Stories like this really makes me think I should keep my car.

As for the $1k out of your pocket, you got off pretty easy. Prior to owning my 993TT, I had a 91 Ferrari Testarossa and prior to that a 93 Ferrari 348 SS. Both were bought sight unseen from autorized Ferrari Dealership. Now the 348SS, I bought it from an authorized Ferrari dealer in Houston, the car was better than I expected, when I took it out for the first drive I noticed issues with the battery, long story short selling dealer had the local Ferrari dealership come to my house pick up the car fix it and deliver it back to me; and appologize to me for the inconvinience. Now when I sold that to get the 91 Testarossa, I also bought it from an authorized Ferrari dealer in San Antonio and prior to shipping the car to me I had them do the 30k service. Well when I got the car, it didn't look as good as the pictures and when I took it out for my first drive; all I can say is it was hell. Long story short, repair bill was almost $10k (it needed several repairs as well as new cats, exhaust and a bunch of other stuff), had to threaten the selling dealer and at the end they ended up paying for half. After about 6 months, I sold the car and took a pretty big lost on a car that I owned for less than a year (which 85% of it was at the dealer).

Now my 993TT, I bought from a private person from CA, car was advertised through a broker. Had a PPI done and talked to the tech that did the PPI, as well as the shop owner and they gave me the thumbs up. When I received the car I had the local Porsche dealer check the car out and it was as described. So two out of three isn't too bad. I guess what I am saying is, buying a used car is a crap shoot sometimes you win and sometimes you loose; but I know one thing I will never buy a car sight unseen again.

 

Condition is so very subjective, period. Very sorry to hear of your rather unfruitful trip. I would be PISSED as well. Stay tuned to the classifieds, and when you least expect it, a nice one will pop up. And hopefully by someone who doesnt really know the value of 993's

I'll keep an eye out for a nice example. Dont give up...

 

So you're worried that a Rennlister will snipe the car away from you? If you find one through the internet then it's not exactly a secret...esp if it's a common color for buyers like black or silver. If on the other hand you found it through a private referral I can understand your concern....but in most instances the generous Rennlisters who make these offers are already happy with the one they have.

 

Looking for 993s is not easy, (spent a year to find mine) in a nutshell - you get what you pay for. My car was / is not a dream machine but then I did'nt pay top dollar either. IMO if you buy a $25K 993 you'll easily spend 10 - 20K to make it right (if someone else is doing the work and all the while you don't get to enjoy the car).

Houston dealer RPM Motorsports / Ray Joseph has one of the nicest stables of no issue 993s in the country - just be willing to pay North of $50k for it.

For me a RL Membership is well worth the $17 a year I pay for it, and being a Member / supporter is far more appealing than being a User.

Best wishes

 

Really...this experience boils down to 2 things:

1) The dealer did not disclose these obvious issues over the phone. Instead they had me travel out 1500 miles to look at a POS car.

2) Protechnik Blew the PPI. Completely blew it. When I pressed him later, Sam admitted that he barely looked at the car and had his mechanic do it all. They missed almost everything, except for some of the scrapes on the front valance and one of the wheels. I dont know how they missed 2 inches of mud in the bottom of the engine, but they said "engine clean" and "car drives great".

There were also many other obvious issues missed by Protechnik.

I paid $250 for the PPI and $150 to have the car towed down there. Yeah, I could have had a rennlister look at the car first...but I do not feel comfortable asking some stranger in this forum to go out of his or her way to do this...sorry but thats the way it is.

By the way: I found the name of Protechnik recommended by many in this forum as a great place in Houston to do a PPI. This was done by searching this forums archives. Several choices were given. Protechnik was always at the top of this list.

PPI completely failed me. When they saw the obvious issues, they should have called me on the spot and asked me if I wanted to continue on. They missed so many things that its comical that the place even exists as a Porsche garage. I hope to get my money back on this. Stay tuned.

