991S PDK vs Lotus Evora S
03-20-2013, 03:15 AM
#46
Burning Brakes
Someone who drives a 993 and 987 might think that, having not stepped in the actual competition of the 911 (like a Corvette or GTR). Let's be honest, almost no one is cross shopping these two cars... The whole article, and the posts above, sound like the rambling of a grumpy old man who lives in the past. Someone who thinks the 993 is the last great Porsche, and probably doesn't own a smart phone because the flip phone does everything needed. 
03-20-2013, 06:35 AM
#47
03-20-2013, 09:22 AM
#48
Lotus and Porsche both provided R&T cars with delivery mileage. They both came with some fuel in the tank. I do not believe there was any difference in the accommodations made by the companies, other than the sticker price of the cars. The 991 was WAY overequipped at $144K but it was mostly stuff that didn't affect the comparison.....
Good man.
03-20-2013, 09:35 AM
#49
Rennlist Member
03-20-2013, 09:41 AM
#50
Race Car
.....
I own a 993 and a 986S and I drove both immediately prior to stepping on the plane so I would have some reference points for the 991's size. The 991 feels exceptionally wide, and it's also wide in real life. On some of the South Carolina mountain roads we drove, the 991 was repeatedly brushing dirt off the road's edge with its back tires.
I don't speak for R&T as an aggregate. I'm a part-timer myself! My opinion is that the car is what I said it was --- a spiritual successor to the 928, not the 911. It's a big, wide car that owes more to the Panamera than the 901.
I own a 993 and a 986S and I drove both immediately prior to stepping on the plane so I would have some reference points for the 991's size. The 991 feels exceptionally wide, and it's also wide in real life. On some of the South Carolina mountain roads we drove, the 991 was repeatedly brushing dirt off the road's edge with its back tires.
I don't speak for R&T as an aggregate. I'm a part-timer myself! My opinion is that the car is what I said it was --- a spiritual successor to the 928, not the 911. It's a big, wide car that owes more to the Panamera than the 901.
03-20-2013, 09:46 AM
#51
Wow, what objectivity- not. Check the numbers. The 991 is the same width as the 997. It has a wider track- in the front. Glasses or a check of hand-eye coordination might be in order. Go drive a Panamera someday too. Despite being somewhat bigger, it is a easy to place as 991, and easier than a 997 when going fast.
Wonder if the Evo reporter, who clearly did not know how to hold a steering wheel in a turn in a recent YouTube video, was also an avid racer/track man. Hopefully a new business model for auto news will come forward soon unless rennlist is it.
Rennlist admin bubbas, looks like I will be contributing some cash to you this week.
03-20-2013, 10:09 AM
#52
Nordschleife Master
03-20-2013, 10:31 AM
#53
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Here's your direct answer. To my knowledge, Lotus doesn't fly anybody anywhere, provide tickets to events, or financially compensate journalists in any way, shape, or form. I'd be willing to bet that Porsche spent more money on their Geneva flyaway event last week than Lotus USA has for an annual budget. I have never received any compensation from either firm beyond the loan of the two cars described above.
As far as the Corvette or GT-R goes, I have thousands of miles in both. I don't think it's a good idea to start using the Corvette or GT-R as basis for comparison to the 991. The 911 has traditionally been smaller and sleeker than a Corvette. Maybe we should compare the 991 to a Flying Spur while we're at it. Hey, Lena Dunham isn't as fat as Roseanne Barr so let's make sure we see her naked on HBO every week!
The good news is that if you are a traditional Porsche fan who wants a reasonably sized car that weighs less and offers a traditional Porsche sense of connection with the driver, Lotus would love to sell you an Evora.
Last edited by Pzkw993; 03-20-2013 at 10:36 AM. Reason: removed inflammatory statement
03-20-2013, 10:35 AM
#54
Wow--that's like walking into a mosque and yelling God is a fraud and died thousands of years ago. I would not take the bait, but I think others here will declare jihad on you. Good luck, my friend. Time to make some popcorn. Be right back.
PS I see you edited your explosive comment and toned it down. Good move. lol You sounded like a real 991 hater. Now I get it, but you should stick with your honest, original assessment so everyone knows where you are really coming from, i.e., pure emotion, with no regard for facts like the fact that the 997 & 991 are the same "wide body" inch for inch and that the 991 is about 4 inches longer than a 997, which of course would make it more like the Silver Shadow (or whatever) in Cannonball Run, I guess <rolling the eyes>.
PS I see you edited your explosive comment and toned it down. Good move. lol You sounded like a real 991 hater. Now I get it, but you should stick with your honest, original assessment so everyone knows where you are really coming from, i.e., pure emotion, with no regard for facts like the fact that the 997 & 991 are the same "wide body" inch for inch and that the 991 is about 4 inches longer than a 997, which of course would make it more like the Silver Shadow (or whatever) in Cannonball Run, I guess <rolling the eyes>.
Last edited by holminator; 03-20-2013 at 05:44 PM. Reason: Allah commanded it.
