futuregopher

I am pretty new to 911's and coming from a C8. I recently got a used 2013 991.1 base PDK and so far so good (knock on wood). I really like it and wish I had gotten into a 991.1 sooner instead of a C8.

I have a cobb accessport tune on it which they say it makes 20-25 more HP and 15-20 more torque. I am running the all season continental DWS06+.

My question is this - the car seems to be pretty bland below 3k RPM and that is expected of the base flat 6 NA from what I read on here. So if I want more power/torque below but I also want the NA sound as it gets closer to redline and I want the engine itself to be NA. Is my only option at that point a GT car or a turbo? The only 911 I have ever driven is this one that I purchased so I am not sure how the power delivery is on the GT cars. Do the GT cars have more power/torque below 3k? Or is another option the 991.2 but put an aftermarket exhaust to make up for the redline sound? I do see that the GT cars are faster from 0-60 so I am assuming there is more power down low?

I am coming from a C8 where there is torque all over the power band so my 991.1 has forced me to be more focused on where I keep my revs. I do feel like a turtle when I am not in the right gear.

Thank you all!

shammerman

@futuregopher - If your car has the Sport Chrono Package, to make a (very) long story short do the emissions control software update if it has not been done and then drive your car in sports+ mode. Here is the text from my post regarding this from a couple of years ago. The update is no cost from the dealer and totally transforms the way Sports+ works and makes a delight!

There was (and still is) skepticism about this and how it would possibly negatively affect performance, but I have not seen one "scientific" comparison of a dyno before and after or negative comments by those who have done it. Most everyone loves it and the car now shifts in the same pattern as the 991.2 which already had the same or very similar shift mapping.


Porsche DME and Transmission control reprogram "AMC0" (To address Stop Sale)I just had mine done today. Some initial impression and observations. No difference that I can tell in manual mode. In Automatic PDK+ will shift to higher gear prior to redline if speed is kept constant for example if you shift manually into third on the highway at 80 mph, it will hold third for several seconds and then flip gear by gear to 6th gear. It will also much more aggressively shift down when given gas and if driving in the 6th gear at similar highway speeds, with just a little gas will downshift to 4th (or 3rd) gear for quick acceleration. If driving at constant 45 mph Sport+ will hold 3rd gear whereas Sport will hold 5th gear. My initial thoughts are that I really like the way Sport+ now works. It is actually fully usable in street driving and while I did not have an opportunity to do any spirited driving this might be great for it making the Sport+ a Spirited Sport mode that will keep higher gears than Sport that I always find upshifting way too early and thus end up driving in fully manual mode almost always and absolutely 100% of the time when on backroads hugging curves (I do not track). EDIT/ADDIONAL: The Sport+ is now phenomenal in spirited driving on curvy backroads. Holds gears in proper gear and the revs where they need to be to have a great drive with minimal (is any) overriding with paddles.

cbredesen

C2S is noticeably spicier than base ... that's an option before you get to GT cars or move to the 3.0T. I myself have a .2 car and would not trade the thrust for better sound (though this is slightly unpopular). The NA cars do sound amazing with freer exhausts and drive wonderfully.

Viper1000

Agreed these cars are very restricted when it comes to exhaust flow. I have a .1 C1S and added a full (headers/exhaust) SOUL exhaust and it livens it up immensely. But I also went with after-market wheels and how that helped as well! The stock wheels are very heavy. I went with Rohanna's and saved like 11 lbs. (each) in the rear & 8 lbs. (each) in the front and noticed the difference right away as well. It's a slippery sloop when it comes to NA cars. If you're looking for serious power and want to keep the sound of an NA car, look at RR Racing's supercharger. It will bump your RWHP up 200hp out of the box. You can have GT3 power for only $15k! I was thinking of sending my car up there to have it done!

subshooter

I have a 992 GT3, a 991.2 C4 and a 981. I track all of them and have also driven a ton more Porsches on tracks.

Here is the deal: These NA Flat 6 cylinders need to be rung out to get the torque and power. Keep them up above 4500 rpm. There isn't a lot of torque below that.

The GT3s have more torque but are also geared differently which helps. It feels strong below 3k but nothing like the Turbos.

The biggest advantage of a Porsche over a Corvette is the reliability. You can really flog the crap out of the Porsches and they just don't break very often.

If you want a lot more torque at low RPMs,get a Turbo. I just put a softronic tune in my 991.2 C4 along with a Sharkwerks exhaust and it is making 510 bhp now. It has way more torque than my GT3.

TiptonInAustin

This is the answer. And unlike cars with torque, you gotta downshift to the moment rpms drop below 5k, or you'll never get going again.

It felt wrong at first to downshift to 2nd at 60mph before going into one of my favorite curves, but that's what you got to do!

I hope these cars are unbreakable, because you really have to hang out at high revs. A 458 will shift at 9k and all, but you have all the torque you need at 4k, so you don't spend as much time near the limiter.

Lastly, I don't find sport+ good enough, my preference is regular sport mode and manual shifting.

TangoUniform

Drive a 991.2 with a tune and you'll never go back to the 991.1.

rensoyka

an unboosted 6 cylinder will always be short on power in the low rpm band compared to a v8, as some say there is no replacement for displacement (except boost). don't feel bad, I drove a modified but unboosted 4 cylinder for 16 years and there was no zip until above 5k rpms. there are people that drive their car in the upper rpm bands all the time for power and the elusive engine sound. whatever, for me once you drive a turbo 911 you'll quickly forget why you were ever so obsessed with engine sound.

CSK 911 C4S

You know when you are in the powerband with a 991.1 the howl from the motor is intoxicating..

chuckbdc

To the OP question;
- if you want more torque down low in your normally aspirated non-S 991, the easiest thing is to trade for an S or GT as they have more cubic inches. They make more torque but also at higher RPM than 911s with turbos, so.

- if you don't care about being non-turbo, you can go to any of the 991.2 models (base or S) and get that torque down low in the rev range and the ability to raise torque and horsepower with tunes that give more boost, or with higher capacity turbos .

Viper1000

Keep in mind the .2's have leaking issues, etc. but yes, you can tune it and have more power (BUT, I have yet to be pulled by a .2 in my .1 C2S)....but wont sound the same. Either way you go, the 911 in general is an awesome car and you can't go wrong in any direction!

Jim986

Personally I find the low-end torque of the 991.2 to be far more fun/useful than the NA sound. The 991.2 with the Sport Exhaust sounds pretty darn good to me! My wife says its to loud Ha Ha!

D W

As others have stated, you pretty much have to pick which is your priority... NA flat 6 wail or low end torque from turbos that mute the sound. A DeMan 4.5L engine build is one possible (expensive) answer.

rpasea

I just acquired a 992 C2S 7MT and love the low end torque of the 3L engine. The car is a great daily with a feisty side at Sport+. Good car for a one car garage. I like to rev a car on the track or out in the country but around town the low end torque makes for a great dd.

PJ Cayenne

The C8 must have been awful to trade for a base 991.1. No fan of GM here, but I'd take the C8 all day long in lieu of the .1 C2. The .2 tuned will rock you world, but it won't sound like a V8 no matter what you do. Best of luck with your new 911, it is a great car, just not a drag strip monster.