 

If Protechnik's PPI was as poor as you indicate, I would have them to return the PPI fee & plane fare to get to Houston. They were also recommended to me for a PPI but were unavailable because they were racing at the time. I'm sure they will do the right thing since I've heard only good things about them.

 

Not sure I really understand your logic here, Sonic... you're not comfortable asking anyone in this community for help but you're completely fine letting us all know how badly you've been screwed in this deal we were never a part of in the first place?

The fact that you were more "comfortable" investing $400 in a car you never even saw seems strange to me. To me, what you're experiencing is the downside of the risk one takes when purchasing a car from a distance. Honestly, I don't need to hear the trashing any more.

Just my $.02.

 

I do think dealers need to be held accountable. Years ago it seemed as though it was generally accepted that dealers tended to only keep nicer cars ( and wholesale the less desirable ones). These days it seems as though enthusiat's cars trade hands privately more than being traded in to dealer's yet still the dealers charge a premium over private sales, to me suggesting that they are carrying a "10" level vehicle. I found Sonic's account helpful and perhaps it will further entice me to spend more time and effort researching future vehicle purchases.

 

"Honestly, I don't need to hear the trashing any more."

No one is trashing except you Jeff. But there are always people like you who act like they know it all right? and anything contrary wouldnt be acceptible? So why not just tune out then and go away and avoid yourself the internal conflict...

I posted this in the forum a long time ago. I dont recall any Rennlister offering to go down there and look at the car him/herself. The fact that I spent the money is my problem, but it was Protechniks responsibility to do a proper PPI and the dealer to not misrepresent the condition of the car in both the ad and on the phone. End of story Im done here.

 

Thank goodness.

Just sounded like an awful lot of whining and taking no accountability yourself. You'll notice that I, and many others for that matter, tried to post productive suggestions and condolences early on in this thread... all you're interested in is blaming everyone except yourself.

 

How Self-Righteous of you Jeff to post such comments.

Did you read the part where I said that I was "embarrassed" at myself for ending up in this situation?

How is that not admitting accountability?

But then again, I have to defer to who is reading this thread and trying to interpret it. Perhaps it is likely that your limited vocabulary and your lack of mental aptitude may not offer you a suitable definition of the word "accountability".

I feel sorry for those who have to deal with you in your world.

 

I thought you were done? I guess you felt it prudent to jump back in and throw a few personal snipes... very productive of you.

And it's not self-righteous, Sonic... just being more outspoken than maybe some of my other Rennlist MEMBER brethren are willing to be. Here's what we've learned from/about you so far:

- You don't see any value in joining this group but surely believe you've got the right to bitch and moan to all of us.
- You believe that early 911's are better built than 993's, and that the latter's doors are "like made of tin" (nice vocabulary, by the way).
- You ask for an awful lot of advice/input on pricing, etc., but contribute very little, if anything, that's productive or useful. In addition, the advice you do get is often dismissed as you've got your own opinions on how things are or should be.
- You appear to have a lack of trust in the members that make up this community based on several of your comments.
- You have an air of entitlement that is irritating to many more than just me, I'm certain.

As for any of us offering assistance to you in this case, it looks like your mind was made up regarding this vehicle before you even posted here... you had a question regarding emissions and that was it. Many of us raised concerns regarding potential CEL/SAI issues and the car's lack of use over the last 3 years. Obviously, what you knew, or thought you knew, trumped any of these concerns.

As indicated earlier, I tried to be positive and encouraging in the wake of your plight (review my earlier posts)... if you knew anything about me you'd know I went to hell and back with my car AFTER I had completed my purchase. Suffice to say, I can relate completely to the anger/frustration you are experiencing... with that said, I speak for no one but myself in saying that I got increasingly irritated with your caustic and cynical remarks on this forum.

 

"Trojanman"

Clearly, you have some sort of personal issue with me and my posts here in the forum... most likely based on some personal mishaps or negative experiences that you have had in your life which have unfortunately corrupted your ability to think clearly and analyze without prejudice.

