.2PDK

It's surreal when you look at how much quicker they are, makes you wonder if they brought out the .1 line just to make the .2 look so good.

Peter80

Just got a 991.2 Carrera S. Superb but not keen on that turbo whistle, reminds me of flying in a jet airliner. Maybe that's good! Still a lot better than my previous 718 Boxster S sound, the only flaw though as the roadster was otherwise a brilliant car, possibly better looking and handling than the 911..

Dom991.1

shing911500e

Can't thank you all enough for the feedback. Did I mention that the 991.2 in question is 300mi away from where I live? Yep, it is. So a friend and fellow Rennlister who lives nearby is going to check it out for me, take it for a drive, and let me know what he thinks etc

@stout comments on the pairing of the turbo motor and pdk make a ton of sense to me. As do @stormrunes comments about niether car having sport Chrono. When I drove the C4 I definitely recall it gear hunting a lot. I also felt most upshifts in auto with the sport button engaged were too frequent and biased toward what seemed like a fuel saving software mapping. Should I expext the same gear hunting in the .2?

The comments about the virtues of all wheel drive are not lost on me either. Im a skier. The thought of throwing snow tires on the C4 and heading to Tahoe in a storm is awesome. Then again, the turbo car will do far better on the power curve at elevation vs the NA in the C4. @stout, did you drive in any snow in in the Carrera T when you drove it in Europe? I remember you mentioning in another post that your tester had snow tires on it.

The turbo whistle is a concern. Is it that pronounced? Of the few videos I've seen of the .2 it actually seems more pronounced from outside the car than inside the car.

More to report once my friend drives the 991.2.

.2PDK

True, perception is everything.

Buddy of mine took me out for a spin in his Z06 and I thought death was imminent...

koala

Yes, I really feel the Cayman, in particular, is the best looking car Porsche makes and there is no doubt they handle better. But, the 4 cylinder sounds like a Subaru.

K-A

Fair game. I'm pretty sure the .1 base they tested had a manual, or the conditions were very poor (because manual .1 base cars put up around those 0-60's, a Sport+ PDK car will be significantly quicker). I haven't found one 991.1 magazine tested with PDK. Porsche's official time for a .1 base with PDK AND Sport Chrono is 4.1 0-60, which means high 3's should be attainable as everyone beats their published time. The fastest PDK (again, all magazines tested manuals) time I've seen published by 991.1 owner was a 115 MPH trap. Just 3 MPH lower than the fastest .2 base trap speed. Again, bigger difference in acceleration, yet the trap speeds are more in line with the more modest published HP differences.

As for the S times, that further proves how the difference is in acceleration, and not so much actual power. The fastest PDK 991.1 S tested was a 2012.5, which clocked a 3.6 0-60 (insanely fast for an N/A car with 400 HP) and 11.7 (or maybe 11.8, have to look it up) at 118 MPH. The trap speed is only 2-3 MPH off of the .2 test you posted.

And to look at ring times, a PDK .2 CS did it at 7.34. While a PDK .1 CS did it at 7.37.9. Again, not a big difference, and I'm assuming the base cars would also be within 3-4 seconds (Porsche is like exacto-knife clockwork when it comes to how controlled they keep the variances of their cars lap times within each other).

I'm not diminishing how fast the .2's are. But if they're rockets, then the .1's are slightly slower rockets. And IMO when you look at how close the best .1 times are vs the best .2 times, knowing that it's purely on motor with the involving elements you get from that, it's quite impressive.

As for seat of the pants. The base .2 with no performance options I drove didn't feel much faster than my .1 with Sport-Chrono, exhaust, and (lighter) HRE's. I actually felt that mine *felt* a bit faster due to the louder and more visceral sensations it emits. It was when looking at the speedo where I noticed the .2 was building speed a bit quicker.

K-A

Lol. TSE is just trolling some of the ".2 is lightning on wheels" crowd.

To me, the differences after driving both base models back to back, is that they're a lot more similar in speed and power than they are different. They just make their power much differently and the torque gets the .2's off the line quicker. Like I pointed out above, you can literally deduce the difference in actual power by the fairly similar (within 2-4 MPH) trap speeds between equal .1 vs .2 models. Personally, I never go WOT off the line, hence why the .2's chief advantage isn't as noticeable to me as is the more relative similarity in broad-powerband (i.e trap speed) performance.

I hear ya. The 911 has always been my ultimate dream car, but after driving a 718 S for a while, I would have gotten it if not for the engine sound. The engine performance? Nearly perfection, save for a bit more turbo lag and a bit of a monotonous torque curve (and very monotonous sound), but that's simply because I find more joy and challenge in an ascending N/A style powerband. It was seriously one of the most fun experiences I've ever had. Immensely more visceral and raucous than modern 911's. It's just that sound....

Dr. Ice

///M3THOD

Why not just go test a C2 at a local dealership?

