Tranmission Goodness. Problem(s) solved.
05-02-2010, 02:09 PM
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Tranmission Goodness. Problem(s) solved.
Background
I bought my 96 Carrera two months ago and have been sorting it out. Special thanks to Rennlist, Darin F, Chris W, Steve Weiner and others for helping fuel my air cooled crack addiction. When I bought the car I knew it had problems with the clutch. Then I had it out on the track a month ago and had a minor offie which resulted in problems shifting into 2, 4 and 6.
Symptoms
1. Crunchy, notchy, squishy at the bottom of the clutch.
2. Resistance shifting into the even gears (2, 4, 6). 1, 3, 5 and Reverse are fine. Once in gear the car drives fine.
Problem Hypotheses
1. Bad clutch slave. Bad master cylinder. Bad throw out fork. Pressure plate not releasing.
2. Bad shift linkage. Bad engine mounts. Bent shifter fork. Foreign material inside transmission case.
Solution
Take it all apart and see what's wrong!!
Thanks to the numerous Rennlisters that have posted answers to questions or procedures. Both helped me tremendously yesterday. (Surprisingly, it's faster to search Rennlist than to flip through the 993 Service Manual). There are several well documented transmission drop procedures so I won't repeat that. However, I did take a lot of pictures and I'll post some in the hopes it educates someone in the future.
Pictures to follow.
I bought my 96 Carrera two months ago and have been sorting it out. Special thanks to Rennlist, Darin F, Chris W, Steve Weiner and others for helping fuel my air cooled crack addiction. When I bought the car I knew it had problems with the clutch. Then I had it out on the track a month ago and had a minor offie which resulted in problems shifting into 2, 4 and 6.
Symptoms
1. Crunchy, notchy, squishy at the bottom of the clutch.
2. Resistance shifting into the even gears (2, 4, 6). 1, 3, 5 and Reverse are fine. Once in gear the car drives fine.
Problem Hypotheses
1. Bad clutch slave. Bad master cylinder. Bad throw out fork. Pressure plate not releasing.
2. Bad shift linkage. Bad engine mounts. Bent shifter fork. Foreign material inside transmission case.
Solution
Take it all apart and see what's wrong!!
Thanks to the numerous Rennlisters that have posted answers to questions or procedures. Both helped me tremendously yesterday. (Surprisingly, it's faster to search Rennlist than to flip through the 993 Service Manual). There are several well documented transmission drop procedures so I won't repeat that. However, I did take a lot of pictures and I'll post some in the hopes it educates someone in the future.
Pictures to follow.
05-02-2010, 02:46 PM
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I met my friend Gabor 5 years ago when I bought my Audi A8. He spent a year researching why the D2 prefacelift transmissions sucked so bad. Needless to say, he figured it out and I had him rebuild my transmission. Happy ever since. Along the way Gabor made friends with a local transmission shop and started working out of Trans Fixed Transmission in Rolling Meadows, IL. Great guys and I highly recommend them for any transmission work.
So, he was my first call when I had transmission issues. He had never worked on Porsche before but as he says it's just nuts and bolts.
We started yesterday at 10am and finished at a little past midnight. I'm tired and sore. Don't know how those guys stand for 8-10 hours a day. Ugh.
First things first. Having the right tools go a long way. I think we've all been laying on the garage floor wishing you had that additional extra long 10 mm open box end wrench. Then getting up to run to Sears half covered in grease. All those big prybars, flexible sockets, air tools, industrial strength fluids. Cheating!
God bless those of you who drop the transmission while on jack stands in your own garage. That's an exercise in patience and some true skills.
Put the car on a lift and you can easily see all the flaws.
Torn CV boot
And the goodness.
Brand new Fister Stage 3 muffler
Shift Couple thingamajiggy. Make sure it is cleaned and lubed. Mine had dried out and was very dirty.
