Affording a 911
07-30-2005, 09:05 AM
#31
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I'm going to echo everyone else here and indicate that owning your own home is the first step toward other goals in life. Your home always will be (or perhaps is) your best asset. Once you build up some equity you can choose to either buy your car on the margin of your home (which, in this market, is a pretty good idea) or finance the vehicle independently (attractive because home equity lines of credit frequently use variable rates, or if [like in my case] your wife doesn't want to sully the amount of your equity) because you may be more attractive to lenders once you have a sizeable physical asset and a history of payment on it.
That being said, I just moved up from my 1987 911 to a 1997 993 and USAA financed 100% of the 993 at 5.25%. I think they follow the NADA values pretty closely, but have some slack to fit if your credit is good enough. I'm a USAA member, so I can't comment on whether they offer loans to non members.
Oh. One more thing! Don't lose hope! I pined after 911's for YEARS! Sometimes it seemed like I would never get to the point where owning/maintaining one would be possible (*YES* be prepared for 2500-3000 dollars a year of maintenance -- squirrel a little of it away each month when you make your payment. This way when the bill comes you already have the 'Porsche Maintenance Fund' as my wife calls it). Keep working hard, as I'm sure you always have. All your sacrifices will not have been in vain!
That being said, I just moved up from my 1987 911 to a 1997 993 and USAA financed 100% of the 993 at 5.25%. I think they follow the NADA values pretty closely, but have some slack to fit if your credit is good enough. I'm a USAA member, so I can't comment on whether they offer loans to non members.
Oh. One more thing! Don't lose hope! I pined after 911's for YEARS! Sometimes it seemed like I would never get to the point where owning/maintaining one would be possible (*YES* be prepared for 2500-3000 dollars a year of maintenance -- squirrel a little of it away each month when you make your payment. This way when the bill comes you already have the 'Porsche Maintenance Fund' as my wife calls it). Keep working hard, as I'm sure you always have. All your sacrifices will not have been in vain!
07-30-2005, 10:39 AM
#32
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Originally Posted by davethomas
Bull, those must have been heydays. College loans, football scholarships. I think I saw your movies from back then -- you have a great *****.
07-30-2005, 01:07 PM
#33
Drifting
Capital One auto financing will finance 100% plus taxes if you want to include...I got approved over the Internet in 5 minutes...a nice lady called and asked if I wanted to get my blank check regular mail or overnight and the check was there next day! As easy as it gets... 6.45% by the way...
Good luck...
Good luck...
07-30-2005, 01:41 PM
#34
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Great thread folks... I too am in the original poster's position. I'm 28, have owned my house for over a year, have a steady job as a senior software consultant, and am now at about 20 years of lusting for a 911. I even have a girlfriend who agrees that the ideal honeymoon is taking euro delivery of a porsche and driving around Europe for a month or two. Too bad the new ones are not what I want. 
I too have an A6 (Avant, and it has coilovers and a supercharger
), which I'm just about paid off on, so I plan to keep that as my daily driver and snowboarding car, and have the 911 as my fun car.
I lust for a 993C4, cause up here in the PNW we get rain, and wet leaves on twisty roads with high hp freak me out.
Anyway, I lurk around here a ton, and thanks for all the informative posts. I'd really love a P-car right NOW, but I'm content to wait til next year when the situation is just right. Besides, who knows what the Cayman will do to used 911 values...
Until then, cheers all. And good luck to the OP, on finding that dream car. I know EXACTLY how you feel! Take these guys advice though, real estate is not going to go down over the long term, and it's a more prudent investment than a car. Unless you get a solid 356 maybe. I bought my home last summer and already have a 20% appreciation to show for it. Makes me feel a lot more comfortable when justifying the price tag on a Porsche.
I too have an A6 (Avant, and it has coilovers and a supercharger
), which I'm just about paid off on, so I plan to keep that as my daily driver and snowboarding car, and have the 911 as my fun car.I lust for a 993C4, cause up here in the PNW we get rain, and wet leaves on twisty roads with high hp freak me out.
Anyway, I lurk around here a ton, and thanks for all the informative posts. I'd really love a P-car right NOW, but I'm content to wait til next year when the situation is just right. Besides, who knows what the Cayman will do to used 911 values...
Until then, cheers all. And good luck to the OP, on finding that dream car. I know EXACTLY how you feel! Take these guys advice though, real estate is not going to go down over the long term, and it's a more prudent investment than a car. Unless you get a solid 356 maybe. I bought my home last summer and already have a 20% appreciation to show for it. Makes me feel a lot more comfortable when justifying the price tag on a Porsche.
