Ceramic Pro - failure?
12-10-2018, 04:36 PM
#46
Rennlist Member
Glumes from China offers a cheap one I've seen for $6 delivered price for a small bottle, 25 or 30 ml I think. Anyone with experience with this brand?
12-10-2018, 06:04 PM
#47
I've done OptiCoat Pro Plus on multiple cars with great results. I did CQuartz once with awful results. Both done by high end detailers with great reputations.
The OptiCoat was worth every penny. The CQuartz was a massive rip off.
The OptiCoat was worth every penny. The CQuartz was a massive rip off.
12-10-2018, 06:29 PM
#49
Same goes for my Boxster GTS. I did a full correction then PowerLock+ in April. Also use Griot's Spray On Wax or Meg's UFF after each wash. Eight months later and water just beads and rolls off.
I like to try new and cool things, but I haven't been able to bring myself to go ceramic yet. A bottle of PowerLock+ is $30 and lasts years. I've done my 4GC, Miata, BGTS, and my wife's Murano and still have about 1/3 of my original bottle left. That's kinda crazy.
I haven't done anything to my 911 other than hit it with some Ultimate Fast Finish after washing. My assessment is it's great as a maintenance item but nowhere near PowerLock+ as a standalone sealant. But my 911 also has PPF on the front, which is new to me. Because of that I haven't decided what to do with it. I'm leaning towards PowerLock+ though. If it did not already have a PPF I would have had a full paint correction, PPF, and ceramic job done as soon as I got it.
One thing I will note is that all my cars are garaged. Not just at home, but at work too. My wife's vehicle is garaged at home but sits outside in the sun at work. It also only gets washed a couple of times a year. I sealed hers in Sep 2017 and the next time I washed it was late March 2018. By then the sealant was ineffective. Not sure if that was due to exposure to the sun or a lack of maintenance.
12-10-2018, 06:39 PM
#50
Rennlist Member
All of this stuff has never been proven to me as worth the cost. You need to consider a few things before considering spending the money for ceramic pro. Such as whether you will be using the car as a daily driver, will it be garaged, what type of weather do you have in your area. Think about this: how many 991 Porsches have you seen that the paint looked bad after 4, 5 or 6 years? Have you ever been told by a really good detailer that he cannot get your paint back to looking like new? Sure, you get a clear bra to protect against chips, etc., but do you really think that paint protection does anything better than a good detailing? You are dealing with clear coat finishes that are not that great from the factory so you are only trying to get some luster from the clear coat. Go to a dealer and closely look at a new car on the floor and then look at a really well detailed 5 year old car and see if you can find a difference - I bet it would be insignificant if at all. You can use a very inexpensive detailing spray after washing your car and get all the beading you want if that is what you want.
12-10-2018, 06:42 PM
#51
Rennlist Member
I just purchased a gallon jug of bead maker, have a friend that swears by it. It’s sittng in my garage along with a slew of other things I’ve bought in adavance of my new 991.2s arrival.
12-10-2018, 06:58 PM
#52
It’s fine for a cheap quick detailer at a gathering or lubricant for drying. It also does a great job if you need to use something in the sun. But.... it’s nowhere near the marketing propaganda claims. Just like hydrosilex.
12-11-2018, 12:21 AM
#53
Rennlist Member
I'll support what Moe said - as I hit my "T" with Reload this weekend after a quality wash seeing as I've gone over a month driving with no wash. My car was (carefully) DIY'd with CQuartz UK when I took delivery in March and this was the first I've had a chance to apply Reload. Well - I'll say that I was stunned with the results from the Reload tuneup. I'm not a detailing maniac, so the performance for (lack of) elbow grease is perfect for me. Way better than I ever got with Klasse or Carnuba on my 993.
Just my 2 bits.
cheers!
Just my 2 bits.
cheers!
12-12-2018, 02:15 AM
#55
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Lots of great info here, but almost same amount of "opinions" as well.
First and foremost, nano/ceramic coatings are NOT the answer to poor care. If anyone tells you you don't worry about washing, caring, maintaining, etc., then they're giving you a false hope of what the product limitations are.
Properly done, this assumed installer expertise and true nano coating, you should enjoy an easy and carefree experience for 2-3 years, depending on coating...longer if garage queen or not daily driver.
Lifetime warranties, or any "time" warranty is as good as the paper it's written on...common sense always trumps gimmicks. To my knowledge, there is no tool or test that unequivocally deciphers coating failure. By that, I mean that there's no test that proves product/installer/user failure...so, how can you warranty something you have no way of verifying its failure.
When people call us and ask what our warranty is, we state we have NO warranty...they think we're joking, but we're not.
