thesaintusa

1. Would be very surprised if they could not fix it up to the point you couldn't tell it was damaged.

2. I agree that the Michelins offer more predictable grip than the P-Zeros (when to hydroplaning), but they are still prone to hydroplane.

3. Never knew about Horne's formula.

4. That being said, I am sure many of us have done autox with R-cmpd tires/slicks in the rain with no issues. I was always amazed at how much grip you could have on a soaked course with RA1s or A008s, but once you lost grip and started sliding, trying to recover was very different than if you were running a street tire.

5. Glad that the OP was not injured.

Ceepe

Sorry man. I know you must feel bad. Try not to blame yourself. It's a hard enough time in society. Sometimes strange things occur with cars and physics, and they happen fast. I consider myself a skilled driver and a couple years ago put a F80 M3 into a boulder on the side of the road.

That does not look like significant damage or frame involvement to me.

Id have it brought to the dealership as a first step, if you don't have a body shop you know and trust.

I also have Geico and have made a couple claims. They seem pretty timely and fair with payment amounts. They should be able to square things away pretty quickly.

I will add I took out the 991.2 GT3 on a colder morning with damp roads on Michelin cup 2's, coming out of a two lane road sweeping turn I added maybe 1/3 throttle at 4K RPM, lost the back in a shockingly unexpected way, with oncoming traffic and cars in front and behind me. Made 3 corrections in all and went off on my side much further than the M3 time. This time I found a perfectly smooth section of grass, for which my brain was saying how am I not hitting anything? To me that was a freak thing. Sounds like yours was too, if not more so.

Norge911

I think so, they do a lot of business for Porsche West. Just call and ask.

Norge911

New tires, for daily driving and the big rain we get here, try Michelin Sport 4S. What I have on my T. Good tire.

stout

Glad you are generally fine ad that no one else was hurt—that is by far the most important thing. It could have been a lot worse, and there is no use beating yourself up about it or feeling guilty other than to help you learn and move on. Sounds like you are on that road already.

Also: As noted here, a lot of drivers get it wrong when it comes to modern 911s. They think they're driving the sports car when a 7 Series sedan (or, for that matter, an F250) blows past them in the rain, but they forget that a modern 911's wide tires and light weight are a tough combo in standing water or heavy rainfall at freeway speeds...no matter what tire is on the car.

Your 911 looks fixable, but even if it isn't, you are okay and will live on to drive many fun miles in fun cars—now that bit safer for yourself as well as others.

subwoofer

This is interesting and I wasn't aware of Horne's formula. It is quite old and it seems there are newer models that take into account roadway structure , water depth, vehicle (tires, tread etc.) and driver input. Regardless, my C4S is nowhere as stable in the rain or snow as my wife's Volvo with 235 mm wide tires and a reactive awd system (Haldex). The wide tires don't help and the car's directional stability seems very susceptible to ruts on the road surface. Combine that with water or snow and one is asking for trouble. Being my only car, I drive mine with trepidation in rain and snow. So much for these cars being touted as all purpose, everyday cars. In fantasyland perhaps. Dry roads is altogether different.
Very unfortunate that the OP discovered this in a crash.

BSO

My deepest sympathies, best thing, don't beat yourself up over this, even the best drivers lose car control.

It'll take some patience to make everything right, bottom line, you're still here.

When attending a Barber PTX driving class, we had rain most of the second day. We were driving the cars in the SC sport+ settings, but the instructors told us to switch to the "normal" chassis setting via the console switch to allow the suspension more compliance. The car I drove was a GTS and I was surprised how much traction it had in the wet (the track was monitored for any run-off and build-up). Even then, we had one driver spin out and hit the barriers.

I would suggest to not use sport/sport+ in the rain and drop down to SC normal. Of course, personal choice, but in heavy traffic and bad downpour it could make a difference.

Living in Florida, it's nice to have the AWD in my C4S for the wet.

Good luck.

Bemo

OP - glad you're safe. What's done is done, hopefully you can fix the car and enjoy it. From personal experience, 4S is an infinitely better tire than Pirellis, to be driving on wet roads, hydroplaning aside...

Keep us posted and I hope to see your GTS back on the road, soon!

alex_c

I would highly recommend taking it to Momentum Collision on I-10. They are a Porsche certified repair center. I took my Macan GTS a couple of years ago when it was rear-ended. It turned out to be totaled, but they did a thorough job at getting all the items that needed to be repaired/replaced which made it easy to work out with the insurance company.

97supratt

Lmaooo

For me, I’ll just fill up to 144 and see what happens.

D1coach

Very trusted shop in the Houston Porsche community

bkrantz

The last time I dug into automotive hydroplaning dynamics, I think I remember seeing that tread design does indeed have an effective, as does rubber compound.

But generally speaking, weigh does not matter. Since tires deform, the stress (force per area) between the tread and the road surface is controlled by air pressure in your tire. No matter the load (within reason) the stress will always equal the inflation pressure. What pressures do you run in your F350?

Noah Fect

Interesting, thanks for the pointer to Horne's Formula. Hadn't heard of that one. Can you address the questions of tire tread depth, pattern, and/or compounds? Most people who have driven for more than a couple of years are aware that different tires perform very differently in the wet -- or at least, they (we) are under that impression. Tires with a lot of wear seem to perform worse than newer tires as a rule, regardless of brand. Is that not correct?

It's also hard to understand how the hydroplaning equation is truly weight-independent. Why is the pressure alone important, and not the size of the contact patch?

(Edit: Thinking about it, I can see how the case can be made that the total force exerted at the leading edge of the contact patch is what matters, and that's not as dependent on weight as the overall patch area is. Weight would only influence the width of that leading edge, and then only slightly. Meanwhile, how effective it is at shoving water out of the way would be mostly a function of pressure.)

Reader

Thanks a lot for all you replies, they made feel much better knowing that I am not the only one who has done this mistake. I am grateful that I am not injured and I learnt a lesson that could have turned into a more gruesome situation had I hit another innocent passenger or injured myself.

Geico called me today and they mentioned that I can repair the car wherever I want. Now the question is which is a better body repair shop in Houston, is it:
1. Collision Plus ll, or
2. Momentum Collision West?

Appreciate your feedback and I willl keep you updated on the progress of the repair.

kwikit356

OP: You stated that in addition to the rain the air temperature was low. Do you recall what the temperature was in degrees F? I cannot speak for others, but my experience with Pirelli N0 P-Zeros in even slightly wet conditions with the ambient air temp at about 45-50 degrees F was not good. When you start to hydroplane you pretty much become just a passenger in the car, except for the old racing phrase "in a spin, both feet in." That's referring to a car with a clutch pedal. The idea being that once you have failed to recover and have entered a spin, push hard on the brake and clutch pedals so that when you regain some traction you don't just shoot across the track. I have no personal knowledge of how well this would apply to hydroplaning on standing water, until you regain some traction.

Your car certainly looks like it can be repaired just fine. It sounds like you took quite a jolt, so even with this darn corona virus it may be a good idea to get a professional medical evaluation. Rapid deceleration with resulting contact against a hard or accelerating object (airbag) is not particularly good for the human body. Best of luck to you!