992 Used Car Values 2023
#16
#17
Drifting
Watch the California and Florida markets - they will be the first to break, from the crypto crash and all the IT layoffs.
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zambien (12-16-2022)
#18
I live in DC and there are zero new 992s on the lots for the 8 Porsche Dealerships in my area (DC/Baltimore). It's been like this for nearly 2 years. I see all these articles and videos about the 992 market cooling down but not in my area. I guess it just depends on where you live. Prior to the pandemic most dealerships had 10-20 brand new 992s on the lot.
But to have 8 dealerships within 40 miles of me...I would think I would start to see some 992s on the lot before most folks.
Therefore, with inflation and still a ton of cash in the system...I don't see the used 992 market going down anytime soon.
But to have 8 dealerships within 40 miles of me...I would think I would start to see some 992s on the lot before most folks.
Therefore, with inflation and still a ton of cash in the system...I don't see the used 992 market going down anytime soon.
#20
This video is from Porsche of West Palm Beach. I tried looking on their website but it wasn't there yet. Hope it helps someone.
#21
#22
Instructor
The bottom line is business is a cycle, we have most likely reached the top of this cycle and are now on the downward part of it. The exact slope is unknown but, supply will increase and prices will ease. At some point we'll reach the bottom and start back up again. Lather, rinse, repeat.
The following 2 users liked this post by IPA1:
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#23
Rennlist Member
How much (ballpark) value does being CPO add to a C2S or C4S?
#26
Rennlist Member
Delete post
Last edited by 900fc; 01-16-2023 at 07:31 AM.
#27
Burning Brakes
Prior to the pandemic, I was able to order a 991.2 Targa and then a Targa GTS with no wait and a discount off MSRP. I just ordered a Carrera T at MSRP. I am starting to see significant inventories of used 992s, especially of GT3s. Inventory will pick up, and there will be more used supply in the coming months. I think things will look much different in Fall 2023 than they are now, and there will be significant discounts to be had, one just has to be a little patient.
#28
Rennlist Member
My observations (FWIW).
1.) For cars right now (and houses), you are seeing a larger number of listings across the multiple seller sites for newer (used) 911s as compared to the amount that was on them just 6 months ago.
* few reasons - one inventory was still moving quickly and thus number and days for sale were still lower. Today they are sitting longer, and those that may have stretched or looking to conserve cash are listing them at prices that are still high.
2.) Private listings and dealer listings are still listing higher (and some are still paying). I am seeing this with the housing market as well, new listing are still listing higher and month by month they are lowering as the price are not being met. Higher interest rates (impacting both car and house sales) also slowing the market down.
3.) Assuming the economy does not get better, and specifically if it gets worse - you see a period of people still thinking they can get what happened 6-12 months ago from a price perspective. Once that denial transitional period happens (I think we are in that now) - you will start to see prices fall a bit more quickly. This happened in 2008-2009 (and a bit in 2011 as well). The bottom just doesn't fall out, there is denial, and a slow realization that starting to put downward pressure on prices, people are reluctant to move down, then they realize inventory is not moving on higher ticket items. Once you get through the denial transition phase the overall prices will drop more significantly (what that number is - really depends) - and then can (if a recession happens) accelerate over a period of 3-6 months.
4.) On the other hand, we could not go into a recession, and inflation slows down or drops significantly - and the market stabilizes quickly.
As stated in a number of other posts about this subject, there is no crystal ball on what can happen, how far prices will drop, etc.
I have been tracking various cars I have my eye on as well as some of the cars I own. McLaren 720s used prices have come down around 10% over the last few months, The GT3 Touring (991.2) has also come down quite a bit (some were averaging 230 - 260K) now down to 220 - 240 for good spec. Even the 911 (992) used market has come down a bit from what we were seeing just a few months ago, though holding fairly strong.
Another indicator is the luxury watch market, it has traditionally taken a hard hit before cars, houses, etc. - it is getting a huge adjustment right now in most cases down 30% across the major brands (Rolex, AP, PP, VC).
For any of these luxury items, your philosophy should be if you want it and can afford it (and afford to lose money) then buy it. If you are buying as an investment or can't afford to loose 30, 40, 50% or can't enjoy it if you were to - don't buy it now, wait for whatever you think the bottom will be.