07-30-2005, 02:19 PM
#35
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aside from home/car/financial choices discussions...anyone have concrete info about 993 maintenance costs?
i also asked this in another thread. =)
https://rennlist.com/forums/993-forum/218432-993-maint-costs-and-schedule.html
i also asked this in another thread. =)
https://rennlist.com/forums/993-forum/218432-993-maint-costs-and-schedule.html
07-30-2005, 02:30 PM
#36
Rennlist Member
I spread sheeted it once for the first 90K miles on mine from new, including depreciation and financing at 5%, and the modest mods you see in my sig. It came out to $1.22/mile. That's why I ball park it at $1/mile now, if you have all the maintenance done for you, and go through 18" tires with an appetite.
07-30-2005, 03:18 PM
#37
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I also used the Capital One blank check program. It was the easiest loan I have ever received. You tell them how much you would like to get a loan for and if you are approved they send a check right out. They don't care what car you use it for or how much it costs.
07-30-2005, 08:35 PM
#38
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You guys have some outstanding points on the sense of buying property now. You're building equity and tax breaks are great. There are a number of issues having nothing to do with a porsche for me to resist that:
* The cheapest 1-bedroom condo in San Diego costs $500,000.
* My credit is not what it once was due to a business venture gone sour. I'm not eligible for a CapitalOne 100% loan, they'll only do 80%, and I don't think any bank in their right mind would loan me enough for a home loan.
* I'll be working and getting a technical graduate degree while I'm working on campus, someday followed by an MBA. Owning a nice car may have intangiable, unquantifiable returns when one is on college campuses (agree, Bull?).
* In 1-2 years, I may study at another college in the US, or maybe overseas. I'm still young enough to learn to speak a 3rd language fluently. When you own real estate, it's like getting a divorce if you want to move. You can take a car with you or otherwise it's a much more liquid asset to sell. I grew up living around the world, when I'm not moving, I somehow find a reason to change apartments every 6 months.
* I would rather put money into a business than into real estate (though I haven't found that business yet). Again the benefits of a liquid asset.
Comments?
* The cheapest 1-bedroom condo in San Diego costs $500,000.
* My credit is not what it once was due to a business venture gone sour. I'm not eligible for a CapitalOne 100% loan, they'll only do 80%, and I don't think any bank in their right mind would loan me enough for a home loan.
* I'll be working and getting a technical graduate degree while I'm working on campus, someday followed by an MBA. Owning a nice car may have intangiable, unquantifiable returns when one is on college campuses (agree, Bull?).
* In 1-2 years, I may study at another college in the US, or maybe overseas. I'm still young enough to learn to speak a 3rd language fluently. When you own real estate, it's like getting a divorce if you want to move. You can take a car with you or otherwise it's a much more liquid asset to sell. I grew up living around the world, when I'm not moving, I somehow find a reason to change apartments every 6 months.
* I would rather put money into a business than into real estate (though I haven't found that business yet). Again the benefits of a liquid asset.
Comments?
07-30-2005, 08:59 PM
#39
Race Director
Dave,
You hit on a few very good points. First and fore most, the importance of our credit rating. Young people usually do not think along these lines (I know my kids do not), but in this society, our lives become so much easier if we have good credit ratings. Not that we borrow extensively, but just refinancing, we get much better deals because of our stellar credits. In your case, you probably would not be posting this thread if you have impeccable credit ratings either.
Yes, "the cheapest 1-bedroom condo in San Diego costs $500,000". But how much are you paying in rent now. Here in the Bay Area, a class A one-bedroom Apt. rents for $1600 per month. A 4.5% mortgage on $400k principal, interest only, runs $1,500 per month, and it's fully tax deductible.
"I would rather put money into a business than into real estate ", but which one carries more risk. "My credit is not what it once was due to a business venture gone sour." I rest my case.
I'm not saying get a house under any circumstances. Some people are just not meant to be tied down. However, generally speaking, it is a safer and more profitable way for most.
Good luck with your search for both the right 993 and financing.
CP
You hit on a few very good points. First and fore most, the importance of our credit rating. Young people usually do not think along these lines (I know my kids do not), but in this society, our lives become so much easier if we have good credit ratings. Not that we borrow extensively, but just refinancing, we get much better deals because of our stellar credits. In your case, you probably would not be posting this thread if you have impeccable credit ratings either.
