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Have been mulling over selling or even possibly trading in my 2011 ZR1 for a 14-15 Turbo S. Finally got to drive a nice example from a local dealer the other day ( with the salesman AND the wife in the back seat ) The sales guy I've known for a while and is really a decent and pleasant guy. He drove it hard enough to show me what it had for sure. I drove it not quite as hard obviously, but he did allow me a couple of Launch Control starts! ( definitely a thrill ride! ) What I'm struggling with really, is the fact that the car seems considerably more refined and well engineered than my lowly ZR1 of course.. but in at least stock form, is not nearly as "visceral" for lack of a better word. Also, just by seat-of-the-pants feel, although MUCH better at being able to use its power, especially at lower speeds, I can't help but feel that stock for stock, in some situations its definitely not a faster car! This troubles me because of the enormous difference in expense of the two vehicles at this time. I know I'm gonna get beat up here for sure, but is there a consensus out there that coming from a fairly blunt and violent instrument as a 640hp Corvette, I'm gonna find myself a little "bored" with this car? Oddly enough, this Certified car in question clearly had a cat-back exhaust and sounded amazing! I fired up a stock one for reference and was less than "enthused". Would the "not inconsiderable" expense of a Stage 2 tune/exhaust make such a difference in the car that I'd forget about where I'm coming from? I know these are extremely subjective questions, but my hope is that some of you out there will be helpful with your knowledge and advice. Thanks in advance for any feedback you can give.
I was coming from a 2014 Shelby with over 800 hp to the wheels, when I first jumped to the 997 TTS and then to my current 991 TTS. Can't be happier, the feel of the car, how it turns, both of the current TTS and the 997 had Stage 4's...so I never felt that I missed the Shelby. They are are two different animals, I would put the Shelby in the same muscle car category as the ZR1.
Go for it, you will not regret it...and when you get the mod bug, call Sam :-)
I am going to chime in. I have a 15TTS with over 20k miles. You nailed it with one word...the 991TTS is very refined but if you pit it in Sport Plus its a beast. I think it depends how you drive. If all you care about is 0-60 and straight line keep the vette. But if you like long drives in canyons and a car that does everything really really well get the TTS.
There is a reason its ALOT more expensive...engineering. The TTS is a wonder of the the modern world and dollar for dollar there is not a better car. I am thinking about doing a tune but the car is really fast and I have only added sharkwerks exhaust and new mich pilots 4S. Last but not least, if your an audiophile the Burmeister sound system is off the chart. You will not regret buying this car.
I have a few cars but the TTS is my favorite by a long shot.
Snap, very valid thoughts and personally I totally get it. I've always been a fan of Vettes and Vipers because muscle car! Even though they are much better nowadays nowhere near this car as far as checking off all the boxes. As for getting you the extra adrenaline it's in there just ready to be unleashed. I really love these cars and get very enthusiastic about them. So instead of sounding like a salesman read up about it. You can have a really brutal street car that will do everything you just have to tweak on it a little bit and there is so much readily available! Another interesting thing you will like to hear is that several 991 turbo owners have had a Vette!
We have a Z06 in the garage. And I've driven a variety of 'vettes on and off the track. So, no "Internet Armchair Quarterbacking" here...
Originally Posted by snaptaz
... I can't help but feel that stock for stock, in some situations its definitely not a faster car! This troubles me ...
It shouldn't. This is a case where your perceptions (your feelings and butt-o-meter) are simply wrong. The ZR1 is, in almost all envelopes, slower than a non-S 997 Turbo. And the 991 is faster than the 997.
... but in at least stock form, is not nearly as "visceral" for lack of a better word.
This. The body squirms a bit (due to the leaf-spring suspension.) The tires grab the steering wheel and yank (due to the low-offset front wheels and suspension geometry.) There's more noise. The seats move around under you. All of this makes it feel like you are faster and closer to the limit in the 'vette.
The 'vette is a way to 'kinda feel scared' but at lower speeds than you think you're doing.
But, in reality the 'vette's limits are far past that. It takes a while on the track to get past the 'drama' and begin to trust that while 'all sorts of stuff' may be happening the tires and suspension are glued.
Many, many years ago, I had to kick an instructor (first time at that particular track) out that was too 'used to' Porsches. He thought we were about to go sticky-side up at almost every braking point. He was seriously like a little girl crying...
Bottom line: The 'vette provides a more dramatic ride. The noise, the body movement, all of that contributes to warping your perceptions.
This can be a good and fun thing. It's far, far harder to get that 'visceral' in the 991 and when you do, you might be close to a serious incident. The 991 Turbo is faster than your brain. And that's a different kind of perception warp.
(Note: I do not 'dis the 'vette. IMO, when looking at late-model cars of all types it has the highest fun-to-dollar ratio.)
I also have a C7 Z06 and understand the sensation you are describing.
But one thing I've found with the Porsche Turbo is you have to live with it for a while to really begin discovering all of its talents, they don't become obvious on a test drive.
And that's when you really begin appreciating the TT, it gets better and better as you spend time with it.
The saying "the devil is in the details" applies here.