Slave cylinder. I don't understand why people have such a difficult time swapping it out. It's right in front of you! Pretty easy when the tranny is out of the way. Be careful when you disconnect it, fluid will be running down your arm. Bled it with some sort of power bleeder, we tried to do it by hand and it took forever. Picture this: 11:30 at night, me in the car 6 feet up in the air. Uncomfortably, laying upside down in the drivers seat so I can pump the clutch by hand. Tried to do it with my feet but the clutch would go straight to the floor and I had trouble prying it up. No way to adjust the drivers seat because the battery was disconnected. Thank goodness we found a power bleeder stashed in a cabinet, otherwise we might still be there.
Here's a picture of a broken shift coupler bushing. Darin, I need that SSK!
More to come....
I met my friend Gabor 5 years ago when I bought my Audi A8. He spent a year researching why the D2 prefacelift transmissions sucked so bad. Needless to say, he figured it out and I had him rebuild my transmission. Happy ever since. Along the way Gabor made friends with a local transmission shop and started working out of Trans Fixed Transmission in Rolling Meadows, IL. Great guys and I highly recommend them for any transmission work.
So, he was my first call when I had transmission issues. He had never worked on Porsche before but as he says it's just nuts and bolts.
We started yesterday at 10am and finished at a little past midnight. I'm tired and sore. Don't know how those guys stand for 8-10 hours a day. Ugh.
First things first. Having the right tools go a long way. I think we've all been laying on the garage floor wishing you had that additional extra long 10 mm open box end wrench. Then getting up to run to Sears half covered in grease. All those big prybars, flexible sockets, air tools, industrial strength fluids. Cheating!
God bless those of you who drop the transmission while on jack stands in your own garage. That's an exercise in patience and some true skills.
Put the car on a lift and you can easily see all the flaws.
Torn CV boot
And the goodness.
Brand new Fister Stage 3 muffler
Shift Couple thingamajiggy. Make sure it is cleaned and lubed. Mine had dried out and was very dirty.
Slave cylinder. I don't understand why people have such a difficult time swapping it out. It's right in front of you! Pretty easy when the tranny is out of the way. Be careful when you disconnect it, fluid will be running down your arm. Bled it with some sort of power bleeder, we tried to do it by hand and it took forever. Picture this: 11:30 at night, me in the car 6 feet up in the air. Uncomfortably, laying upside down in the drivers seat so I can pump the clutch by hand. Tried to do it with my feet but the clutch would go straight to the floor and I had trouble prying it up. No way to adjust the drivers seat because the battery was disconnected. Thank goodness we found a power bleeder stashed in a cabinet, otherwise we might still be there.
Here's a picture of a broken shift coupler bushing. Darin, I need that SSK!
More to come....
Last edited by tonypai; 05-02-2010 at 04:07 PM. Reason: Picture
05-02-2010, 03:14 PM
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Light Weight Flywheel. 13 pounds.
Dual Mass Flywheel. Not 13 pounds. Notice the heatspots.
New pressure plate. Nice and shiny. It comes with a bunch of washers that need to be pressed into place to hold the pilot bearing.
Old pressure plate. Slave on the right. Junction box aka the starter on the left. That thing was a major PITA, always in the way.
Another shot of the pressure plate. More heatspots.
New clutch. Notice the grooves.
Old clutch. Notice how smooth it is.
Old clutch. It's so skinny.
Rear Main Seal. Mine was leaking but it's silly not to replace it at this point. It's a lot of work to replace a $20 seal.
Throw out fork. Notice the corrosion. Interesting contraption. Rennlist (nsully) has a great writeup on how to get this out (we used it!). It's accessed through a hole on the top of the transmission but you need to unbolt it to separate the transmission from the engine. Can't see what you're doing so it's done but touch and feel.
They shop guys referred to this as a "pull" type mechanism which is different (backwards) from most American cars, which use a "push" type mechanism.
Installation of the throw out fork can be an adventure. The service manual tells you to use the very high tech solution of taping the fork to the engine, hope it doesn't fall, join the transmission, hope it doesn't fall, install the throw out fork shaft, hope it doesn't fall and then remove the tape. Gabor had some choice words for German engineering after the tape fell off after we had the transmission in place but before he could attach the throw out fork shaft. We had to start all over again.
Here's a picture of the transmission. Look at all that clutch dust.
Dual Mass Flywheel. Not 13 pounds. Notice the heatspots.
New pressure plate. Nice and shiny. It comes with a bunch of washers that need to be pressed into place to hold the pilot bearing.