Yes, "the cheapest 1-bedroom condo in San Diego costs $500,000". But how much are you paying in rent now. Here in the Bay Area, a class A one-bedroom Apt. rents for $1600 per month. A 4.5% mortgage on $400k principal, interest only, runs $1,500 per month, and it's fully tax deductible.
"I would rather put money into a business than into real estate ", but which one carries more risk. "My credit is not what it once was due to a business venture gone sour." I rest my case.
I'm not saying get a house under any circumstances. Some people are just not meant to be tied down. However, generally speaking, it is a safer and more profitable way for most.
Good luck with your search for both the right 993 and financing.
CP
07-30-2005, 11:55 PM
#40
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"for maintenance I'm assuming $2000/yr average, which may be perhaps a high figure"
i think that is kind of low, but it depends on how much driving you do and how much you are going to do yourself. if you are like me (drive a lot and don't work on your car) then just routine maintenance would be about $2k (not including tires, which these cars eat for breakfast), but with a 10 year old car you also have to plan for other things...like a new clutch, or a steering rack, both of which will set you back quite a bit more. my maintenance bill, over the past 18 months, is over $10k (new clutch, top end rebuild, steering rack). i would not recommend doing this car on a budget unless you plan on spending some serious time underneath it. just my 2 cents...
i think that is kind of low, but it depends on how much driving you do and how much you are going to do yourself. if you are like me (drive a lot and don't work on your car) then just routine maintenance would be about $2k (not including tires, which these cars eat for breakfast), but with a 10 year old car you also have to plan for other things...like a new clutch, or a steering rack, both of which will set you back quite a bit more. my maintenance bill, over the past 18 months, is over $10k (new clutch, top end rebuild, steering rack). i would not recommend doing this car on a budget unless you plan on spending some serious time underneath it. just my 2 cents...
07-31-2005, 12:07 AM
#41
Nordschleife Master
Originally Posted by rainmn
You may very well be right. I couldn't remember whether or not you needed the military affiliation for the loans or just the insurance. Worth a phone call though.
On a side note, I used them for everything too, right up until I bought the 993. The rate they wanted to cover the car was insane. Switched to Geico, bought more coverage on both vehicles, and pay much, much less. They were great on my auto insurance for years, but it started to creep up for no reason at all. (No claims whatsoever.) The quote on the 993 was the last straw.
Next to go is my homeowner's from them. That too has steadily increased over the last few years to an unacceptable level.
On a side note, I used them for everything too, right up until I bought the 993. The rate they wanted to cover the car was insane. Switched to Geico, bought more coverage on both vehicles, and pay much, much less. They were great on my auto insurance for years, but it started to creep up for no reason at all. (No claims whatsoever.) The quote on the 993 was the last straw.
Next to go is my homeowner's from them. That too has steadily increased over the last few years to an unacceptable level.
08-01-2005, 11:28 AM
#42
Reply to Your Question on "The Hunt is Over" Thread
Dave,
It sounds like you may be waiting to purchase (not a bad financial move at your age/station in life), but I don't mind sharing what I paid for my new ride: $34.5K. I bought it from a dealer who does not specialize in German cars, so that helped price-wise, I believe.
Additionally, I would add that mechanically, I would say it's a 9 to 9.5 out of 10, exterior 8.5 (just a few paintless dent repairs that are "OK" and stone chips, etc.), interior 9/10.
Good luck,
Dean
---------------------
Original Posting:
______________________________________
After a near miss on a white ’91 Turbo (2 different PPIs), I am very pleased to report that I have purchased a stock, one-owner 1995 Polar Silver C2 with 32K miles right here in Chicago. My journey had me started out looking for a 993, got a taste of a 964T, but ended up back with the 993 (no regrets).
http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/9...le_view_1_2.jpg
http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/9...l_side_view.jpg
http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/911_front_view1.jpg
http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/911_rear_low_view.jpg
http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/9...ngle_view_2.jpg
It passed the PPI at Midwest Performance Cars with flying colors. I have all of the previous owner’s records. It needs nothing, other than perhaps the brake fluid changed (I’m checking how recently it was done).
I look forward to each time I drive it, as I take the train to work. The car feels extremely solid and well-cared for. It is truly a weekend/fun car. Thanks for everyone’s help along the way in making my decision. Next, I plan to attend a DE day once my PCA membership is received. I also just joined RL.
