volpenyc

By adopting European attitudes to driving: that a driver's license is a privilege that is earned and not a right that is assumed. What does this mean? More rigorous testing, more schooling, and tickets for not returning to the right lane after passing... My $0.02

bet

First let me say I respect the rights of others to go slow and/or fast depending on what they prefer and I also realize the difficulty and justification of complaining about someone going the speed limit. However that said, I get increasing more frustrated with the general American public’s lack of any rudimentary driving skills and its utter lack of common sense and courtesies when it comes to behavior behind the wheel. Simply getting over when others want to go faster and learning basic skills such a merging, lane changing and staying in the appropriate lane would go a long way to relieving a lot of my own personal frustration with other drivers. I just don’t understand some people’s obsession with making sure everyone is “following the speed limit.”

That said let me pose a thought/question…it seems the biggest complaint of those that posted is that of slower drivers hanging out in the left lane on multi-lane roads. The US is different than Germany because of all of our roads have speed limits. There are many drivers that think it is their “right” to be in the left lane and do the speed limit and they don’t understand why they should have to get over for someone “breaking the law”. I have had this discussion with a co-worker before, and it seems that the psychological empowerment of doing the “speed limit” trumps any common sense/courtesy that says get over. In his words..."I have more of a right to be in the left lane doing the speed limit than you do of going fast."

Do other countries that have speed limited roadways experience these same problems? I wonder if the effect of a “speed limit” is a contributing factor to the problem? No one in the US is use to being on a road where they may get run over by someone going in excess of 120 mph, therefore the basic skill of looking in the rear view mirror is lost on most US drivers. I wonder if the getting over skill acquired from driving on the autobahn just carry over to the speed limited roads? In other words it becomes behavioral in the driving habits?

The slow driver in the left lane discussion notwithstanding, there is no defense for the SUV sports car wannabees or the cell phone talking/smoking/eating at the same time drivers who don’t pay attention or the fact that basic merge skills are not practiced by the average driver. Of course we are also forgetting about the most egregious driver of them all…the sports car driving idiot that thinks he or she has “skillz” to driver his or her car at the “limit” and is entitled to do so because their car “can handle it” but in reality is way over his or her head.

Flying Finn

George M-T,

Damn right. There's just no excuse why anyone, and that literally means anyone (who can walk to the office with $20 in their hand and then drive around the block, or maybe just getting there is enough nowadays) has to have a driver's licence, why would they?
If you can't drive, you shouldn't get a licence (and right to drive) either.

If drivers here would drive half as good as average driver is i.e. in Finland, there would be much less traffic congessions, accidents etc.

Brian,

It doesn't matter whether there are speed limits or not (in fact, MOST of the autobahns these days have 100 or 120 km/h limits).

If you go to Finland, Sweden etc. where there usually is 120 km/h limit on highways, there is no one driving on left lane, except those who are passing of course.
Even if someone is speeding a bit, they drive on right lane, until they have to pass, and after they pass, the move to the right lane.

RAC

Colorado just passed a law, any multi lane road with a posted speed limit of 65 mph or higher, the left lane is for passing ONLY. So the days of hanging out in the left lane are over, regardless of your speed.

I can only wonder how long this will last.

-AC

MetalSolid

The reason there are so many bad drivers is the same reason there is so much traffic congestion. Ironically, bad driving is a major cause of traffic congestion. The problem is economics [greed]. The government needs all the generated revenue associated with motor vehicles, so the driving tests are made easy to facilitate this. If the driving tests in America were brought up to European standards trillions of dollars would be immediately lost in the auto, insurance, petrochemical industries, as about 75% of the people driving would lose their licences for good. LA bad traffic could be cured by simply making the driving test harder.

Flying Finn

Here in Florida they'll give you a ticket if you drive behind someone (doing 20 mph in left lane) and blink your driving lights...

Talk about being stupid...

SLVR

Part of the equation is that in the US there is no 'natural' speed differentials between cars and trucks/commercial vehicles. In Europe trucks have a speed limit of 80 km/h and they are governed at 95 km/h. Any light vehicle towing something is also limited to 80 km/h. Most other commercial vehicles are equiped with diesels that won't go much faster that 90 - 100 either. This means that even slower cars at 100-120 still go faster than anything commercial. In essence there are always speed differentials and drivers are trained to use their mirrors. The advantage is that you mostly only need to watch behind and left behind.

