Irresponsible PPI????
12-19-2004, 01:40 PM
#46
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Carrera Mike that was my take based on my conversation with both the buyer and the PPI shop (yes I called them). The shop owner was polite and stated that he had never considered that by infoming the potential client of possible problems he just might sour the deal.
Well the potential buyer called me back yesterday after driving a couple of 996's and wants to meet this morning. In the interim I have a couple of other lookers and both are made offers I rejected but we'll see.....
JRG
Well the potential buyer called me back yesterday after driving a couple of 996's and wants to meet this morning. In the interim I have a couple of other lookers and both are made offers I rejected but we'll see.....
JRG
12-19-2004, 02:36 PM
#47
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It is funny how we live in a world where fair and honest people can argue totally opposite points of view based on their own circumstances.
Some months ago there was a "new" 964 Turbo owner using these forums (not just the 964 forums) to attack a Porsche dealership for doing exactly what this shop did not do.
The purchaser in this example claimed the PPI provider should have provided him all potential problems, etc etc etc. Law suits and everything were threatened against the PPI provider who as I said was a Porsche dealer.
PPI provider says to much, sours a deal and it is the PPI provider's fault.
PPI provider does not sour the deal and the car does not tell the purchaser as much as they think they should have been told and it is the PPI provider's fault.
I have stopped doing PPIs because you are damned if you say too much (seller) and damned if you don't say enough (purchaser).
There is no happy medium because somebody "has" to take the blame and forced to pay financial compensation. It is never the seller's or purchaser's fault.
Ciao,
Adrian.
Some months ago there was a "new" 964 Turbo owner using these forums (not just the 964 forums) to attack a Porsche dealership for doing exactly what this shop did not do.
The purchaser in this example claimed the PPI provider should have provided him all potential problems, etc etc etc. Law suits and everything were threatened against the PPI provider who as I said was a Porsche dealer.
PPI provider says to much, sours a deal and it is the PPI provider's fault.
PPI provider does not sour the deal and the car does not tell the purchaser as much as they think they should have been told and it is the PPI provider's fault.
I have stopped doing PPIs because you are damned if you say too much (seller) and damned if you don't say enough (purchaser).
There is no happy medium because somebody "has" to take the blame and forced to pay financial compensation. It is never the seller's or purchaser's fault.
Ciao,
Adrian.
Last edited by Adrian; 12-19-2004 at 04:13 PM.
12-19-2004, 03:26 PM
#49
Originally Posted by Adrian
It is funny how we live in a world where fair and honest people can argue totally opposite points o view based on their own circumstances.
Some months ago there was a "new" 964 Turbo owner using these forums (not just the 964 forums) to attack a Porsche dealership for doing exactly what this shop did not do.
The purchaser in this example claimed the PPI provider should have provided him all potential problems, etc etc etc. Law suits and everything were threatened against the PPI provider who as I said was a Porsche dealer.
PPI provider says to much, sours a deal and it is the PPI provider's fault.
PPI provider does not sour the deal and the car does not tell the purchaser as much as they think they should have been told and it is the PPI provider's fault.
I have stopped doing PPIs because you are damned if you say too much (seller) and damned if you don't say enough (purchaser).
There is no happy medium because somebody "has" to take the blame and forced to pay financial compensation. It is never the seller's or purchaser's fault.
Ciao,
Adrian.
Some months ago there was a "new" 964 Turbo owner using these forums (not just the 964 forums) to attack a Porsche dealership for doing exactly what this shop did not do.
The purchaser in this example claimed the PPI provider should have provided him all potential problems, etc etc etc. Law suits and everything were threatened against the PPI provider who as I said was a Porsche dealer.
PPI provider says to much, sours a deal and it is the PPI provider's fault.
PPI provider does not sour the deal and the car does not tell the purchaser as much as they think they should have been told and it is the PPI provider's fault.
I have stopped doing PPIs because you are damned if you say too much (seller) and damned if you don't say enough (purchaser).
There is no happy medium because somebody "has" to take the blame and forced to pay financial compensation. It is never the seller's or purchaser's fault.
Ciao,
Adrian.
12-19-2004, 04:22 PM
#50
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Originally Posted by mnmblu
Hold to your price. Let's firm up that market. 
It's a sellers market.
It's a sellers market.I just got back from meeting that perspective buyer again and I let him drive the car through the Malibu hills. I even saw Christian coming back down from Topanga. So I let him drive it the hills for about an hour and he only stalled it twice! He had driven a couple of 996's yesterday, but called and said he that wasn't the car for him and he wanted to see mine again...
So, he loves the car and wants to buy it pending PPI. He offered me $43K with the 18-inch 5 spokes. If you'll remember, I listed the car originally for $46k with both sets of rims/tires. I then lowered the price to $42k with only the 17's included. He thought that price included the 18's because some of the pics in the add had the 18's on, even though I stated only the "17-inch supercups were included at that price". I agree it might have been a bit misleading to a Porsche novice, but I don't want to give my beautiful car away either. I told him that I would include the brand-new 18's for $44k, again he offered $43k. I'm going to have to replace the lower valve cover gaskets and that will probably cost me $500. with an oil change. So I don't know what to do. There are 19-98'Cabs currently listed on Autotrader across the country. Mine is the 3rd. lowest price on there, and you know my car is probably one of the nicest. So my initial thoughts are to stick to my guns at $44k. What do you think????