It sounds like you may be waiting to purchase (not a bad financial move at your age/station in life), but I don't mind sharing what I paid for my new ride: $34.5K. I bought it from a dealer who does not specialize in German cars, so that helped price-wise, I believe.
Additionally, I would add that mechanically, I would say it's a 9 to 9.5 out of 10, exterior 8.5 (just a few paintless dent repairs that are "OK" and stone chips, etc.), interior 9/10.
Good luck,
Dean
---------------------
Original Posting:
______________________________________
After a near miss on a white ’91 Turbo (2 different PPIs), I am very pleased to report that I have purchased a stock, one-owner 1995 Polar Silver C2 with 32K miles right here in Chicago. My journey had me started out looking for a 993, got a taste of a 964T, but ended up back with the 993 (no regrets).
http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/9...le_view_1_2.jpg
http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/9...l_side_view.jpg
http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/911_front_view1.jpg
http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/911_rear_low_view.jpg
http://forums.rennlist.com/upload/9...ngle_view_2.jpg
It passed the PPI at Midwest Performance Cars with flying colors. I have all of the previous owner’s records. It needs nothing, other than perhaps the brake fluid changed (I’m checking how recently it was done).
I look forward to each time I drive it, as I take the train to work. The car feels extremely solid and well-cared for. It is truly a weekend/fun car. Thanks for everyone’s help along the way in making my decision. Next, I plan to attend a DE day once my PCA membership is received. I also just joined RL.
08-01-2005, 11:47 AM
#43
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Dave,
FYI I paid ~$32,000 for a 1995 Cab one year ago, in great condition, PPI passed with flying colors and had 59,000 miles on it. Pretty fair price, I believe. Definitely finance the house first, IMO. Good luck!
FYI I paid ~$32,000 for a 1995 Cab one year ago, in great condition, PPI passed with flying colors and had 59,000 miles on it. Pretty fair price, I believe. Definitely finance the house first, IMO. Good luck!
08-01-2005, 12:10 PM
#44
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Dave,
At age 31, my order of purchases was:
- Porsche (993tt) - financed
- House - mortgaged
- Wife - lay-away
When you have the Porsche first, the wife must accept it as part of a package deal. When you swap the order of purchases, you may have a lot more negotiating to do. Plus, I had the Porsche already when looking at houses, so I could check the driveway suitability.
Kevin
At age 31, my order of purchases was:
- Porsche (993tt) - financed
- House - mortgaged
- Wife - lay-away
When you have the Porsche first, the wife must accept it as part of a package deal. When you swap the order of purchases, you may have a lot more negotiating to do. Plus, I had the Porsche already when looking at houses, so I could check the driveway suitability.
Kevin
08-01-2005, 12:17 PM
#45
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YOU CAN LIVE IN YOUR CAR BUT YOU CAN'T RACE YOUR HOUSE!!!!!! 
I understand your dilemma, if you are even contemplating a relocation, DO NOT buy a house, prices are way too high right now and if it goes south (the market) your're stuck. If you are thinking staying in the area, BUY a house. Don't know what kind of equity you'll get in 1 year but in CA you may make it in market value. Again this is pretty dangerous to spend a pile on a home and then the market falls out. Call me a pesimest but this can't go on forever.
That said, I'm 30, got my 993 two years ago from Mike W (fellow Rennlister) for 31K with 7x,xxx miles and I've been sliding down the damn slope since. DON'T call Viperbob unless you need to lighten your wallet!
But seriously, 2K a year is a reasonable maintenance budget if you do your own work or have VB do it.
Good luck with the chase and the Caymen release will affect 993 prices very little.
Andy
I understand your dilemma, if you are even contemplating a relocation, DO NOT buy a house, prices are way too high right now and if it goes south (the market) your're stuck. If you are thinking staying in the area, BUY a house. Don't know what kind of equity you'll get in 1 year but in CA you may make it in market value. Again this is pretty dangerous to spend a pile on a home and then the market falls out. Call me a pesimest but this can't go on forever.
That said, I'm 30, got my 993 two years ago from Mike W (fellow Rennlister) for 31K with 7x,xxx miles and I've been sliding down the damn slope since. DON'T call Viperbob unless you need to lighten your wallet!
But seriously, 2K a year is a reasonable maintenance budget if you do your own work or have VB do it.Good luck with the chase and the Caymen release will affect 993 prices very little.
Andy