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Difference between Sport and Sport+ for 991.2

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Old 03-19-2018, 12:40 PM
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reacher
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Default Difference between Sport and Sport+ for 991.2

I took my 991.2 GTS out for a 200-mile drive over the weekend, and I did the first half in Sport+, and the second half in Sport. I would have thought Sport+ would be the more aggressive, fun mode, but I found the opposite to be true. The car felt a lot more eager, lively, and fun in Sport mode compare to Sport+. It's almost like the car felt a little artificially restricted in Sport+, like something was dulling the experience. It didn't feel like it just came down to just throttle mapping either, it really felt like the performance characteristics of the car were different, with Sport being the more aggressive and more fun mode.

It wasn't necessarily a huge difference, but it was noticeable. I was pushing the car really hard and I tested the modes back to back over 200 miles so I don't think I'm just imagining things either.

Does anyone know what the differences really are between the two modes?
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Old 03-19-2018, 01:04 PM
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I think you really notice it on track in auto mode with sport plus holding revs higher in general. I think it is less noticeable in manual mode imo.
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Old 03-19-2018, 02:16 PM
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reacher
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Originally Posted by seapar View Post
I think you really notice it on track in auto mode with sport plus holding revs higher in general. I think it is less noticeable in manual mode imo.
Shift points are definitely different, but I was driving in manual mode the whole time and I was noticing the difference mainly in throttle response and how hard it seemed to pull.
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Old 03-19-2018, 03:02 PM
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Deleted. Double post. Dang this iPad.
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Old 03-19-2018, 03:05 PM
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This is what you are looking for. Note that the gurgle is only available in sport mode. Unlike the 991.1.


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Old 03-19-2018, 03:55 PM
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So basically “sport plus” should be the overall sportier/sharper setting compared to “sport” apart from the exhaust backfire noise.
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Old 03-19-2018, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Mark993TT View Post
So basically “sport plus” should be the overall sportier/sharper setting compared to “sport” apart from the exhaust backfire noise.
That's exactly what I was expecting, but it sure didn't feel that way to me. The car felt much better in Sport mode.
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Old 03-19-2018, 04:15 PM
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arter
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And in automatic shift mode sport + takes it to the redlinne and sport doesnt.

So in manual shift mode you are taking over one of the most notable differences between the two modes.
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Old 03-19-2018, 04:22 PM
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I don't know what the throttle response differences are between normal, sport, and performance, but overly sharp throttle response is not what you want on a track. You want linear, progressive response that allows you to incrementally adjust your power to balance the car at the limit.

Hair trigger throttle response might feel good on the street at half-speed, but it's the last thing you want when really pushing a car.
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Old 03-19-2018, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Valvefloat991 View Post
I don't know what the throttle response differences are between normal, sport, and performance, but overly sharp throttle response is not what you want on a track. You want linear, progressive response that allows you to incrementally adjust your power to balance the car at the limit.

Hair trigger throttle response might feel good on the street at half-speed, but it's the last thing you want when really pushing a car.
That's what I was thinking, that the power curve was artificially adjusted to be more linear or something like that to be more predictable on the track. It feels very linear, but also restricted compared to Sport. I really don't think it's just a difference in throttle mapping, it feels like a difference in the actual power delivery. I was pushing the car really hard, flat out in a lot of portions, coming out of sharp curves, etc.

It would be interesting to see dyno charts in each mode to see what the differences are.
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Old 03-19-2018, 06:31 PM
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I don’t think dyno charts are going to help, there already is a topic on that somewhere on this sub forum (a bit of a can of worms) ;-)
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Old 03-19-2018, 06:42 PM
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My current car does not have Sport+, but i have owned and driven cars that do. I think the overly sensitive throttle calibration in Sport+ on the street can feel slower. There are various reasons that could be. Mixed with less sound qualities, the lack of embellished overrun sound, it could seem slower. I have not sampled a 1.2 car with the drive modes, but I could see the sensitive throttle being even more relevant with forced induction. I personally think it's less linear. As stated above, if one is not getting the more aggressive shift, because either driving in manual or having a manual, you would be missing the quality that makes Sport+ feel most responsive I guess.
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Old 03-19-2018, 06:57 PM
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I'm not sure why you would have perceived it that way beyond what others have already suggested.