1.) For cars right now (and houses), you are seeing a larger number of listings across the multiple seller sites for newer (used) 911s as compared to the amount that was on them just 6 months ago.
* few reasons - one inventory was still moving quickly and thus number and days for sale were still lower. Today they are sitting longer, and those that may have stretched or looking to conserve cash are listing them at prices that are still high.
2.) Private listings and dealer listings are still listing higher (and some are still paying). I am seeing this with the housing market as well, new listing are still listing higher and month by month they are lowering as the price are not being met. Higher interest rates (impacting both car and house sales) also slowing the market down.
3.) Assuming the economy does not get better, and specifically if it gets worse - you see a period of people still thinking they can get what happened 6-12 months ago from a price perspective. Once that denial transitional period happens (I think we are in that now) - you will start to see prices fall a bit more quickly. This happened in 2008-2009 (and a bit in 2011 as well). The bottom just doesn't fall out, there is denial, and a slow realization that starting to put downward pressure on prices, people are reluctant to move down, then they realize inventory is not moving on higher ticket items. Once you get through the denial transition phase the overall prices will drop more significantly (what that number is - really depends) - and then can (if a recession happens) accelerate over a period of 3-6 months.
4.) On the other hand, we could not go into a recession, and inflation slows down or drops significantly - and the market stabilizes quickly.
As stated in a number of other posts about this subject, there is no crystal ball on what can happen, how far prices will drop, etc.
I have been tracking various cars I have my eye on as well as some of the cars I own. McLaren 720s used prices have come down around 10% over the last few months, The GT3 Touring (991.2) has also come down quite a bit (some were averaging 230 - 260K) now down to 220 - 240 for good spec. Even the 911 (992) used market has come down a bit from what we were seeing just a few months ago, though holding fairly strong.
Another indicator is the luxury watch market, it has traditionally taken a hard hit before cars, houses, etc. - it is getting a huge adjustment right now in most cases down 30% across the major brands (Rolex, AP, PP, VC).
For any of these luxury items, your philosophy should be if you want it and can afford it (and afford to lose money) then buy it. If you are buying as an investment or can't afford to loose 30, 40, 50% or can't enjoy it if you were to - don't buy it now, wait for whatever you think the bottom will be.
#29
Rennlist Member
Been working with a dealer on a potential GTS allocation so I priced out my car for trade/sale for sh*ts and giggles. While only one indicator and not always aligned with reality, KBB still has very strong resale and trade values for my 2020 C2 in the LA market. ADM and resale value will vary quite substantially depending on location/relationships, but I was recently quoted $15k (from a dealer where I previously purchased 3 P cars) and $30k (no relationship) for ADM on a GTS coupe. If that continues to hold, resale values on used 992s will also continue to stay high IMO.
Everyone keeps predicting a shift and going back to normal, but what is that "normal" going forward? I'm still reluctant to pay any ADM at all, but my stance has softened a bit after being on an MSRP "list" for over a year with a high volume dealer in SoCal. Like many things in life, I try to balance live for today / save for tomorrow even though tomorrow is never guaranteed...
Everyone keeps predicting a shift and going back to normal, but what is that "normal" going forward? I'm still reluctant to pay any ADM at all, but my stance has softened a bit after being on an MSRP "list" for over a year with a high volume dealer in SoCal. Like many things in life, I try to balance live for today / save for tomorrow even though tomorrow is never guaranteed...
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#30
I think Porsche's story is a tale of 2 scenarios now vs every other brand (but RRover maybe?) Used 992's are obtainable where I live and the prices have moderated somewhat but what hasnt happened yet, is that effect on allocations. Those are still sought after, limited in number and with a wait.
Its 2 differing convos to me. I can easily afford a CPO'd 992 but i have zero interest in one - i want my own, fresh, specked car on the (hopeful) updated platform.
Interesting but not surprising with whats happening with Teslas now.......
Its 2 differing convos to me. I can easily afford a CPO'd 992 but i have zero interest in one - i want my own, fresh, specked car on the (hopeful) updated platform.
Interesting but not surprising with whats happening with Teslas now.......
Last edited by ctdubl07; 01-17-2023 at 02:57 PM.