Anyone ever mounted 3-point harness?
04-15-2003, 04:24 PM
#1
Drifting
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Anyone ever mounted 3-point harness?
This is a Schroth Rallye 3 belt. Anyone with experience? I am wondering where you attach the mounts. Does this bolt to the existing seat frame somehow or does this go through the floor? (In the front)
<img src="http://www.fototime.com/B82E51BB5C7F552/standard.jpg" alt=" - " />
I am considering some extra restraint but don't really want a bar or 4-point harness.
<img src="http://www.fototime.com/B82E51BB5C7F552/standard.jpg" alt=" - " />
I am considering some extra restraint but don't really want a bar or 4-point harness.
04-15-2003, 04:43 PM
#3
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Brad
I too considered alternatives to the stock belts for DE use. My conclusion was that any worthwhile change requires either new seats with harness guides or a harness bar - neither of which I wanted to do for 2-3 weekends/year. I remain interested in any other options.
I too considered alternatives to the stock belts for DE use. My conclusion was that any worthwhile change requires either new seats with harness guides or a harness bar - neither of which I wanted to do for 2-3 weekends/year. I remain interested in any other options.
04-15-2003, 05:11 PM
#4
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I will not ride in a car with those - street or especially track. For some reason, the old school M3 made that belt famous and they wont go away.
Either use the stock factory 3 point, to properly mounte 5 or 6 point with the proper hardware. There is just no middle ground when it comes to something as critical to safety as your safety belt (commonly called seat belt).
See the diy page of my website for the harness install to see why 4 point (or even crappier ones like these) are more dangerous than the factory 3 points.
E. J.
Either use the stock factory 3 point, to properly mounte 5 or 6 point with the proper hardware. There is just no middle ground when it comes to something as critical to safety as your safety belt (commonly called seat belt).
See the diy page of my website for the harness install to see why 4 point (or even crappier ones like these) are more dangerous than the factory 3 points.
E. J.
04-15-2003, 05:34 PM
#5
Drifting
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Interesting feedback. Several people at the DE event, including one M3 I rode in, had those belts. I understand the anti sub issue. But other than that, what's the negative issue? Thanks for the input!
04-15-2003, 08:10 PM
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Brad, I am a nice guy so please don't take this wrong.
What other negative issue besides the fact that you could die with that setup do you need?
Other than that I am sure they are great and hold you in better. But they could cause you to die more readily than the stock 3 point or the proper 5 or 6 point setup.
Doesnt help either that most PCA DEs have rules written that exclude 4 point or non factoyr 3 point belts.
What other negative issue besides the fact that you could die with that setup do you need?
Other than that I am sure they are great and hold you in better. But they could cause you to die more readily than the stock 3 point or the proper 5 or 6 point setup.
Doesnt help either that most PCA DEs have rules written that exclude 4 point or non factoyr 3 point belts.
04-15-2003, 08:20 PM
#7
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Brad,
Why do something that has no "testing" behind it? We know the factory 3pt belts are tested at the factory and are very safe from the results of published crash tests.
If you are willing to do the crash testing and the results are good, I would change my mind, most likely.
If you do any modifications from that you should do them up to the specs that SCCA or PCA (almost one in the same in regards to safety regs) specifies. Any less and you are a test pilot.
I care enough about my well being to refuse to ride in a car with this set up. I have also refused to ride in cars with improperly set up 5 or 6 pt belts. When I instruct in a car I do a pre-flight on the belts and ask a few questions, like "When did you last check your lug nuts, brake pads, tire pressures, etc." If I don't like the answer, I am not going out in that car. Period.
Why do something that has no "testing" behind it? We know the factory 3pt belts are tested at the factory and are very safe from the results of published crash tests.
If you are willing to do the crash testing and the results are good, I would change my mind, most likely.
If you do any modifications from that you should do them up to the specs that SCCA or PCA (almost one in the same in regards to safety regs) specifies. Any less and you are a test pilot.
I care enough about my well being to refuse to ride in a car with this set up. I have also refused to ride in cars with improperly set up 5 or 6 pt belts. When I instruct in a car I do a pre-flight on the belts and ask a few questions, like "When did you last check your lug nuts, brake pads, tire pressures, etc." If I don't like the answer, I am not going out in that car. Period.
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04-15-2003, 09:03 PM
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Brad,
I've been down this road quite a bit in recent months, and feel that you're getting some good advice here. I ran the past two years with the factory 3-point restraints, and I felt safe with them.
When upgrading the harnesses and seats this year, I considered your 3-point restraint (vs. 4-, 5-, and 6-point), the whole harness bar vs. truss vs. bolt-in bar vs. welded-in cage issue, and methods of securing harnesses. After reading everything I could, I came to the conclusion that this is not an area for compromises.
I eventually followed all the SCCA and PCA Club Racing mandates, except that I chose a bolt-in bar instead of a welded-in cage. I did drill the necessary holes to put in a real 6-point harness for both the driver and passenger. I also chose Teamtech harnesses with large integrated sternum and groin pads.
Although the idea of removing rear seats and drilling 6 holes initially tweaked me, it can all be returned to stock quite easily. The same can't be said for your body if you destroy it in a crash.
I've been down this road quite a bit in recent months, and feel that you're getting some good advice here. I ran the past two years with the factory 3-point restraints, and I felt safe with them.
When upgrading the harnesses and seats this year, I considered your 3-point restraint (vs. 4-, 5-, and 6-point), the whole harness bar vs. truss vs. bolt-in bar vs. welded-in cage issue, and methods of securing harnesses. After reading everything I could, I came to the conclusion that this is not an area for compromises.
I eventually followed all the SCCA and PCA Club Racing mandates, except that I chose a bolt-in bar instead of a welded-in cage. I did drill the necessary holes to put in a real 6-point harness for both the driver and passenger. I also chose Teamtech harnesses with large integrated sternum and groin pads.
Although the idea of removing rear seats and drilling 6 holes initially tweaked me, it can all be returned to stock quite easily. The same can't be said for your body if you destroy it in a crash.
04-15-2003, 09:16 PM
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by Greg Fishman:
<strong>BTW Anir, my "lug nuts' comment was directed at you. <img border="0" alt="[nono]" title="" src="graemlins/nono.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Don't remind me how close I came to not typing this right now. <img border="0" alt="[crying]" title="" src="graemlins/crying.gif" />
Some mistakes in life you only make once.
<strong>BTW Anir, my "lug nuts' comment was directed at you. <img border="0" alt="[nono]" title="" src="graemlins/nono.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Don't remind me how close I came to not typing this right now. <img border="0" alt="[crying]" title="" src="graemlins/crying.gif" />
Some mistakes in life you only make once.
04-16-2003, 06:01 PM
#12
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Brad my friend, after checking out your sanctuary and finding this: <img src="http://fototime.com/ftweb/bin/ft.dll/standard?pictid={0C678807-90C7-4EAE-9DA2-33AD1FB36AD8}&exp=f&moddt=37725.8516983218" alt=" - " />
I have decided that you are going to be just fine. If you want to do the seats and harnesses let me know, I will be happy to help.
E. J.
I have decided that you are going to be just fine.
If you want to do the seats and harnesses let me know, I will be happy to help.E. J.