JRG
12-19-2004, 04:30 PM
#51
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Adrian I don't disagree with you . I think the liability is probably not worth it for most smaller-independent shops. I do think however, that just maybe it would make sense for the shop to at least to look at the car first and make their inspection. After all that's what the prospective buyer brought it to them for. When they meet to discuss the inspection, I think that woould be the appropriate time to discuss not only the findings on that particular car, but the series in general. They should also have some reasonable statistic on what percentage of cars actually suffer CEL's. guides. or whatever. Does PNA make that stat available?
JRG
JRG
Originally Posted by Adrian
It is funny how we live in a world where fair and honest people can argue totally opposite points of view based on their own circumstances.
Some months ago there was a "new" 964 Turbo owner using these forums (not just the 964 forums) to attack a Porsche dealership for doing exactly what this shop did not do.
The purchaser in this example claimed the PPI provider should have provided him all potential problems, etc etc etc. Law suits and everything were threatened against the PPI provider who as I said was a Porsche dealer.
PPI provider says to much, sours a deal and it is the PPI provider's fault.
PPI provider does not sour the deal and the car does not tell the purchaser as much as they think they should have been told and it is the PPI provider's fault.
I have stopped doing PPIs because you are damned if you say too much (seller) and damned if you don't say enough (purchaser).
There is no happy medium because somebody "has" to take the blame and forced to pay financial compensation. It is never the seller's or purchaser's fault.
Ciao,
Adrian.
Some months ago there was a "new" 964 Turbo owner using these forums (not just the 964 forums) to attack a Porsche dealership for doing exactly what this shop did not do.
The purchaser in this example claimed the PPI provider should have provided him all potential problems, etc etc etc. Law suits and everything were threatened against the PPI provider who as I said was a Porsche dealer.
PPI provider says to much, sours a deal and it is the PPI provider's fault.
PPI provider does not sour the deal and the car does not tell the purchaser as much as they think they should have been told and it is the PPI provider's fault.
I have stopped doing PPIs because you are damned if you say too much (seller) and damned if you don't say enough (purchaser).
There is no happy medium because somebody "has" to take the blame and forced to pay financial compensation. It is never the seller's or purchaser's fault.
Ciao,
Adrian.
12-19-2004, 06:32 PM
#52
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Dear JRG,
The data you ask about is not available from official sources. Many of us have tried to get this data to provide a better understanding in our books but it is a state secret.
In my 993 book just like the books before it I will discuss all the known issues of the 993. There are not that many but they have to be discussed along with the solutions (if known) to said problems.
We live in a world now, especially in our western world where we are always happy to blame others.
If you are a Porsche person and a buyer you will be armed and ready.
There are two kinds of people who purchase Porsches.
Those who want and need to own one and
Those who want to say they own one.
The first group will not be scared away by the truth and will actually respect the knowledge and honesty of the Porsche community.
For the second group who cares anyway?
Ciao,
Adrian.
PS: I would get 10 to 20 emails every week from people asking me for "free advice" on car purchases. I live in Switzerland and I cannot fly over to the USA or anywhere else for that matter to inspect the car first. I provide my knowledge, what to look for and the questions to ask. In my books I provide a a full self inspection program with includes "Take it for a test drive". Never ever purchase a car without a full test drive and full systems function check.
The data you ask about is not available from official sources. Many of us have tried to get this data to provide a better understanding in our books but it is a state secret.
In my 993 book just like the books before it I will discuss all the known issues of the 993. There are not that many but they have to be discussed along with the solutions (if known) to said problems.
We live in a world now, especially in our western world where we are always happy to blame others.
If you are a Porsche person and a buyer you will be armed and ready.
There are two kinds of people who purchase Porsches.
Those who want and need to own one and
Those who want to say they own one.
The first group will not be scared away by the truth and will actually respect the knowledge and honesty of the Porsche community.
For the second group who cares anyway?
Ciao,
Adrian.
PS: I would get 10 to 20 emails every week from people asking me for "free advice" on car purchases. I live in Switzerland and I cannot fly over to the USA or anywhere else for that matter to inspect the car first. I provide my knowledge, what to look for and the questions to ask. In my books I provide a a full self inspection program with includes "Take it for a test drive". Never ever purchase a car without a full test drive and full systems function check.
12-20-2004, 08:47 PM
#53
John,
It depends on how motivated you are. If he offered you $43, someone else will offer you the $44. Everyone likes to walk away from a deal feeling like they got something, so it depends on how much that grand mean to ya. Personally, I love your car and would never let it go anyway but you know that. These cars are going to firm up if not increase in value, you will see...
Anyway, take it as far as you can with the 44 then at the last, tell him, let's make it a win, win situation and let's split the difference. Negotiations, ya know, meet in the middle.
