Lifter Puzzle
03-19-2010, 07:29 PM
#1
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Lifter Puzzle
Hi everyone,
I own a 1994 Carrera 2 and am based in the UK.
I love your site and wonder if I can pick your brains on something which is puzzling me. I am getting a bit of lifter noise from the left hand bank which is slight but audible when the car is at normal operating temperature. Conventional wisdom as I understand it is that the heavier oils (say 50 grade) should help to alleviate this. With this in mind, I moved from a 10w40 to a 5w50. However, strangely I have found that, as the car heats beyond the "normal" temperature - the gauge heading towards the horizontal - the sound drops off considerably. To me, this would suggest that the lifters actually would benefit from a thinner oil (the oil thinning out at the higher temperature) and that I ought instead to have moved to a 5w30 or similar. As a non expert, this does not seem to make sense, unless the lifters are somehow benefitting from the increase in flow as the oil thins out.
Does anyone else have a similar experience? Any thoughts on this would be very welcome.
Many thanks,
Carrera Cup
I own a 1994 Carrera 2 and am based in the UK.
I love your site and wonder if I can pick your brains on something which is puzzling me. I am getting a bit of lifter noise from the left hand bank which is slight but audible when the car is at normal operating temperature. Conventional wisdom as I understand it is that the heavier oils (say 50 grade) should help to alleviate this. With this in mind, I moved from a 10w40 to a 5w50. However, strangely I have found that, as the car heats beyond the "normal" temperature - the gauge heading towards the horizontal - the sound drops off considerably. To me, this would suggest that the lifters actually would benefit from a thinner oil (the oil thinning out at the higher temperature) and that I ought instead to have moved to a 5w30 or similar. As a non expert, this does not seem to make sense, unless the lifters are somehow benefitting from the increase in flow as the oil thins out.
Does anyone else have a similar experience? Any thoughts on this would be very welcome.
Many thanks,
Carrera Cup
03-19-2010, 08:32 PM
#2
the typical lifter noise is when cold w/ 15w50 oil in lower ambients. This gernerally goes away after a few minutes as the engine warms.
The noise you are describing does not appear normal and is likely the result of failed seals in the lifter.
John D. did a really nice post on replacing failed lifters. JD's lifter repair
The noise you are describing does not appear normal and is likely the result of failed seals in the lifter.
John D. did a really nice post on replacing failed lifters. JD's lifter repair
03-19-2010, 11:43 PM
#3
Rennlist Member
I had a failed seal in a lifter when I put the 3.8 back together a couple of weeks ago. This being the first 993 engine I've had my hands in I pondered all the idiotic things I could have done on reassembly. But my first instinct was correct in that I thought it was coming from #6 intake. When I popped it off, out fell the lifter. Not sure how it was not making noise before I had to take the engine apart for the failed valve spring (#4 intake). Popped in a new one, and all was well at Laguna Seca the next day.
03-20-2010, 06:08 PM
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Thanks for the input guys.
The sound is not too bad - barely noticeable really. I've been told by everyone that it is my OCD, which strangely seems to have got worse since I acquired the 993 (sound familiar?).
I'll keep an eye (or ear) on it and see what good if any a change in oil does.
Best regards,
Carrera Cup
The sound is not too bad - barely noticeable really. I've been told by everyone that it is my OCD, which strangely seems to have got worse since I acquired the 993 (sound familiar?).
I'll keep an eye (or ear) on it and see what good if any a change in oil does.
Best regards,
Carrera Cup
03-29-2010, 03:38 PM
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An update....
I applied an engine flushing product - I believe the equivalent in the USA is probably Swepco 502 - prior to replacing the 5w50 oil with a lighter grade (M1 5w30).
The early signs are very encouraging - the right hand bank is currently whisper quiet, whilst the left bank is significantly calmed.
I understand that the oilways in the 993 are pretty narrow and are prone to becoming blocked from the sludge, varnish and general gunk that accumulates over time. These blockages, by impeding the flow of oil, will prevent the lifters from pressurising as they should - resulting in that light tapping which, though often mild and pretty harmless, can be so infuriating. I bought the car mid way through last year on a substantial, though not quite complete, service history. The car had been also been standing for some length of time prior to sale. I am tending to conclude that, by reintroducing the car to frequent driving, the gunk that accumulated as a result of inappropriate oils changed at too infrequent intervals has been dislodged and found its way into the narrow oilways serving the lifters.
However, whilst cautiously optimistic, I am not expecting this to be quite the end of the story. I would not be at all surprised if, with further driving, more blockages come about as more and more of the sludge comes loose and is circulated to around the engine. Hopefully, with more oil changes, I will see an iterative improvement.
Once again, thanks for all your input.
Carerra Cup
I applied an engine flushing product - I believe the equivalent in the USA is probably Swepco 502 - prior to replacing the 5w50 oil with a lighter grade (M1 5w30).
The early signs are very encouraging - the right hand bank is currently whisper quiet, whilst the left bank is significantly calmed.
I understand that the oilways in the 993 are pretty narrow and are prone to becoming blocked from the sludge, varnish and general gunk that accumulates over time. These blockages, by impeding the flow of oil, will prevent the lifters from pressurising as they should - resulting in that light tapping which, though often mild and pretty harmless, can be so infuriating. I bought the car mid way through last year on a substantial, though not quite complete, service history. The car had been also been standing for some length of time prior to sale. I am tending to conclude that, by reintroducing the car to frequent driving, the gunk that accumulated as a result of inappropriate oils changed at too infrequent intervals has been dislodged and found its way into the narrow oilways serving the lifters.
However, whilst cautiously optimistic, I am not expecting this to be quite the end of the story. I would not be at all surprised if, with further driving, more blockages come about as more and more of the sludge comes loose and is circulated to around the engine. Hopefully, with more oil changes, I will see an iterative improvement.
Once again, thanks for all your input.
Carerra Cup
03-29-2010, 04:50 PM
#7
Three Wheelin'
This sounds very similar to my lifter question earlier this week. I too have noticed slight lifter noise on start up when it was cold out(30's) after switching to thicker Brad Penn.
