or DE wasn't out of the question.

The new alignment, Walrods, and Wevo's absolutely transformed the car. The car certainly can be rough over bad roads, and I do get some bump steer, but overall it's very compliant. I actually believe it rides on the highway, smoother than my wife's 2012 Mini Countryman with those awful run flats.

So, 26 months and 26K miles later...the car is an everyday joy. It is my DD during the "non" winter months here in Central New York. Ride quality is a very subjective thing as mentioned, so is performance. I for one think the H&R set up is a nice option.

Rinty

This one's more scenic:

Zed.

Thanks, it looks a tad higher than my ROW M030/Monroe setup from Gert as shown here. Sorry I didnt have a similar stance handy.

Bill Verburg

Most of the problems people have w/ their new shocks is inappropriate valving, adjustable shocks are one way to go but you really have to a lot of testing to get them right, most of the time they are wrong.

Try a car w/ properly configured digressive valves some time, it is an eye opening experience

the other issue is going too low w/o the RS wheel carriers and solid rear sidemounts. When the steering arm geometry is off the cars are a nightmare

JME66

Great topic - sorry to reply now that the thread has cooled down a bit. I am considering the ROW MO33+Koni FSD setup myself for my 95 NB C2 993. Anyone else have recent photos of this setup with 18" wheels. I am interested in seeing the drop in ride height and fender gap compared to the US stock ride height. Does anyone have the definitive part number for the lower ROW MO33 springs? I want to make sure i am getting the right ones. Do the stock swaybar links work with setup?

Are there any San Francisco Bay area 993 owners with this setup interested in a show & test ride?

CADguy

The RoW M033 is the sport height with comfort springs, right?

What do you think of the Koni FSDs paired with the RoW M030 (sport height, non comfort) springs? It might be a bit firmer and more responsive?

MACH993

I've been trying to tell you guys that the Koni's w/MO33s are an awesome ride! I don't get the debate.

CADguy

I'm not debating, just wondering if the M030s would be a little less comfort and a little more sporting (I have H&R springs now and they're brutal on bad roads, RR tracks, etc.).

Bill Verburg

Maybe you ought to be

it's not so much the spring rates as the type of valving in the shocks that causes a harsh ride.

Older shocks had linear valving which tends to harshness when used w/ stiff springs

modern shocks tend to use digressive valving which can be used w/very stiff springs and still provide a decent ride.

All the modern Bilsteins come w/ digressive valving all the the older designs w/ linear. If you have older mono tube shocks they can be redone to modern spec for a very reasonable cost, twin tubes cannot be rebuilt

callipygian 911

Bill, is there an easy way to tell if my Bilstein HDs have the linear or digressive valving by mere examination? I believe they were put in by the previous owner sometime in the past 2 or 3 years so I'm not sure.

CADguy

Thanks Bill.

Bill Verburg

As far as I know all Bilstein hd are linear from the factory, they are old school designs

Bilstein/H&R have further muddied the waters in that there are twin tube designs w/ crimped cans that are not rebuildable and mono tubes that are rebuildable, both are labeled hd

VE3-5277/5278 (late model HDs) can be revalved, as it is a a mono-tube inverted design. (like RSR/Cup struts?). The earlier model HDs, F4-V36-0385/0386, were double-tube like the RS units.

they do not revalve double-tube shocks, like the Euro RS units.

and further on some sets the front are mono-tube and the rear are twin-tube.

here is crimped can twin -tube shock, not rebuildable


rebuildable mono-tube