It depends on how motivated you are. If he offered you $43, someone else will offer you the $44. Everyone likes to walk away from a deal feeling like they got something, so it depends on how much that grand mean to ya. Personally, I love your car and would never let it go anyway but you know that. These cars are going to firm up if not increase in value, you will see...
Anyway, take it as far as you can with the 44 then at the last, tell him, let's make it a win, win situation and let's split the difference. Negotiations, ya know, meet in the middle.
12-20-2004, 09:15 PM
#54
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Originally Posted by mnmblu
John,
It depends on how motivated you are. If he offered you $43, someone else will offer you the $44. Everyone likes to walk away from a deal feeling like they got something, so it depends on how much that grand mean to ya. Personally, I love your car and would never let it go anyway but you know that. These cars are going to firm up if not increase in value, you will see...
Anyway, take it as far as you can with the 44 then at the last, tell him, let's make it a win, win situation and let's split the difference. Negotiations, ya know, meet in the middle.
It depends on how motivated you are. If he offered you $43, someone else will offer you the $44. Everyone likes to walk away from a deal feeling like they got something, so it depends on how much that grand mean to ya. Personally, I love your car and would never let it go anyway but you know that. These cars are going to firm up if not increase in value, you will see...
Anyway, take it as far as you can with the 44 then at the last, tell him, let's make it a win, win situation and let's split the difference. Negotiations, ya know, meet in the middle.
Now about the PPI...He called THAT SHOP several times this afternoon and their line is always busy. So I called the shop I use and respect which is also in Santa Monica (German Auto Tech) and they set it up for tomorrow. I going to replace the lower valve cover gaskets and do an oil service. Hopefully that's all I'm doing.....Alan you have a private e-mail...
JRG
12-20-2004, 09:24 PM
#55
Hey John, congratulations... he's getting a great car. I checked and have no PM. Also, checked email and nada. Out of curiosity, let me know how much you want for those rims and tires. How is Jan?... email me.
AG
AG
12-20-2004, 09:32 PM
#56
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Originally Posted by mnmblu
Hey John, congratulations... he's getting a great car. I checked and have no PM. Also, checked email and nada. Out of curiosity, let me know how much you want for those rims and tires. How is Jan?... email me.
AG
AG
JRG
12-20-2004, 09:36 PM
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Originally Posted by mnmblu
John,
It depends on how motivated you are. If he offered you $43, someone else will offer you the $44. Everyone likes to walk away from a deal feeling like they got something, so it depends on how much that grand mean to ya. Personally, I love your car and would never let it go anyway but you know that. These cars are going to firm up if not increase in value, you will see...
Anyway, take it as far as you can with the 44 then at the last, tell him, let's make it a win, win situation and let's split the difference. Negotiations, ya know, meet in the middle.
John,
It depends on how motivated you are. If he offered you $43, someone else will offer you the $44. Everyone likes to walk away from a deal feeling like they got something, so it depends on how much that grand mean to ya. Personally, I love your car and would never let it go anyway but you know that. These cars are going to firm up if not increase in value, you will see...
Anyway, take it as far as you can with the 44 then at the last, tell him, let's make it a win, win situation and let's split the difference. Negotiations, ya know, meet in the middle.
This makes sense to me. When one is ready to sell, one is ready to sell. By the same token, when one is ready to buy, one is ready to buy. Make the best deal you can and move up. For you it is TT time. Allow the dreams of 'boost' to be your nepenthe.
Congratulations. You are almost an owner of the Very Best car Porsche every built. Think 993 Twin Turbo!
Remember not posting pics is a sin without contrition.
12-20-2004, 10:04 PM
#58
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Originally Posted by paradisenb
John,
This makes sense to me. When one is ready to sell, one is ready to sell. By the same token, when one is ready to buy, one is ready to buy. Make the best deal you can and move up. For you it is TT time. Allow the dreams of 'boost' to be your nepenthe.
Congratulations. You are almost an owner of the Very Best car Porsche every built. Think 993 Twin Turbo!
Remember not posting pics is a sin without contrition.
This makes sense to me. When one is ready to sell, one is ready to sell. By the same token, when one is ready to buy, one is ready to buy. Make the best deal you can and move up. For you it is TT time. Allow the dreams of 'boost' to be your nepenthe.
Congratulations. You are almost an owner of the Very Best car Porsche every built. Think 993 Twin Turbo!
Remember not posting pics is a sin without contrition.
JRG
12-20-2004, 11:17 PM
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John,
A GT3 is on my list as well. The only problem is the looks of the 996 GT3 and a 997 will be out of my reach. I will probably do the 993 TT then move to the 997 GT3 later.
I would expect the TTs to be about $70-80. Have not looked lately. A couple of months back I saw a 96' with 14k listed for $75k. Original owner.
A GT3 is on my list as well. The only problem is the looks of the 996 GT3 and a 997 will be out of my reach. I will probably do the 993 TT then move to the 997 GT3 later.
I would expect the TTs to be about $70-80. Have not looked lately. A couple of months back I saw a 96' with 14k listed for $75k. Original owner.