One other performance-related difference between Sport and Sport Plus is that Sport Plus is the only mode where the car doesn't momentarily blip power off during the shift, nor does it try to provide a hint of slip to soften the transition. You should be able to detect it as a more notable kick in the seat of your pants during each shift. It's much more pronounced in my 991.2 than in was in the 991.1.
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Old 03-19-2018, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by StormRune View Post
I'm not sure why you would have perceived it that way beyond what others have already suggested.

One other performance-related difference between Sport and Sport Plus is that Sport Plus is the only mode where the car doesn't momentarily blip power off during the shift, nor does it try to provide a hint of slip to soften the transition. You should be able to detect it as a more notable kick in the seat of your pants during each shift. It's much more pronounced in my 991.2 than in was in the 991.1.
That's interesting, I haven't noticed that at all. Does it really do that in Sport mode? My X5M cuts power while shifting at WOT, and it's really frustrating. I never noticed my GTS doing anything like that. I always shift manually, though. Not sure if that makes a difference.

I also noticed my Huracan would have much harder shifts in corsa vs sport mode. I'm thinking if the PDK does the same thing, it must be very slight compared to my other cars. I'll keep an eye out for that when I drive it to get tuned tomorrow.
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Old 03-19-2018, 09:23 PM
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It was originally discussed in the Technic Introduction when the PDK was first introduced in the 997.2, which is where I became aware of it. I've included the pertinent section from the 997.2 manual at the bottom (note the RPMs and the kickdown/upshift have changed in the 991.2).

I've been experimenting as to whether I now prefer Sport or Sport Plus when I'm driving around in manual. I can clearly feel the difference in shifting behavior... sometimes the kick is enough that it serves to remind me I'm in Sport Plus even after the sporty part of my driving is over.

From the 997.2 PDK Introduction:
_
Driving in selector-lever position “M”, Sport and Sport Plus button not active
Upshifts and downshifts can be performed both on the steering wheel and using the selector lever. Gearshift comfort is therefore adaptive over the entire operating range and adapts to suit the driver's individual driving style. For improved gearshift comfort, the engine torque is reduced while changing gears. Downshifts in deceleration state are accomplished with very little intermediate throttle application and are therefore hardly audible. To avoid under-revving and the associated loss of driving comfort, the current gear is switched down to the next lower gear at engine speeds of less than approx. 1,200 rpm. An upshift at the engine speed limit is only accomplished if there is a kickdown in the speed limiting range (panic shifting). The vehicle always moves off in 1st gear. The Launch Control function (racing start) is not available.
_
Driving in selector-lever position “M”, Sport button active
Upshifts and downshifts can be performed both on the steering wheel and using the selector lever. Gearshift comfort is thus adaptive over the entire operating range and adapts to suit the driver's individual driving style, but basic sportiness is increased. The engine torque is reduced only slightly while changing gears. Downshifts in deceleration state are accomplished with intermediate throttle application. To avoid under-revving and the associated loss of driving comfort, the current gear is switched down to the next lower gear at an engine speed of less than approx. 1,200 rpm. An upshift at the engine speed limit is only accomplished if there is a kickdown in the speed limiting range (panic shifting). The vehicle always moves off in 1st gear. The Launch Control function (racing start) is not available.
_
Driving in selector-lever position “M”, Sport Plus button active
Upshifts and downshifts can be performed both on the steering wheel and using the selector lever. Gearshifts are not adaptive and are purely performance-oriented with a loss of comfort. In addition, the engine torque is not reduced while changing gears. Downshifts in deceleration state involve quick and audible intermediate throttle application with a sporty sound. To avoid under-revving and the associated loss of driving comfort, the current gear is switched down to the next lower gear at an engine speed of less than approx. 1,200 rpm. An upshift at the engine speed limit is only accomplished if there is a kickdown in the engine speed limit range (panic shifting). The vehicle always moves off in 1st gear. 7th gear is not used in this program. The Launch Control function (racing start) is available.
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