Ed Burdell

Hello, all:

My attempt at ensuring adequate insurance for my car (i.e. full replacement cost) has caused a bit of a rift with my State Farm agent of 18 years. While there is a policy in place with them, I'm tempted to bolt to another company, taking along every other policy I have with them as well. Each of you has successfully navigated these waters before. What insurers are you dealing with successfully? I've searched a bit thru the archives and have come up with "stated value" and "agreed value" variants, but I could use a quick primer on what to do here, as insuring a '98 C2S is not at all like insuring a '97 Ford F-150 (my previous frame of reference). Thanks in advance.

jimwood

Try AAA. They have done good by me for the house and cars.

gordo993

I have AAA as well. So far, so good!

gonzilla

But how is "market value" determined??? If it's determined by how much the DMV is told that cars sell for, I doubt it would help very much. I have heard of some very shady buyers claiming their cars cost them 50% of what they really paid to avoid taxes. If enough people are doing this, a car someone bought for close to $40K has a "market value" of only $20K. I could see this as being quite a problem if someone's car is ever totalled and the insurance company uses "market value" to determine the payout.

901aero

I'm sorry but I have to say State Farm will NEVER insure my 911 again. I had major headaches when the car was totaled in an accident that was not my fault. Fought with MY agent for almost a year to the day before they would give a reasonable payout for the car. The adjusters, and everyone involed were complete jerks. PCA documentation, local ads, reflecting a fair value for the car were simply ignored. Literally, no response at all. I'm sorry but I definately feel they were indeed trying to screw me on purpose. And because I had no "injury attorney" I definately felt they considered themselves off the hook. They know full well if you sue for property damages only the attorney fees will negate whatever you gain in doing so. I now have a specialty company that offers an agreed value policy.

jnx

I was in the insurance business for over 20 years and most agents in our area would shop their personal Auto/HO insurance every year or so. ( they would never tell this to their policyholders) The reason is that some companies may take hits, (over exposure) that raise rates when other's don't have the same exposure. As to staying with a company for a long time, so they know you is total BS, (sorry S.F.) these companies are businesses trying to make a profit and that's the bottom line.

I think a stated value policy is the way to go. In a total loss you will know what to expect. If you don't have stated/agreed value you will get market value, determined usually by someone who really don't what these cars are worth. Go to Edmunds or KBB and look up your carsometime, if you think that is what your car is worth then don't over insure it. For what it's worth, my stated value premium was only $38 more per year for my 98 C2S. Well worth it to me.

So shop around, and get quotes for Auto and Homeowners coverage at the same place so you can qualify for companion discounts.

901aero

My car was a unique case. It was a '77 Carrera 3.0. I had completely restored the car. It had less than 3000 miles on it when it was totaled. I provided resto reciepts including motor rebuild costs in a folder totaling over 72 pages of reciepts far exceeding the value of the car (probably about 50 grand) I would have been happy with a settlement of $30,000 for the car. In fact I would check with my agent periodically as to what THEIR value on the vehicle figured to be (and if it would have been unsatifactory, I would have looked elsewhere for insurance). And I was told that the category it was in (B5 or whatever it was) that they had a value of just that, 28 t0 30 grand. I'm a realist. I knew I would not get what I put into it so I as I said that figure as a replacement value was fine. Not three weeks later the accident happend. And then began the complete turn around on attitude and value. Their "expert" (special valuation individual) came back with $11,500, less than what a standard, decent condition '77 911S that year would have been worth. PCA valuation committe came back with something close to $27,000. As luck would have it a '76 Carrera 3.0 ( decent but unrestored - I looked at the car) surfaced in the local classifieds at $24,000. All this documentation was sent along with the resto receipts. My adjustors only comment was an attempt at being funny I guess by saying "A '76 model is older than yours wouldn't that make it more valuable than yours?" Then they tried playing the ole "gray market" stategy (despite that there IS NO US version of this model)-- as if this totally negated the condition and value of the car. I guess I finally wore them down or someone just decied to wrap things up and we setteled on a dollar amount and me buying the car back. After months of parting the car out I got close to what I figured I could live with. A total pain in the *** that I felt was completely unecessary. Oh and by the way I had been a State Farm customer for over 22 years --without so much as a single claim or caused accident. Nice huh?

95 C4 993

AIG has been good. Well, every insurance company has been great to me because I have never had a speeding ticket or accident. Electric pulled a 75% increase in rates for no reason a few years ago and I did an insurance.com inquiry and now pay $408 for 6 months. 100/300 with a $250 deductible.

jackb911

Fact: Major insurers are not geared to insure "special" vehicles, aside from antique/special interest cars that qualify for a Limited Use/Classic Antique policy. Generally the car has to be 25+ years old to qualify for these types of policies, and they are usually written on an Agreed Value basis. Agreed Value and Stated value are not the same thing. Your agent cannot determine what the insurance carrier's payout would be on a total loss unless you have a stated value policy. The company determines the value, not the agent.

