I am looking for the M030 US and RoW spring rates for car classification with Porsche Owners Club. I'll keep searching.

 

Surely POC already has that info for the 993, unless you're the first with a M030 993 to join, of course.

I have the spring rates for 964s, but the rates are likely different for 993s.

 

Surley they don't I am sad to report. The dilemma, it is close to impossible to lower a 993 without changing springs. If you want something a little lower than M030 PCNA (US) and want to install M030 RoW springs, the car gets kicked into Production Class with this one single mod.

Pre-964 Porsche cars can be lowered with a socket set...and they can stay in Stock Class. 964 and later cars, if they use anything other than M030 PCNA (US) they get punted past Improved Class to Production Class..a hefty hit for just wanting to lower the car a tad. This is enough to drive me to <img border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" title="" src="graemlins/drink.gif" />

 

Yes, I think the RoW M030 springs lower less than 1" compared to H&R lowering springs lowering 1.25-1.5".

 

Marty,

You have big reds....Lucky to be in production!

your buddy,
EAM

 

Martin, what about extending the thread on the dampers? I guess this only helps you on the front now that I think about it.

there's always the high-school method.......heat the springs 'till the car sags to the desired ride height....just kidding! Boy that brought back memories........

 

Martin,

RoW M030 springs will put you into production class as well (way out of stock class). The PCA rules are written in a way that it has to be stock for North America.

As a sidenote, the PCA classification for 964 and later cars are disadvantaged for lowering as are the boxsters. I've submitted a rule change request for next year as the intention is to allow lowered cars into the improved category. But as stated it shoots you straight into production.

Cheers,
Boris

 

Martin,

If I recall, there were a couple of articles in Excellence (or was it Panorama) within the last year or so on spring and shock rates for 993’s and 996’s. The factory is apparently tight lipped about the spring rates, so in the article they put the springs on a testing machines and determined the rates that way.

Tom
’95 993

 

Tom,

I will check into Excellence....maybe I'll drop a note to Bruce Anderson. He has been helpful in the past.

Thanks to all for their help to date.

 

EAM, and those interested on Big Reds and their supposed advantage...what follows is a recent note to POC Competition Committee to consider definning the rules to either include, or excluse Big Reds inProduction Class.

Suggestions 26.3.6.10 Brakes; M small caliper to S or A caliper (1 point per axle). Note the small caliper front brakes M (front) + A (rear) caliper provide 210 sq cm of braking surface. The S (front) and A rear) provides 261 sq cm of braking surface, an improvement of 24.28%.

On the 993, the standard calipers provide 422 cm sq of braking surface, the Big Reds provide 552 cm of braking surface, an improvement of 30.8%, approximately the same "advantage" provided by going from M front calipers to S calipers. I suggest that Big Reds ten be allowed as a Production Modification. This mod is not addressed in the 2003 GCRs. Also note that the Big Reds are standard on the Carrera 4 S car, a car that has the advantage of AWD, but it does weigh 133 Lbs. More than a standard Carrera coupe.

 

Marty,

I think the big advantage for Big Reds is in the heat management. Larger rotors, bigger pads, bigger pistons add up to a longer lasting pedal. This might not seem like such a huge advantage for time trialer, but once you move into cup racing this really comes into play. Late braking and the confidence that they will be there when you go for it is a big advantage. Remember the class rules are written for both time trial and cup racers...

Eric

 

Eric,

My post is a bit tongue in check as I am certain you understand. I know that in general, bigger brakes are better except in a circle track motorcycle that comes with no brakes. The dilemma for me is found, or NOT found, in the 2003 POC rules. They do acknowledge that a 25% improvement in the lower classes where a person adds “A” calipers or “S” calipers to their “M” (small) caliper equipped cars, is a Production modification.

This modification is used by early cars 1968 and earlier, that want bigger brakes, and by SC and Carrera cars that will take the points to put larger calipers on the rear of their cars.

But the 993 cars are an unusual situation, with Big Reds being standard on the Carrera 4S car, but not available from the factory for the Carrera S or Carrera narrow body car, such as ours. Does the Carrera 4S need Big Reds to stop it because it weighs more? The extra 130 Lbs doesn’t warrant a 30% increase in brake area. Let’s face it, the Big Reds are on the Carrera 4 S because it is a Turbo Look car, and these brakes simply look good <img border="0" alt="[jumper]" title="" src="graemlins/jumper.gif" /> .

But nowhere in the POC GCRs are upgrade of Big Reds to Carrera S and Carrera cars addressed. This is probably because there are not that many 993 cars at the track, yet <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" /> .

I am the first to admit, The Big Reds have a 30% greater area and larger rotors, calipers, all pluses when you want to dissipate heat. And they work really well with ABS.

I just want to see the issue, or potential issue put to bed. Is my car a Production car, or a V car? Let’s pray that it is a Production car <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> .

Marty