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Old Oct 20, 2019 | 01:00 PM
  #61  
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drcollie
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Originally Posted by Jack F
Seems like a similar argument can be made with copper vs Pex plumbing. Takes more skill to run a house full of copper. It’s old school and has worked for decades. Pex allows many new plumbers to plumb a house. It’s faster. Anyone can do it.

Pdk vs Manual. PDK is faster around the track and it allows you to focus on being a better driver. Manual might be more fun for some. Some have more fun in a PDK car. Now if you are an excellent driver with a manual transmission then that’s great. But you’ll be slower around the track compared to an equally equipped PDK car. PDK doesn’t allow for great lap times. It gives the driver the potential for faster times. The driver needs to execute.

The good thing is that a Porsche is likely to continue offering a manual transmission at least in some 911s. That way you can row your own. To each his own. Porsche knows what their customers want and they got hell when the GT3 was PDK only.
Oh yes, I agree entirely. For winning a race, I'll take a PDK any day. Also, for winning a race, computer controlled aerodynamics on race slicks. And for winning a race, why not remove the driver and simply have an electric drone car that is run from a software program keyed to the track? Point is, with tech you can keep pushing the car UP until you no longer need the human in the vehicle. In 2019, the weak link is really the driver - but who wants to watch drones race one another?

Remember when the BMW E36 M3 first appeared in 1995? What a great car, it was affordable at $ 42K new in the day and so totally competent. Just a beautiful car to drive fast on the track, it was so forgiving and easy. It made a lot of mediocre drivers (including myself) look really good. I was between 911's and had one myself. Then one day I sold that car and bought a 993 C4S (1996) and went to the track. What a handful that car was hustling it around VIR. Now you really had to pay attention or that car would bite you in the *** faster than you can say WTF? The stock suspension was totally incapable of handling the climbing esse's and the car was begging for a set of coilovers to keep up with those pesky M3's. It wasn't that the 993 was a bad car, its that the BMW M3 was a great car.

Fast forward to 2010. I moved into a Boxster S, totally stock manual trans with not a single mod on it. Street tires from the factory. I was asked to instruct for an event so what the heck. I'd mostly retired from Instructing but knew a lot of the people there so figured I'd go out. Shenandoah circuit at Summit Point. Two guys show up on trailered 996 GT3's with full cages in livery with Cup tires on them, they're in full Sparco suits and look like they were ready for 24 Hours of Daytona. Fellow Instructors, with really set-up cars. I made note to check my mirrors for these guys, they would be coming up fast and to clear way for them in the Instructor session. We go out and I'm having a lot of fun in my Boxster S, this is a tight circuit and a mid-engined car does well on it. Where are those pair of GT3's? They have to be behind me and coming up fast. Careful, mind your mirrors. About ten minutes into this run, I spot them ahead of me, I'm gaining on them. Three more laps and I have passed both of them. Who'd have thought? Certainly not I. Point is, the gear and tech didn't make them fast. I learned that lesson back in 1998 riding hot laps with Bill Auberlen at New Hampshire Int'l Speedway, it was eye-opening what he could do with a bone stock car.

I'm not down on PDK and turbo 911's, they're great. They give more customers what they want in the Porsche brand and that keeps the marque alive. There was a time in the early 90's when it was questionable if Porsche was going to go under. Adapting to what the customers want and building cars that are easier to drive and less likely to bite was paramount (along with making the Cayenne). They've done well now, and their SUV's outsell their sports cars. But it allows the sports car end to survive and keep moving forward. I'm all for that. I'm just one of those old guys you younger ones like to make fun of, pulling the gears myself and working that tach in the higher horsepower range and enjoying the wail of my Tubi exhaust all the time with a Medicare card in my wallet. It's nice that Porsche has not jettisoned us old traditionalists.
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Old Oct 20, 2019 | 04:04 PM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by drcollie
I'm just one of those old guys you younger ones like to make fun of, pulling the gears myself and working that tach in the higher horsepower range and enjoying the wail of my Tubi exhaust all the time with a Medicare card in my wallet. It's nice that Porsche has not jettisoned us old traditionalists.

I like to believe not all of us younger folks think that way. I can’t speak for anyone else but I love rowing through the gears, keeping it high on the revs and enjoying the cacophony of my SharkWerks exhaust. I’m sure there are others like me, and I’m happy that Porsche still caters to us. I can’t fault my T for anything other than missing the howl of a NA flat six, and the car more than makes up for it by doing everything else so fantastically.


To the OP, test drive both and see what floats your boat. IMO, If you’re planning to daily your Carrera through snowy winters or lots of rain, you’d benefit from PTV on the S/GTS/ManualT. The stance looks better with SPASM but you’d be sacrificing ride quality. SC is great for faster shifts and improved 0-60 times. RAS is really awesome and makes the car feel as small as a 981 when turning. No experience with PDCC so can’t comment. Horsepower wise, GTS>S>T/Base, but comes with slightly increased lag due to bigger turbos. For a weekend focused 911, I’d say get all the go fast options. For a luxurious daily in good weather, the base is perfect with no performance options, Burmeister, glass sunroof (or convertible) and lots of leather. It’s a fantastic car and you can’t go wrong as long as you know what you want.
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Old Oct 20, 2019 | 04:22 PM
  #63  
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I started with a CPO S in a 2013 Carbiolet. I wanted the S because to me the extra horsepower and red brakes were a must. In 2014 that changed with the turbos on the base models but you still have to tune them and potentially void warranty or have to get chip work done. To me that’s a pain in the ***. I’d rather get what I want to begin with and not have to do aftermarket work.
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Old Oct 20, 2019 | 08:04 PM
  #64  
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S, Sports Chrono, sports plus seats, no sunroof. Its the best deal out there used, perhaps even better than the new vette. Track PDK, otherwise manual. 350 hp in a camry is great but in a sports car feels weak.
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