Old pressure plate. Slave on the right. Junction box aka the starter on the left. That thing was a major PITA, always in the way.
Another shot of the pressure plate. More heatspots.
New clutch. Notice the grooves.
Old clutch. Notice how smooth it is.
Old clutch. It's so skinny.
Rear Main Seal. Mine was leaking but it's silly not to replace it at this point. It's a lot of work to replace a $20 seal.
Throw out fork. Notice the corrosion. Interesting contraption. Rennlist (nsully) has a great writeup on how to get this out (we used it!). It's accessed through a hole on the top of the transmission but you need to unbolt it to separate the transmission from the engine. Can't see what you're doing so it's done but touch and feel.
They shop guys referred to this as a "pull" type mechanism which is different (backwards) from most American cars, which use a "push" type mechanism.
Installation of the throw out fork can be an adventure. The service manual tells you to use the very high tech solution of taping the fork to the engine, hope it doesn't fall, join the transmission, hope it doesn't fall, install the throw out fork shaft, hope it doesn't fall and then remove the tape. Gabor had some choice words for German engineering after the tape fell off after we had the transmission in place but before he could attach the throw out fork shaft. We had to start all over again.
Here's a picture of the transmission. Look at all that clutch dust.
Last edited by tonypai; 05-02-2010 at 04:10 PM.
05-02-2010, 04:01 PM
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The first problem, crunchy and squishy clutch was fixed by doing the LWF upgrade and the slave cylinder. I haven't done the kinematic lever or the master cylinder. Some other day.
Onto the second problem. With the transmission out of the car, we played with the shifter and could feel some resistance shifting into the even gears. The only way to figure it out was to open it up.
Here's the G50 transmission sitting on a lift. Really cool tool, you can control height, pitch, yaw, yin, yang. Very helping in reinstalling the transmission.
The G50 transmission is divided into three main areas. The first houses fifth, six and reverse. The second first, second, third and fourth. The third the differential. (If any information is incorrect please let me know and I'll edit it. I was given this explanation as everything was being quickly disassembled.)
Here's the first area. 5-6-R
When we crack the second area and hit it with some cleaner a cascade of metal bits and pieces came flying out. Upon further examination we deduced that it was bearing parts.
You have to remove the gears to get to the second area.
Here's a close up of the second area
The second area. The long shaft on the left is the shifter rod.
Something had become lodge in the shifter rod bushing and that was why I could shift into odd gears but not even. You can see the gouges at the bottom of the shifter rod, where it sits in the bushing.
Shift rod bushing, where the shifter rod sits.
The question was where were the metal bits coming from? So far everything in the first and second area looked fine. That left the differential.
The differential
Where the differential lives
Another shot of the differential. The bolt on the left holds everything in place. The standard bolt is skinnier than the gears it holds and there is a layer of bearings in between. We think that a previous mechanic repaired it incorrectly by putting a washer on the bottom instead of on top. So when the bearings broke they were free to go to other parts of the transmission, instead of being contained by the washer. Our solution was to use a slightly thicker bolt and do away with the bearings all together. They had a spare VW part that we cut to size and welded into place.
I should have taken more pictures but I was busy changing my valve cover gaskets and cleaning the ICV while the experts were figuring out my solution.
Here's one of those "cheater" tools that can help make life easier.
Car runs great, clutch is nice and smooth. Though it picks up much earlier now and is still stalling as it relearns. I never did install the engine mounts, another project for another day.
Hope you found this interesting and can help someone in the future.
As Chris W says, "Is this a great place or what?"
Onto the second problem. With the transmission out of the car, we played with the shifter and could feel some resistance shifting into the even gears. The only way to figure it out was to open it up.
Here's the G50 transmission sitting on a lift. Really cool tool, you can control height, pitch, yaw, yin, yang. Very helping in reinstalling the transmission.
The G50 transmission is divided into three main areas. The first houses fifth, six and reverse. The second first, second, third and fourth. The third the differential. (If any information is incorrect please let me know and I'll edit it. I was given this explanation as everything was being quickly disassembled.)