03-20-2013, 11:19 AM
#55
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pure emotion, with no regard for facts like the fact that the 997 & 991 are the same "wide body" inch for inch and that the 991 is about 4 inches longer than a 991, which of course would make it more like the Silver Shadow (or whatever) in Cannonball Run, I guess <rolling the eyes>.
It's too big. It's a big fat car for people whose idea of Porsche comes from driving Cayennes. Don't even get me started on the 991 "GT3" which is really more like a "991 Carrera 2S Sport Pak".
If I can deal with a car the size, width, and weight of a 991, I can buy a Vette ZR1 for the same money and smoke the 991 from here to eternity.
No, wait, the ZR1 is lighter.
03-20-2013, 11:25 AM
#57
Why would you compare a base or S model 911 to a ZR1? That is why R&T is not worth buying. A better comparison would be a ZR1 to a GT2, which "smoked" a ZR1 at Nordschleife if I remember correctly. Why would you compare a Evora to a 991? Both fine cars but apples and oranges. That's why I wonder about the perks of yellow journalism in the 21 century.
Let's face it. You compared the two cars because you had a certain outcome in mind before you test drove or wrote the article. It's evident and does not make most of us want to buy R&T. If I had to buy one of these car periodicals, I'd spend my cash on Autoweek for my time in the airport. At least I will not see wild, spurious comparisons or articles, which generally show no passion for driving, on a parade of articles favoring Mustangs and Vettes over cars. with super car performance. I wish R&T would change. It would be nice to have more choices at the airport.
Let's face it. You compared the two cars because you had a certain outcome in mind before you test drove or wrote the article. It's evident and does not make most of us want to buy R&T. If I had to buy one of these car periodicals, I'd spend my cash on Autoweek for my time in the airport. At least I will not see wild, spurious comparisons or articles, which generally show no passion for driving, on a parade of articles favoring Mustangs and Vettes over cars. with super car performance. I wish R&T would change. It would be nice to have more choices at the airport.
03-20-2013, 11:37 AM
#58
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I can buy a brand-new ZR1 for $97K on eBay all day, every day. The 991 I drove was $144K.
You do not remember correctly. Furthermore, Ring times don't mean anything. I've driven the Ring and experienced three kinds of weather in the same lap. Maybe if you ran the cars at the same time with the same guy. Anything else is a waste of time.
The GT2 costs as much as two ZR1s and a base Vette. I know that in Porsh Fantasyland, everybody is a zillionaire and compares cars based on their "position" in a marketing lineup. In the real world, people buy what they can afford.
It's a fair question. They're both 2+2 automatic-transmission cars that, if PCNA had been able to put down the Exclusive catalog, should have stickered for the same kind of money. It's reasonable to think that a buyer might consider both. I have a four-year-old son who rides in my 911 with me. If I replaced said 911, that car would have to have rear seats. Evora, 911, GT-R... what else? Chubby sedans like an RS5 or next-gen M3?
The perks of journalism are more than you can imagine. I know people who spend half the year in Europe on manufacturer dime and the rest of the time at the Ritz-Carltons of the West Coast. I'm not that person. I've never taken an overseas trip on a manufacturer dime. I flew to Germany and drove the Ring on my own pay. I'm flying to Sepang to compete in the Malaysian series in a few weeks, again on my own dime. We can sit and talk about Porsche press perks all day long. How'd you like to have Porsche fly your girlfriend to Sicily on a Gulfstream? Supposedly it's been done.
A better comparison would be a ZR1 to a GT2, which "smoked" a ZR1 at Nordschleife if I remember correctly.
The GT2 costs as much as two ZR1s and a base Vette. I know that in Porsh Fantasyland, everybody is a zillionaire and compares cars based on their "position" in a marketing lineup. In the real world, people buy what they can afford.
Why would you compare a Evora to a 991? Both fine cars but apples and oranges. That's why I wonder about the perks of yellow journalism in the 21 century.
The perks of journalism are more than you can imagine. I know people who spend half the year in Europe on manufacturer dime and the rest of the time at the Ritz-Carltons of the West Coast. I'm not that person. I've never taken an overseas trip on a manufacturer dime. I flew to Germany and drove the Ring on my own pay. I'm flying to Sepang to compete in the Malaysian series in a few weeks, again on my own dime. We can sit and talk about Porsche press perks all day long. How'd you like to have Porsche fly your girlfriend to Sicily on a Gulfstream? Supposedly it's been done.
03-20-2013, 11:42 AM
#59
Sit & talk? First beer is on me. PM me next time you're in northern VA or Miami (summer).
Ah, I did remember the track times correctly: http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife.html.
Meant GT2 RS. Was too lazy to type RS it I guess.
PM me next time you're in northern VA or Miami (summer).Ah, I did remember the track times correctly: http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife.html.
Meant GT2 RS. Was too lazy to type RS it I guess.
03-20-2013, 11:44 AM
#60
Burning Brakes
So let me see if I have got this right...
What you prefer is for technology to stay stagnant, for cars to have flaws, an indifferent dealer network, and be cruder and slower in every way... AND you want to pay for that privilege?
What you prefer is for technology to stay stagnant, for cars to have flaws, an indifferent dealer network, and be cruder and slower in every way... AND you want to pay for that privilege?