I know that product we use, CQuartz, is solid. I know our installation is solid. What I don't know is how someone's home care is. All we can do is set clients up with proper products and guide them with techniques that are simple and effective. Someone following that routine, will most likely see excellent ROI. Someone going through car washes at gas station or having a detailer not familiar with nano coatings and applying improper products/technique to coating, then there's no warranty for that.
A LOT of work goes into a proper installation...days, sometimes weeks. So, if you got a same-day service for $500, then you probably are going to get what you paid for.
There is A LOT of science and expertise to a proper correction and coating application. Simply as that.
Can you achieve amazing results without an arm/leg....absolutely.
There are excellent nano spray sealants out there that will give you far superior results than traditional waxes/sealants, at fraction of the time...CarPro Reload comes to mind.
On a new car, wash/ironx/eraser/Reload...results are stunning and will cost you less than $100 and take 2-3 hours tops at your home.
Will it be the same results as a CQuartz Professional or Finest Reserve, no. But better than wax/sealant, yes.
So, I hope this helps understand coatings...they're not bulletproof and they're not snake oil either...well, it depends on the coating
Do your research, talk to those knowledgeable in the industry that will give you honest and unbiased answers.
As with anything, buyer be aware.
First and foremost, nano/ceramic coatings are NOT the answer to poor care. If anyone tells you you don't worry about washing, caring, maintaining, etc., then they're giving you a false hope of what the product limitations are.
Properly done, this assumed installer expertise and true nano coating, you should enjoy an easy and carefree experience for 2-3 years, depending on coating...longer if garage queen or not daily driver.
Lifetime warranties, or any "time" warranty is as good as the paper it's written on...common sense always trumps gimmicks. To my knowledge, there is no tool or test that unequivocally deciphers coating failure. By that, I mean that there's no test that proves product/installer/user failure...so, how can you warranty something you have no way of verifying its failure.
When people call us and ask what our warranty is, we state we have NO warranty...they think we're joking, but we're not.
I know that product we use, CQuartz, is solid. I know our installation is solid. What I don't know is how someone's home care is. All we can do is set clients up with proper products and guide them with techniques that are simple and effective. Someone following that routine, will most likely see excellent ROI. Someone going through car washes at gas station or having a detailer not familiar with nano coatings and applying improper products/technique to coating, then there's no warranty for that.
A LOT of work goes into a proper installation...days, sometimes weeks. So, if you got a same-day service for $500, then you probably are going to get what you paid for.
There is A LOT of science and expertise to a proper correction and coating application. Simply as that.
Can you achieve amazing results without an arm/leg....absolutely.
There are excellent nano spray sealants out there that will give you far superior results than traditional waxes/sealants, at fraction of the time...CarPro Reload comes to mind.
On a new car, wash/ironx/eraser/Reload...results are stunning and will cost you less than $100 and take 2-3 hours tops at your home.
Will it be the same results as a CQuartz Professional or Finest Reserve, no. But better than wax/sealant, yes.
So, I hope this helps understand coatings...they're not bulletproof and they're not snake oil either...well, it depends on the coating
Do your research, talk to those knowledgeable in the industry that will give you honest and unbiased answers.
As with anything, buyer be aware.
Your ceramic should not have failed after a year. Often the reason ceramic may fail prematurely is what type of maintenance you are doing. Depending on what you wash the car with, you might be rubbing it right off the car, or depending on the products you are using when you clean the car you could be negating the effect of the ceramic. Whoever you had detail the car and apply the PPF and Ceramic should have been able to give you some tips for care after the application. We also use Ceramic Pro and we tell every customer who gets it to buy "Car Pro Reload" which will act as a sacrificial layer for the ceramic to extend the life span of the coating and make sure you don't need to spend a bunch of money at the detail shop every 8 months after the coating goes on. Caring for your car after a ceramic coating shouldn't be any harder or more stressful than it was before the coating.
Thing's can definitely happen, and there is always the chance the product failed (rarely) or the prep work was not done well enough and the application was rushed. When done correctly, a ceramic coating is a great thing to do to care for your car, but when applied wrong, or when the best way to maintain it isn't communicated, the "snake oil" opinion unfortunately starts gaining ground.
Here is the link for the Car Pro Reload:
https://www.amazon.com/CarPro-Reload-Sealant-milliter-Sprayer/dp/B00L9A0AC8/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1544466128&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=carpro+reload&psc=1&smid=AM7POEJN815MU
Thing's can definitely happen, and there is always the chance the product failed (rarely) or the prep work was not done well enough and the application was rushed. When done correctly, a ceramic coating is a great thing to do to care for your car, but when applied wrong, or when the best way to maintain it isn't communicated, the "snake oil" opinion unfortunately starts gaining ground.