Here's the first area. 5-6-R
When we crack the second area and hit it with some cleaner a cascade of metal bits and pieces came flying out. Upon further examination we deduced that it was bearing parts.
You have to remove the gears to get to the second area.
Here's a close up of the second area
The second area. The long shaft on the left is the shifter rod.
Something had become lodge in the shifter rod bushing and that was why I could shift into odd gears but not even. You can see the gouges at the bottom of the shifter rod, where it sits in the bushing.
Shift rod bushing, where the shifter rod sits.
The question was where were the metal bits coming from? So far everything in the first and second area looked fine. That left the differential.
The differential
Where the differential lives
Another shot of the differential. The bolt on the left holds everything in place. The standard bolt is skinnier than the gears it holds and there is a layer of bearings in between. We think that a previous mechanic repaired it incorrectly by putting a washer on the bottom instead of on top. So when the bearings broke they were free to go to other parts of the transmission, instead of being contained by the washer. Our solution was to use a slightly thicker bolt and do away with the bearings all together. They had a spare VW part that we cut to size and welded into place.
I should have taken more pictures but I was busy changing my valve cover gaskets and cleaning the ICV while the experts were figuring out my solution.
Here's one of those "cheater" tools that can help make life easier.
Car runs great, clutch is nice and smooth. Though it picks up much earlier now and is still stalling as it relearns. I never did install the engine mounts, another project for another day.
Hope you found this interesting and can help someone in the future.
As Chris W says, "Is this a great place or what?"
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05-03-2010, 03:18 PM
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Thanks guys!
It was a great learning experience and a lot of fun to be able to truly understand what a syncro, a throw out fork or a shifter fork looks like and how it functions. (Hence all the photos).
It was a great learning experience and a lot of fun to be able to truly understand what a syncro, a throw out fork or a shifter fork looks like and how it functions. (Hence all the photos).
05-03-2010, 05:17 PM
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I met my friend Gabor 5 years ago when I bought my Audi A8. He spent a year researching why the D2 prefacelift transmissions sucked so bad. Needless to say, he figured it out and I had him rebuild my transmission. Happy ever since. Along the way Gabor made friends with a local transmission shop and started working out of Trans Fixed Transmission in Rolling Meadows, IL. Great guys and I highly recommend them for any transmission work.
I met my friend Gabor 5 years ago when I bought my Audi A8. He spent a year researching why the D2 prefacelift transmissions sucked so bad. Needless to say, he figured it out and I had him rebuild my transmission. Happy ever since. Along the way Gabor made friends with a local transmission shop and started working out of Trans Fixed Transmission in Rolling Meadows, IL. Great guys and I highly recommend them for any transmission work.
Great write up! Thanks!
05-07-2010, 11:39 PM
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So, it's been a rough week with plenty of stalling. High RPMs, low RPMs, start up. Major PITA. Very frustrating and not a lot of fun.
I re-read a bunch of rennlist threads and talked to Steve W. Checked all my connections and re cleaned the ISV.
I had cleaned the ISV at the shop on Sat, lots of industrial strength brake cleaner and it looked pretty clean to me. Or maybe not.
I hit the ISV with carb cleaner, qtips and soaked it for a couple of hours in mineral spirits.
Yummy, it was clear when I started.
Look at all those chunks of crud.
Sparkly clean ISV
Other side
Moral of the story, make sure your ISV is extra, extra clean. It should rotate easily in your hand, you can heard it clacking around.
Car is awesome, so much fun to drive. Looking forward to taking it out again, not dreading it like I was all week.
I re-read a bunch of rennlist threads and talked to Steve W. Checked all my connections and re cleaned the ISV.
I had cleaned the ISV at the shop on Sat, lots of industrial strength brake cleaner and it looked pretty clean to me. Or maybe not.
I hit the ISV with carb cleaner, qtips and soaked it for a couple of hours in mineral spirits.
Yummy, it was clear when I started.
Look at all those chunks of crud.
Sparkly clean ISV
Other side
Moral of the story, make sure your ISV is extra, extra clean. It should rotate easily in your hand, you can heard it clacking around.
Car is awesome, so much fun to drive. Looking forward to taking it out again, not dreading it like I was all week.
