When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
LOL. Don't have the coin for too many cars. Bikes are in general way cheaper. Have done quite a few more back roads in the 991 and discovered the joys of Sport+ mode. Have to say at this point I am going faster than I would on a bike. Pretty eye opening as my attitude on a bike was that a street car would not stand a chance. Pretty clueless on my part! On a race track I think the bike would still be tough to beat because of the superior acceleration. But full on race cars are a lot faster than race bikes, even though on some tracks a MotoGP bike will have a higher top speed on the straights than a F1 car. All good. All fun. All the time!
I just re-read your review because it popped up to the top of the forum list again. Really good review. Thanks.
I wanted to comment on the lateral g forces that you were experiencing. .9 is actually pretty low and no where near the limit of a 911. I've only gotten up to 1.19 on a track with a 991.2S but others have gotten much higher. I've reached 1.17 in my 981 during street driving (on-ramps to I-95)
You commented about shifting body position on a bike (i.e. shifting weight) which has a huge impact on handling. The same is true when driving high performance cars to their limit.
The most significant learning from my track experiences was how to control shifting weight in a car. Too much throttle or too much braking at the wrong time in a turn will make you loose control in a micro second. On the other hand, if you do it perfectly, you can get lateral gs in the 1.3 range.
Here is a 981 with 1.64 Gs. Obviously he has some mods to his brakes and perhaps slicks for tires to achieve those Gs on braking. Wow.
From one biker to another, re PDK manual it's actually pretty similar to the sequential box on a bike, apart from first not being 'down'. It was once I started thinking of it like that that I started getting comfortable with it.
Yeah don't want to push my luck on public roads Got a 3 year lease on an expensive car so discretion is the rule of the day.....most of the time!
I was not suggesting that you spin to get a higher g, I was only saying that some of the high g numbers might have been due to spins, not just by driving fast... I almost span twice at Sebring, the car controls avoided the full turn, and I ended up with lateral g's above 1.3, vs less than 1.2 the previous week at homestead where I never lost control of the car
Enjoyed reading this one again. I have a Ducati Diavel, and my crankshaft failed while starting the bike a month or so ago. It's three years old. I'm disappointed on a few levels, and long story short I'm going to repair it and let it go. I upgraded my 911 order from a 991.2 C2S to a TT, so now I won't miss the speed of the bike.
After about three PCA driving events in my 911 I started to really understand and feel the car's weight transfer and see how it changes traction levels and composure of the vehicle. Some of that was all new to me, and some of it was learning rear engine dynamics. But managing the car's balance and weight transfer fore/aft and side to side all while hitting apexes and everything else really makes the whole experience come together and makes driving much more exhilarating.
In street cars, the fact that I know if I screw up I will probably walk away means I can really drive closer to the edge of the performance envelope. That's a lot of fun. With a bike I always required a bit more reserve capacity. Just like wheelies on a bike are a hoot, so is drifting around corners and sliding the car around. Leaning on bikes is fun and involving (emotional too), but in the car you get lateral g's, which makes car forces feel two dimensional while bike forces feel more one dimensional. All in all I decided both are fantastic but I like cars better.
And when you get into higher end race cars, high downforce bodywork is what allows cars to dramatically outcorner bikes and put down frankly stunning lap times for their power to weight ratios. I may get a formula car at some point and try to learn that, but right now there's nobody to run with at our local track.
OK now I understand, 911seeker! Yes, ace, I need to learn the weight transfer better. Sorry about your Diavel. Sucks. I test rode a Diavel and loved the engine but not the ground clearance issues. Keeping the bikes for now until the novelty of the 911 wears off-if it ever does. Did a nice drive with my dad in the 911 today. I really enjoy stuff like that, which is not possible on a bike with an 86 year old. Never did want to bike with my wife either as I did not want her to get hurt in a crash. Great in the 911 though.
