The Eagle

I want to upgrade my speakers:

Objective
• Keep the head unit Porsche CDR 210
• Keep the Nokia Amp
• Keep the Nokia rear speakers
• Replace front door speakers with a 2 component system

Installation environment:
• 1996 4S with Hifi-option (but no DSP) from factory
• Nokia amplifier 4 x 40 under passenger seat
• 3 component system Nokia in the doors and 2 coax Nokia speakers in the rear
• radio Porsche CDR 210

The 2 questions
• To replace the front door speakers with a 2 component system: what is the best choice?
Should I choose for a crossover or not, knowing that I will keep the Nokia Amp (is there a crossover in the amplifier?)
o 6.5-Inch 2-Way Component Speaker Kit - no crossover (ex. Focal IS 165)
o 6.5-Inch 2-Way Component Speaker Kit & crossover (ex. Focal Polyglass 165 BV)

• On which output wire do I connect the speakers & crossover?
o Front Woofer output wire or
o Front Mid & Tweeter output wire

TIA!


~ The Eagle ~
---------------------
'96 Polar Silver/Black C4S, manual, litronics, LED's in the positioning lights, alu/leather shifter & handbrake,
silver face gauges with alu rings, sport seats, full leather interior, motor sound airbox, stainless door sills,
valve caps Porsche crested brushed alloy, front protection bar, with split rear grill and layered with Meguiar's NXT Tech Wax
__________________
'92 Carrera 2 (Sold)
'89 Carrera 3.2 (Sold)

bart1

You have a lot of detail here, but I think you may not fully inderstand the HiFi setup. I would suggest consulting with Rob over at http://www.caraudioinnovations.com/pstereo.htm

Kika

I would highly recommend replacing the Nokia amp with something that will do your speakers justice.

Focal speakers need power to sound right.

I recommend running the amplifier full range and using the speaker crossover, do not use both.

Focals are good speakers, and a lot of people here have them. There are a lot of very good component speakers, including Boston Acoustics, Infinity, Diamond Audio, I also like Hertz speakers (same company that makes Audison Amps)

Sound is very objective, so you need to listen to them yourself and see what sounds the best to you, and the music you listen to. pretty much any of the higher end speakers will sound great.

DO NOT under estimate the importance of a good amplifier, not all power is created equally.
I am a huge fan of Lunar Amplifiers and recommend them. Made in the USA, baby! good solid clean power.

911Dave

The factory Nokia amp has a built-in crossover. I don't know if it can be bypassed without opening it up and doing surgery. Assuming you leave it alone, you do not want 2-way speakers that have their own crossovers. In that case I'd opt for the no-crossover Focal kit.

As for which speakers are "best", that is a question that can have no answer. Best is subjective. Choose the ones you like best. Almost any choice is going to be an improvement over the current Nokias in your doors, so don't agonize over this. My advice is to pick a set from a well known manufacturer of quality speakers that is in your price range and has the right spacing for the mounting holes.

Another bit of advice I'll offer....if you're intent on keeping the stock head unit and Nokia amp, I wouldn't go hog wild on speakers because the factory electronics aren't very good. You'll likely get so-so results no matter how good the speakers are. Especially considering you're going to keep the factory rear speakers! I recommend you upgrade all the speakers.

e9stibi

Get rid of the Nokia amp. It is a POS and will not get anything out of a good speaker. Forget the rear speakers too (you might drive them from the radio) and focus on the fronts that make the sound.

You might find some interesting information in my installation that I summarized here. You could easily install a 2 way system on the mounting bracket that I fabricated instead of going 3 way. Sound will be comparable:

https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...fi-option.html

If you go 2-way you just need to hide one pair of cross-overs which simplifies the process significantly because they fit under the hifi enclosure and are bolted to my mounting bracket which is made from plywood. You can safe the effort to hide the second pair under the driver seat.

Linnm

I use a McIntosh head unit with matching changer connected to 1 sub under hood and 2 behind rear seats along with MB Quarts in the usual places--Infinity high end tweeters--all selectively though 3 Alpine V12 amps. Sounds good.

The Eagle

@ 911Dave: that's exactly what I wanted to know; so no crossover. And I agree with you point of view; leaving the radio & amp stock and replacing the speakers will probably not change a whole lot in terms of "sound".

@ e9stibi: thanks, I've been reading your post over and over again , it's a very well written write-up, but I'm confused about the part "a DIN 8 pin female plug to build an adaptor from the grey DIN plug to RCA plugs for amp signal input". Which wires of the RCA plug are solded to which wire of the DIN 8 female plug?
Can I use the red wire # 10 of the Nokia plug as a 12 V connection for the Amp?