In the US trucks barrel along at completely irresponsible speeds in any lane, I have chased some that achieved 85-90 mies an hour (oke, I'm sure somebody here works for the teamsters and will now flame me seriously, flamesuit ON!). For something as large and lo-tech as US 18-wheelers it is complete madness. Then trucks start pressuring cars going slower in 'their' lane, no wonder many drivers prefer to hog the left lane..... Not to mention their lane-changing tactics, i.e. turn indicator on, move left or right without using mirrors too much.....I guess they all started by driving a car..... and then moved on to 18 wheelers. (Although I can understand the lane changing to some degree since they suffer the same problem of poor drivers in a different way)

When I first started to do long drives in the US on I-95 it was very tiring because you need to watch all sides all the time. You continuously have people driving exactly at your speed left and right. They wave all over the road because they are doing anything BUT driving, and most cars have the stability of a wet rag. (I know coz I rent these 'volume models' all the time...)

Anyway, all this means anything on the road is going to run right around the speed limit or whatever the concensus speed is on a given stretch of road. Given a multi-lane road and a lot of traffic you get bizar situations.

The other bizar fenomenon is that many (most?) drivers are unable to run a steady speed by themselves. I have the feeling they always tagalong with somebody else or with a group..... They behave like dogs who need to be in a pack.

Try driving behind a car which is going along by itself and turn your cruise control on. You'll find the car in front of you continually speeds up and slows down. Only when he finds a pack to run with does he stabilize his speed......why is that??

Another good example is the car that passes you, then slows down in front of you, you pass again, three minutes later he sails by and you get to go around again. Anyone have these kind of encours of f%&§$%-up kind?

Ok, enough soap box rants, I need to get my pressure down... ;-) :-)

volpenyc

SLVR97TT -
I agree. One of my biggest rants is the fact that drivers here rarely use the rear-view mirror. I find that many times when I am approaching a car from behind, and about to switch lanes (to the left) to pass, the car ahead of me telegraphs the same movement (albeit ahead of me, and invariably, at a slower pace). This frustrates me to no end for two reasons: 1) they are not going at least 15% faster than the car the are trying to pass (as I was taught to do in European driving schools; and 2) they cut me off because they haven't looked behind them.
In my biased frustration I think they are doing in on purpose to cut off a P-Car; the reality maybe is that they just have no clue what is going on behind them.

Norske

Hi All,

I agree wholey with all y'all have said. Here in North & South Carolina there are four things that realy stick out.

1. People drive with only there parking lights on until way past dark. I don't understand this one at all. maybe they are trying to save headlight?

2. People do not use trun signals.

3. People are not able to negotiate a 90 degree corner without comming to an almost complete stop. Maybe they think they are goong to tip over?

4. People think it is rude to use the horn. I have seen people sittng at a light, reading the paper and ignoring the new green signal and people will not even give a littel beep to inform them the light has changed. if y0ou do rermind them, they get pissed.

However I have not noticed any abject animosity to P-car owners.

ingo777

May be it also has to do with passion? Some people just have to use their car to get to and back from work. Complacency driving the same route over and over again cos they have to.... You can also observe that in Germany. But worst when it comes to driving skills and general overview is the place where I currently live, Singapore. You have to use a huge amount of time to attain your drivers licence here, but I personally doubt the system works well. You can see chaotic scenes on the roads though the amount of traffic is regulated by the government thru extreme high taxes on cars, more than 200%. I mean we guys are looking forward to every mile that we drive and always find an excuse for going for a spin...

KeithR3

I think you guys are asking to much from the American Drivers. Some people don't even know how to use a turn signal. I was taught to use a signal for turning and merging and passing, kinf of a may I pass, or I will turn here and merge there etc...

Many times other drivers will pass me to get in front of me and then use their signals, as if I won't let them in if I see their blinkers...

Oh well what can you do?

panzer grey

Here's one angle my European buddy explained to me:

European nations can restrict who gets a license because the general population has an ALTERNATIVE- that is, mass transportation.

European nations being relatively small, and European cities having a long standing culture of alternative transportation make it possible to limit licenses to only the more proficient drivers and the more affluent.

If you take away an old Dutch ladies license, she can ride the light rail, take a bus, or ride a bike on one of the numerous bike lanes. In other words, she can still get to the store and to see her doctor.

American cities, being auto based, cannot take away licenses without taking away mobility.

To some extent, it's a matter of geography....but mostly culture.

If you started restricting licenses in the US you would have hundreds of thousands of elderly and others with very few ways to get around much beyond expensive taxi cabs.

I suppose you could raise the costs of licenses, which would forc millions to become stranded, which would force them to lobby the government to invest in mass transportation?

Who am I kidding ? Not gonna happen. Americans hate rubbing elbows..except for New Yorkers and they are a breed apart !

SLVR

Aaaah, who"s talking about taking away licences....? Just set some rules for behavior and enforce them. If speed limits can be brainlessly enforced, why can't the other rules be?

Apart from parking regulations, easy money, I can"t see anything else being enforced properly in the US. Not even lighting or emissions, every now and then I see a pig spewing oil in the streets, no-one cares....