I second Porscheholic point, every time I get in mine which I have had for three months I am looking forward to what I am going to learn today. I come from a long line of performance cars and this is my first Porsche, it is without a doubt its own very different animal. The car has much more to offer than can be explored on the street. In my automotive journey I have zero regrets about this purchase.
We have a Z06 in the garage. And I've driven a variety of 'vettes on and off the track. So, no "Internet Armchair Quarterbacking" here...
It shouldn't. This is a case where your perceptions (your feelings and butt-o-meter) are simply wrong. The ZR1 is, in almost all envelopes, slower than a non-S 997 Turbo. And the 991 is faster than the 997.
This. The body squirms a bit (due to the leaf-spring suspension.) The tires grab the steering wheel and yank (due to the low-offset front wheels and suspension geometry.) There's more noise. The seats move around under you. All of this makes it feel like you are faster and closer to the limit in the 'vette.
The 'vette is a way to 'kinda feel scared' but at lower speeds than you think you're doing.
But, in reality the 'vette's limits are far past that. It takes a while on the track to get past the 'drama' and begin to trust that while 'all sorts of stuff' may be happening the tires and suspension are glued.
Many, many years ago, I had to kick an instructor (first time at that particular track) out that was too 'used to' Porsches. He thought we were about to go sticky-side up at almost every braking point. He was seriously like a little girl crying...
Bottom line: The 'vette provides a more dramatic ride. The noise, the body movement, all of that contributes to warping your perceptions.
This can be a good and fun thing. It's far, far harder to get that 'visceral' in the 991 and when you do, you might be close to a serious incident. The 991 Turbo is faster than your brain. And that's a different kind of perception warp.
(Note: I do not 'dis the 'vette. IMO, when looking at late-model cars of all types it has the highest fun-to-dollar ratio.)
Wow, I really appreciate what you have to say there! It definitely makes sense. I felt like I didn't really have enough time to "get to know" the TTS on a few minute test drive. On the contrary, with the ZR1, I knew within 30 seconds I was buying that car! Incidentally, I was coming out of a full-bolt-ons Z06 at the time, so it's not like I traded in a Camry! LOL!
Last edited by snaptaz; 05-29-2017 at 07:39 PM.
Reason: Misspelled
I have both..my ZR1 is a 2009 and I luv it as the "toy" that it is..for my use at least...the odd rip when I need that raw, loud, tire shredding blast around town,,I never track the garage queen and it's still fully stock with about 10K miles..
Now the TTS is much faster,,albeit mine is a stage IV the acceleration is mind numbing...you gotta be on your game when you do the slow roll to full throttle where as the vette has plenty it will just spin.The TTS launches you into jail territory in 3-4 seconds,,,think about that..
But I still luv my tweety and even tho I don't drive that much even with our short seasons I'll never part with her as she's a marvel of her day..
I have both..my ZR1 is a 2009 and I luv it as the "toy" that it is..for my use at least...the odd rip when I need that raw, loud, tire shredding blast around town,,I never track the garage queen and it's still fully stock with about 10K miles..
Now the TTS is much faster,,albeit mine is a stage IV the acceleration is mind numbing...you gotta be on your game when you do the slow roll to full throttle where as the vette has plenty it will just spin.The TTS launches you into jail territory in 3-4 seconds,,,think about that..
But I still luv my tweety and even tho I don't drive that much even with our short seasons I'll never part with her as she's a marvel of her day..
A quick pic of the two beasts,,
So lucky! Two stunning cars! I WISH I had the room and the funds to have both! 😊 Here is my Z with the TTS I was looking at this weekend :
Vettes are great but they feel very long to me and not as point and shoot, in addition they are, as you say, blunt and unrefined and you feel like you're sitting onto of the car rather than it it, C6 seating position is awful, and C7s feel huge in size... you can take a lot of the refinement our of the Turbo with a tune, an exhaust mod, and more aggressive suspension setup... they are the best all round car you can get (that and my FF)
Vettes are great but they feel very long to me and not as point and shoot, in addition they are, as you say, blunt and unrefined and you feel like you're sitting onto of the car rather than it it, C6 seating position is awful, and C7s feel huge in size... you can take a lot of the refinement our of the Turbo with a tune, an exhaust mod, and more aggressive suspension setup... they are the best all round car you can get (that and my FF)
I wanted a turbo AFTER I decided to build a race car alongside it. Not before. It is an incredible machine and a wonderful car for nearly any occasion, but it is not the most visceral beast. I also wanted an exhaust to greatly mitigate that until I realized how often the car being relatively quiet keeps me out of trouble by letting it fly under the radar of LEOs.
I really appreciate the great responses I've received so far. I always say "Car Guys" are some of the most decent people, LOL! I have a feeling that I will end up in a TTS at some point. I can't seem to shake the idea, plus I don't think it would be that difficult to go back into Corvettes in the future. There certainly are PLENTY of them! I just wish the "Certified" Turbo S's I'm seeing were about 10 - 15K down from where they are right now. I believe that if I sit it out just a few months longer it may be to my advantage. To me, I believe my ZR1 depreciation has almost "flattened out", but I feel the 991.1 TTS's may have another "dip" as the 991.2's saturate the market. Does this seem reasonable to anyone else?
05-29-2017, 12:04 PM
Struggling a little.