Took delivery of my 991.2 Rhodium silver C2s last Thursday. This is my first Porsche and first sports car. ... In the last 20 years I got into sport bikes and did quite a few track days on various high powered bikes including Suzuki Hayabusa, Suzuki GSXR-1000, Honda RC51, and my current KTM 1290 Superduke R. ... Doubt I will take my 911 to the track. Too expensive for my budget, and I kind of got the track addiction out of my system with the bikes. But never say never.
I would definitely rethink your reluctance to do a track day... Even just driving he car at 8/10's or 9/10's, you are going to learn tons about the capabilities of the car (and driver) in a safe environment with really minimal additional wear to your car. Sure, you'll go through pads and tires a bit quicker than driving it to the grocery store, but unless you are driving at (or beyond) the limit, you won't tear them up excessively.
Do a couple of PCA DE's or open track days to really understand and enjoy your new 911!
(PS, also a KTM V-Twin owner, though a bit different direction. 950 Adventure and 950 SuperEnduro... Had a 950 SuperMoto for a while as well!)
Leaning on bikes is fun and involving (emotional too), but in the car you get lateral g's, which makes car forces feel two dimensional while bike forces feel more one dimensional.
I disagree. If one is riding a motorbike fast enough it's far more involving than a car. Like flying, you are managing pitch, yaw, and roll. Some of the most amazing feelings I've had were managing power wheelies in triple digit speeds at the exit of a fast corner, or backing it in to a turn. Lateral acceleration is there too, but you won't feel much without getting out of the seat and well off the side of the bike. On a motorbike the 3-D experience is there for the taking, but it takes more than a few track days to unlock the skill set.
And speaking of motorbikes, I picked up a '16 Multistrada Pikes Peak a couple of weekends ago
Beautiful! I have that bike's less-hot cousin: BMW R1200GS. It's an amazing machine. I do agree that, at road speeds at least, two wheels are a greater challenge than 4 - less forgiving and more to do. I also think that riding a bike well on a country road is ultimately more fun - it's like flying, and the way that driving a car can never be, and what's more fun than that?
That said, though, I went out for two for-fun road trips last weekend and both were in my cars. Maybe it's the lateral-G thing, maybe it's the comfort, maybe it's the music, or the potential for company, or not having to wear a thick leather suit in a heatwave - I don't know. It's almost definitely that sitting in a bit of traffic sometimes bothers me less than it used to. Am going away biking next week and looking forward to reconnecting with it, but currently Porsche is winning...
I disagree. If one is riding a motorbike fast enough it's far more involving than a car. Like flying, you are managing pitch, yaw, and roll. Some of the most amazing feelings I've had were managing power wheelies in triple digit speeds at the exit of a fast corner, or backing it in to a turn. Lateral acceleration is there too, but you won't feel much without getting out of the seat and well off the side of the bike. On a motorbike the 3-D experience is there for the taking, but it takes more than a few track days to unlock the skill set.
Interesting. It must be different on a full race bike then. I ground chicken strips off and polished my header with the asphalt but was never grinding knee pucks. My wife had two conditions on the bike, 1/ Don't be stupid, and 2/ No track time.
While that second one was hard at first, at one PCA event we had half the track and a bike race rented the other half. I saw three guys life flighted from the bike race due to separate accidents. All were fully geared and I know one of them wasn't a novice and has permanent brain damage. At that point I agreed with her on me not tracking a motorcycle. That said, if I were single and had nobody else to live for I'd want to run the IOMTT.
In the canyons I had more fun in an S2000 with the top down than the Diavel despite the bike being much more fact, visceral, and intense. Part of it is for me a helmet takes away a lot of the canyon beauty experience to me, but the bigger issue is they have loose gravel wash and rock fall on the canyon roads here and some of the pickups get lazy towing and wander across the narrow lanes until they see an oncoming vehicle. I watched an aggressive kid get hurt pretty bad due to a pickup in his lane while he was coming into the blind bend at 80++. So I can run the car hard for long stretches, but I have to leave a lot on the table with the bike. Breaks my immersion I guess. They're sure fun though!
08-28-2016, 12:21 AM