Did you get that?

OK. I hope so. To refute your points:

1) I was not aware until recently that this forum had a membership requirement and that it was necessary to join in order to post here. In addition, I never questioned the value of joining such a membership I was only asking what such value such a membership would hold. Does it include free inspections from members as was indicated by the likes of you??? Even if it did, I wouldnt impose on anyone unless they offered first.

2) Yes, it is true that I believe the 84-89 Carreras to be of superior build quality to the 993s. This is based on my experiences with these cars. I checked out two more today in the LA area.

Furthermore, it is important to point out that this opinion/experience is shared by MANY, including MANY top Porsche mechanics.

And even furthermore... it really does not matter if a person such as me feels this way...the fact is that I own a "classic" 911 that I enjoy very much and have no intention to sell... and I really want a 993, though I will always feel that it has some build compromises that Porsche started to implement in the mid 90s to keep the costs down on the 993s and place it below the cost of the 964s which were rising fast by the end of its run.

For example: Do Monroe shocks mean anything to you?? Maybe...then again...maybe not.

This trend towards cutting costs, was continued by Porsche in the 996... which was clearly geared towards a different build standard, mass produced for mass profits. For this I say "congratulations Porsche as now you have enough cash to buy VW".

3) I don't recall posting regarding the pricing on this car. I may have on some other car a long time ago in a different post...but I dont remember doing so and even if I did...it is irrelevant to this thread.

So... since I did not post regarding price here in this thread, or recently...then it is safe to assume or deduce that Trojanman searched the archives for Sonic dB and read though some past posts.

I find this very funny...as if Trojanman does not have much better to do than to search archives for possible Slander points.

Loser?

4) Lack of trust...hmmm can you quote any specific issues where I confronted any member at all (except you, the lone imbecile) and questioned their integrity?

Come on dude...you searched the archives right?

ha ha.

Fact is that I value everyone who posted in response to this thread...except for the lone idiot who takes his name from a method of birth control and a university that he may or may not have attended...most likely not.

5) Entitlement? Again, this is coming from your personal mishaps and negative experiences...aka "the twisted subconscious mind". What happened to you Trojanman? Did someone wrong you in some way which would cause you to lose trust in others who are only seeking help and advice?

The bottom line here is this: YOU were the person who seeked me out and confronted me, attempting to bait me into your personal battle.

Well congratulations...you succeeded.

You also succeeded in making yourself look like a Jackass....though you probably do not have the mental ability or cognitive sensibility to recognize this.

All of this could be annoying to me...but what really is most annoying about you Trojanman is your habit of assigning words and meanings (from your twisted mind) to what other people write or say. You can not assume to be able to read others thoughts and intentions TMan... Really in my case, you got it 100% WRONG.

This is the reason why I truly feel for those that have to face you in the real world.

 

By the way Trojanman... Your little post on page 3 "I guess I win the quickdraw award" with the little rolly polly smiley guy...is most successful in showing your total lack of class & the fact that you drew humour from the misfortune of another. Your attitude of "i told you so ha ha" is clearly an indication of your complete lack of character.

In addition, that post of yours clearly indicates a nasty disposition that you hold towards me for some unknown reason, which is buried in that twisted mind. You are a psycho dude...and youd better deal with that!

So take care fella. Of course you will write back and sling some more darts here...but Im done with you. If you ever want to discuss this face to face, please PM me and we will make arrangments to meet.

 

SonicDB,

I am sorry that this thread has turned so ugly, but you really stepped over the line with your offer to "meet" with TrojanMan. Its in indication of a "bully" mentality, which does tend to show in your posts. Please give this thread a rest. I'm really disappointed. We can discuss and argue "using our words", but threatening to use fists is just plain juvenile. And... I don't even know TrojanMan and I'm a UCLA fan!