Tia!



~ The Eagle ~
---------------------
'96 Polar Silver/Black C4S, manual, litronics, LED's in the positioning lights, alu/leather shifter & handbrake,
silver face gauges with alu rings, sport seats, full leather interior, motor sound airbox, stainless door sills,
valve caps Porsche crested brushed alloy, front protection bar, with split rear grill and layered with Meguiar's NXT Tech Wax
__________________
'92 Carrera 2 (Sold)
'89 Carrera 3.2 (Sold)

EckFe1

AFAIK, the stock Nokia system uses 12 ohm for all the speakers. If you use aftermarket models which are always in the 4 or less ohm resistance, you'll overheat the stock amp in no time or blow it, either way, it won't work.
Best is to throw out all of it and upgrade with modern components. The CDR look can remain but you'll have sound quality issues even with all new speakers and amps.
Ed

The Eagle

@ EckFe1: thanks for your input. I've done some research it is confirmed what you're saying. So a new amp is the only way to go.


~ The Eagle ~
---------------------
'96 Polar Silver/Black C4S, manual, litronics, LED's in the positioning lights, alu/leather shifter & handbrake,
silver face gauges with alu rings, sport seats, full leather interior, motor sound airbox, stainless door sills,
valve caps Porsche crested brushed alloy, front protection bar, with split rear grill and layered with Meguiar's NXT Tech Wax
__________________
'92 Carrera 2 (Sold)
'89 Carrera 3.2 (Sold)

Kika

Eagle: I think your question is for e9stibi regarding pin-out.

With respect to the OEM headunit, The Becker actually has a pretty decent tuner. I upgraded to the CDR-220 as I mostly listen to either the radio or my iPod. When I am connected to my iPod, the headunit is just passing signals through to the amp. As a tuner, it is decent, as long as I tune to a reasonably strong signal, but around town, that is usually the case. Out on the highway away from town, I just switch over to the iPod anyway. Plus it retains the factory look.

I don't have any experience with the Nokia amp, as I did not have hifi, but I doubt it compares to anything currently on the market.

My Nokia speakers were shot just from age, the paper was simply dried out and cracking, which no matter what will sound awful.

In summary, if you primarily listen to the radio, the CDR-210 isn't all that bad, but it doesn't lend itself to connecting to an iPod easily, so I would recommend going to a CDR-220 or another aftermarket unit.

definitely replace the amp and speakers.
search the archives, there are lots of really nice installations that RLers have done. first off, set your budget, like anything else, it CAN get $$$$$$ (McIntosh stuff)

with regards to Amps: a lot of RLers like Audison, which Rod Birch (audio innovations) likes. I believe it is because they fit well into Porsches. I like the US built amps as previously stated. I used to be a big Rockford Fosgate fan when they were made in the US, but now they are made in China with lower quality components. Be careful with the Audison amps, only their high end line is made in Italy still, their lower end stuff is made in China also.

M. Schneider

Not So Fast . . . . . . .
Audio Signal Processing. (think of the line from the '67 movie the Graduate. "Plastics!")
Digital Signal Processing (DSP) is expanding in performance and scope by the minute.

In a few weeks I'll have a Mosconi 120.4 DSP amp module with the stock CDR210 to drive it.
Enhancement just got easier... DSP affords herculean signal processing. Hand me the EQ and Time alignment please. Oh and lets add a dose of compression right here . . . and all from your PC screen.

Here's a link: http://www.mosconi.org/one120_4_DSP.html

I'll be in Germany in a few weeks with the above DSP module authors. Stay tuned.

matt777

Good 4x6's in the back shelf will be an improvement over factory sound too providing you have an amp to run them. However, in the long run, you may realize you need proper rear subs for decent sound (like the ones from Audio Innovation) and you will need an good amp for them too. The last time I listened to Focal door speakers, the top of the line (expensive) ones were great.

Kika

WOW, that looks like some nice audio equipment! kinda like being able to fine tune your suspension, but for your audio environment, source, speakers and ears. I don't think I want to know how much that stuff costs.

bart1

Alpine has the IMPRINT system:

http://www.alpine-usa.com/product/view/pxa-h100/

M. Schneider

Its not pricey... and when the Plug N Play aspect is factored in .... Screw all those metrics. In the end the control over the audio output is light years beyond
a 31 band ISO EQ, etc. (UREI) That and the Gawd dam DSPs are quiet, ***** on phase shift neutral. Think it was something in the range of 108db A weighted across the band width some of these new DSP chip sets. And did I mention there reasonable at $600+ USD or so and getting cheaper by the minute.

Ok, Okay, Okay. I'm stepping off the soap box,,,, for now. All the best, M/S