Your '77 Carrera 3.0 was most likely not listed in the insurance company's rating "book", since it was, in fact, a gray market car. On the open used car market, which is what insurance companies deal in, your car would not have been considered to be a special vehicle. Try to trade even the world's nicest '77 Carrera 3.0 in on a new car - even another Porsche - and see what you would be offered!

Another thing to consider is that your insurance premium was most likely calculated as if it were a '77 911S, since the 3.0 was not in the aforementioned rating book. Many carriers will no longer insure gray market vehicles because of situations like you found yourself in. Very few adjusters or supervisors are "car people", let alone knowledgeable Porschephiles.

Specialty carriers are the way to go if you have an unusual or "very special" Porsche.

amfp

I am not an insurance expert, but have an opinion as this is an important thread for further discussion regarding our beloved 993's.

I think loyality with insurance companies, or even with many employers is not how long you have been working there, or the amount of years with same insurance company. More of what you have done lately. I do agree, your settlement chances are better if you have the same insurance company for about two years if had a claim. Especially dropping you and/or raising rates.

Case and point, I had Progressive for years with no accidents or violations. I called the AAA agent who wrote the Progressive policy and told him that I can get lower rates with USAA and Amica, plus more importantly a better umbrella policy. Asked if was in accident/car stolen would I get better treatment vs. policy holder for say one or two years. And/or if 911's got stolen or totaled would I get a better settlement. He said no to both Q's based on his 10 years experience. Basically, he said really does not matter much, we try to treat all our clients the same. I guess it can get escalated and it may help to make your case. But I think much depends on insurance companies financials to pay claims, not client loyality. Some of this may vary state by state too. For example, if was flood car with Katrina, or floods last month in VT/MA. I think payouts would be different.

Seems if the worst happened with our cars we need to make sure we have current records and a few authorized "experts" available to give retail appraisals. Especially if car is better than the "average" example.

I did not go back to Progressive, or USAA, and now have Amica. For a main reason of what I think is better umbrella policy. Not to say USAA is not great, it really is, and may go back to them again.

Amica does not do declared value, which concerns me. But they do take several estimates to decide on payoff. So having people in your pocket to give current estimates are important. I did ask if they accept sold prices on eBay, and was told no, but I think that should be challenged if necessary. There rational is eBay purchase price varies by state area. I don't agree with that either based on electronic commerce and higher end cars.

Bottom line, I did not make my insurance change based on policy cost. I often think seaching internet for lowest prices is only half of it, as you sometimes get disappointed because there is no service after sale. This includes car parts, and your own personal time. Cannot be penny wise and dollar foolish. I made decision on what I viewed to be best policy for only me, and reconfirmed speaking with body shops that deal with insurance companies, and customer service.

I treat insurance as an investment and needs to reviewed on a regular basis. I am not a buy and hold kind of guy. Except for 993's.

Scott 1996 993c2

Bottom line . . . anyone can get screwed . . . or at least feel they got screwed . . . by any insurance company . . . at any time. It doesn't really matter how long or short you've been there. It's basically luck of the draw . . . I hope no one really thinks that every adjuster or every area manager has the same business philosophy when it comes to claims adjusting just because their with the same company. And . . . there's lots of turnover / job hopping in this industry. A bit random outcome is assured when comparing stories. Now, there can be some discounts had for long-term policyholders . . . but that might not in and of itself be reason to stay. I persoanlly don't change auto insurance frequently . . . as I loathe shopping for it . . . the couple of bucks I'd save is not worth my time to deal with this process (I've checked ). . . and in the end . . . I have to have way too much insurance IMHO (just every damn type you can list, I'd bet ) so it just sorta drives me nuts. Besides, I'm not that lucky . . . and I've seen many a person have a temporary lapse / gap in insurance . . . and BAM . . . there comes the accident / theft / vandalism.

Insurance . . . can't live with it . . . can't live without it.

Scott

higginsbeach

I too am in need of insurance. I am taking delivery of my 1997 993 TT with 22,000 miles in 3 hours which came from Chicago. I already have it insured but need to revaluate since they use KBB which understates the value considerably. Ironically, NADA has it pretty close, actually, an amount I could live with.

SO......... I need the name of a specialty insurance company that anybody uses that I am protecting my investment.

Roland

Edgy01

The Porsche Club of America has some people who can help you get an honest appraisal.
Dan

dbf73

Edgy01 - PCA won't be of much help with 993's. see the eligible model list at

https://rennlist.com/forums/showthre...isal+committee

JustAnotherRed993 - keep posting your viewpoint. I may not agree with everything you say but it is a valuable viewpoint. Be curious to your comments on diminished value perhaps in a new thread and distinguishing between a claim on a person's own collision policy (where the insurance contract presumably controls) and the situation where your insured hits another person who is makling the diminished value claim.

cesar

www.lelandwest.com does agreed value. Restrictions on mileage and location of parking...etc.

Hagerty does agreed value also. Have to call them, can't get figures on line.

Cesar