Here is the link for the Car Pro Reload:
https://www.amazon.com/CarPro-Reload-Sealant-milliter-Sprayer/dp/B00L9A0AC8/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1544466128&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=carpro+reload&psc=1&smid=AM7POEJN815MU
Just to prove the point, I had the cheapo Ceramic Pro spray (I think that is what is was) applied to my wife's car and it is still slick as a baby's bottom several months later and she does not take care of her car at all...
12-12-2018, 10:58 AM
#56
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Just to be clear, I've followed well worn and discussed...till the ears bled maintenance routines. In 11 months I've driven my car 9800mi and it is of course garaged. It is washed with high quality soaps via foam cannon or with diluted ONR. If that washes off ceramic pro then is really isn't worth spit. I don't expect this product to be a panacea but it should perform better than it has for me. I am pretty confident that there was a problem with the "install" of the product. I still need to speak with detailer- been a busy work week but he'll need to step up and make it right.
Just to prove the point, I had the cheapo Ceramic Pro spray (I think that is what is was) applied to my wife's car and it is still slick as a baby's bottom several months later and she does not take care of her car at all...
Just to prove the point, I had the cheapo Ceramic Pro spray (I think that is what is was) applied to my wife's car and it is still slick as a baby's bottom several months later and she does not take care of her car at all...
If it does contain any “waxes” or gloss enhancers, then it’s clogging the nano coating. Same goes for your soaps...there are many great soaps out there, but that doesn’t mean they’re nano-compatible...make sure you verify that.
and to clarify....nano isn’t washed off by any chemical, at least a quality nano products applied correctly...nano is removed via friction...polishing off or years of washing and/or wiping.
hope this helps.
i understand your frustration, but want you to be well-informed and educated before going to the installer and making a claim.
12-12-2018, 11:01 AM
#57
Three Wheelin'
I love Moe and I think he is the country's top PPF installer, but nobody (not even you Moe) is going to convince me that CQuartz or any of those coatings work.
I had it done twice on a 2016 MB AMG and both times it did nothing and then I did it OVER my Xpel on my 2018 Porsche and again it did nothing.
3 different installers, 2 different brands. Both times it did nothing. So, based on my own personal experience, it is worthless. Others feel differently but, that's my view..
I had it done twice on a 2016 MB AMG and both times it did nothing and then I did it OVER my Xpel on my 2018 Porsche and again it did nothing.
3 different installers, 2 different brands. Both times it did nothing. So, based on my own personal experience, it is worthless. Others feel differently but, that's my view..
12-12-2018, 11:11 AM
#58
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I love Moe and I think he is the country's top PPF installer, but nobody (not even you Moe) is going to convince me that CQuartz or any of those coatings work.
I had it done twice on a 2016 MB AMG and both times it did nothing and then I did it OVER my Xpel on my 2018 Porsche and again it did nothing.
3 different installers, 2 different brands. Both times it did nothing. So, based on my own personal experience, it is worthless. Others feel differently but, that's my view..
I had it done twice on a 2016 MB AMG and both times it did nothing and then I did it OVER my Xpel on my 2018 Porsche and again it did nothing.
3 different installers, 2 different brands. Both times it did nothing. So, based on my own personal experience, it is worthless. Others feel differently but, that's my view..
if you’ll indulge me, can you please answer a few questions for me.
1. when you say it didn’t work, what aspect of it? did it not bead up, did dirt not wash off immediately after being sprayed with water, did you notice same amount of swirls and scratches as you normally do?
2. Silly question...what CQuartz coating was used and was it applied by a CQuartz authoritized installer. And if the answer is yes, certified, what was his/her conclusion as to the reason costing failed in your experience.
3. Finally, what was your home care like? More importantly, what soap did you use and did you apply Reload?
My goal with this is to help you pinpoint the problem, and if you’re game, and depending on the outcome, get you a proper resolution. I have friends in low places at CarPro
CQuartz DOES work, even something as simple as Reload blows people’s mind. So with the actual coating, doesn’t matter which one, consumer or pro, you should see a night/day difference in performance.
I’ll make you a believer and we’ll get you sorted.
also, PM me who installed the coatings.
12-12-2018, 11:20 AM
#59
Three Wheelin'
I had my wife's Z4 done with CQuartz Finest. the car mostly sat in the garage, so in the course of a year, it got washed twice. (she only drove it 400 miles that last year) the second time, water didn't even bead up on it. Was totally the installer. The CQuartz that I put on the cayenne myself held up fine for 2 years.
12-12-2018, 12:07 PM
#60
Rennlist Member
It appears that most of the skeptics, including myself, live in areas of the country that see the harshest of weather conditions. Those that are fortunate enough to live in the SW or in FL don't have nearly the same adverse conditions that the rest of us face. I formerly resided in Southern CA where vehicles needed cleaning far less often and could easily be rinsed off with little to no effort, this was long before ceramic coatings and other similar products were even available.