IMO, all of the appeal of the .1 motor is when you can get it into the upper half of the rpm range and enjoy the car during some spirited driving. For a DD car, the .2 will be immensely more useable and satisfying. During regular low rpm driving, I don't want to say the .1 C4 is slow, but its not exactly.. well, fast.

K-A

Having driven a .1 C4 and comparing it to my .1 C2, I will say that the extra heft and sapped power from the drivetrain is noticeable. It'll still be comfortably in the 12's, but it's noticeably not as snappy as the 2WD version. Then again, I just don't see the need for an AWD 911 in anything less than a snowy climate (which not sure if O/P is in) as one of the chief benefits of the rear engine is how immensely traction friendly it is. Though, I have seen people state that AWD 911's corner more confidently, at least for layman driving.

minthral

I considered a 991.1 GTS and a 991.2 C4 (both PDK). I don't care what the numbers say because I don't race/track my car, but here are my impressions:

Of course, the biggest different is the engine. Driving them back to back, I the .2 C4 car felt significantly faster than a .1 GTS. The .2 C4S that I ended up buying is insanely fast. I wasn't impressed with the GTS power delivery...it felt like it had some hesitation at lower RPMs with the PDK, especially at a dead stop. The .2 felt better mated with the PDK, revved/responded quicker and smoother. The main difference can be felt from a dead stop or at slow speeds then getting to 70 MPH. Moving at 45 MPH+ or trying to pass, both felt fast after a downshifting to first gear, but still the turbo had the edge. A daily driver wants a quicker 0-45 time and low end torque to zip around traffic or get moving from a stop easier. I read that a PDK .2 C4S with options like SC etc gets to 60 in 3 seconds (exceeding published spec) and I can believe that because it does feel fast. Due to the slight hesitation with PDK and requirement to rev high, the .1 GTS felt slower than published time. If you google youtube videos of 0-60 times for .1 991, you can actually see this for yourself. If you get on a track, I think the comparison would be closer and some might even prefer the NA 3.8 in the GTS. IMO, the newer engine is leagues ahead in performance. I'm sure there are NA engine advocates here that will defend their car to the grave and being someone who also likes NA engines I can relate, however after driving this well designed twin turbo engine, I'd rather have it than the out-going NA engine. It doesn't even feel much like a turbo... it feels like an NA engine that's been given a shot of adrenaline.

Both cars have the flat 6 scream/wail at high RPMs, but at lower RPMs, the NA engine had more sound but also more drone that I wasn't comfortable with. I turbo engines naturally have less drone due to the turbos acting as resonators. The sound is less raspy/crude in the .2, which I perceive as more refined/smooth. After having a 981 boxster with a loud aftermarket exhaust, making lots of noise is out of my system and I prefer the quieter .2. I rather hear the the engine and other character sounds like intake/turbo rather than a bassy exhaust.

Aside from the engine, the .2 car simply felt like a better overall car. The AWD system is improved to outperform the RWD. Tires/wheels are wider. The suspension feels tighter and handling is more solid. Steering wheel looks and feels better. Everything is just more refined in the face-lifted car. I liked simple stuff like the door handles are part of the door instead of a separate piece.

Both are great cars, but between the two, MY preference is the newer .2. I like these cars because of how they handle and feel, rather acceleration. An 4S model with all options to maximize handling (AWD, rear steering, sport PASM, PDCC, Sport Chrono) gets my preference. The fact that is insanely fast allowing to effortlessly pass people just sweetens the deal, however I don't drive 100 MPH on public roads.

///M3THOD

I think this is the best way to put it!

Ive not driven a .1 C4, but I was assuming the AWD system, with the lower tq figures, probably impacted the performance noticeably in the base Carrera level. How capable is the C2 in the snow with some winter tires? From my understanding, its really the tires that determine how capable the car can perform in colder weather. I live in ATL and we may have 10-15 days over the winter where we are near freezing or below. I don't switch out my tires and the PZero's that came with the car literally become bricks. I DD my GTS and it has to be driven very carefully because traction is definitely compromised.

sampelligrino

Oh boy here we go again

I actually was in the same shoes as the OP comparing similar cars but opposite direction, 991.1 C2 CPO and 991.2 C4 brand new (obviously the C4 cost a lot more but cost wasn't a priority consideration for me between the two cars)

The newer car, newer tech (I love Apple CarPlay) and more aggressive looks sold me on the 991.2 *before considering the engines*

the 991 Carrera NA vs Turbo debate will wage on as everyone has a "side", I switched from NA to turbo after putting my money where my mouth is and took a chance on the newer engines

Won't look back, love the 3.0TT engine and it's even swayed my opinion of the 488 vs 458 and GT2RS vs GT3RS actually even though I am not in the market for that type of car by any means

At the end of the day both the 991.1 and 991.2 are amazing, both are better options than 99% of their competitors or what else is out there in my humble opinion. But I would go .2 over .1 any day of the week *personally* and I am sure there are others who would go .1 over .2 any day of the week for their own reasons which is fair

K-A