film protection installation process and CQuartz - i'm little nervous
06-05-2016, 11:04 PM
#16
Race Director
Originally Posted by pelo911
the easy way is XPEL
they have headquarter here in Houston
and i can trust them
the only issue , i saw Suntek near Xpel on 2 GT4
the Suntek look better.
they have headquarter here in Houston
and i can trust them
the only issue , i saw Suntek near Xpel on 2 GT4
the Suntek look better.
I don't know this "sub" so can't make a comment +/-
Regardless, I agree Suntek is better. Anyway, I've offered all I have. Good luck.
06-05-2016, 11:07 PM
#17
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Have you considered posting on the RL Concours & Car Care subforum?
Or even asking for recommendations on McLarenlife.com?
Or even asking for recommendations on McLarenlife.com?
06-05-2016, 11:20 PM
#18
Racer
Thread Starter
Yes, XPEL is there and they can steer you in the right direction. I'd rather have XPEL put on by a competent installer than Suntek by a hack.
I don't know this "sub" so can't make a comment +/-
Regardless, I agree Suntek is better. Anyway, I've offered all I have. Good luck.
I don't know this "sub" so can't make a comment +/-
Regardless, I agree Suntek is better. Anyway, I've offered all I have. Good luck.
he using them:
Houston PPF
they are authorized installer from Xpel
http://locator.xpel.com/clearbra_ins.../Texas/Houston
they can install Xpel or Suntek , i can choose
06-06-2016, 09:48 AM
#22
What I can do tell is that finding the right installer can be a challenge, you really can't trust any of them. My advise is to go with someone that is A) authorized installer for the film themselves B) they have an online reputation for installing films and not just detailing.
I recently went through having my GT3 wrapped on what I thought would be XPEL. I trusted the installer who I found out did not even do the install since he was not a XPEL authorized installer and it was subbed out to someone else which until today I do not know who. Long story short, they did not even install XPEL on the car and used a completely different film but still charged me for XPEL. The film is crap, I have stone chips on the sides near the back wheels and there is minimal self healing if any. This is a detailer that is highly reviewed on forums in our area who I have used for detailing my vehicles in the past. After this experience, and a few other bad ones with various installers in our area from 3M to venture shield, I'm honestly giving up....You really can't trust anyone. I did consult with XPEL and they had me go to someone who wanted to charge me 10K for removal and re-installation of the film, $7500 alone to wrap the entire car which I thought was at least 40-50% higher than market prices.
If you have the money go with Moe, based on pics and amount of attention and detail they give into each car, that would be my choice but ofcourse you have to think about shipping costs and other factors if you are going that route.
Great points on XPEL, and don't you feel that on a black car, it takes away from the glossiness? you can immediately tell that the car has something on it. Suntek and XPEL are completely different in terms of thickness also, I'm still trying to figure out what film I have prior to replacing it, but I believe it's Suntek and I have stone chips all over on the sides near the back wheels. So if Suntek can't provide the protection necessary then it's also not the best choice.
It seems like all of these films are a headache, I'm not planning on wrapping any cars in the future. From finding the right installer to the film taking away from depth and shine specially on darker cars, it's not worth it in my opinion.
I recently went through having my GT3 wrapped on what I thought would be XPEL. I trusted the installer who I found out did not even do the install since he was not a XPEL authorized installer and it was subbed out to someone else which until today I do not know who. Long story short, they did not even install XPEL on the car and used a completely different film but still charged me for XPEL. The film is crap, I have stone chips on the sides near the back wheels and there is minimal self healing if any. This is a detailer that is highly reviewed on forums in our area who I have used for detailing my vehicles in the past. After this experience, and a few other bad ones with various installers in our area from 3M to venture shield, I'm honestly giving up....You really can't trust anyone. I did consult with XPEL and they had me go to someone who wanted to charge me 10K for removal and re-installation of the film, $7500 alone to wrap the entire car which I thought was at least 40-50% higher than market prices.
If you have the money go with Moe, based on pics and amount of attention and detail they give into each car, that would be my choice but ofcourse you have to think about shipping costs and other factors if you are going that route.
I've tried many films and Xpel is by far the worst, that's why installers keep dropping them and they're getting sued by 3M. I'm not even sure they'll be in business for much longer. Their film is way tackier than its competitors, debris and dirt sticks to it like a flytrap. #slighthyperble On any car I've tracked it's taken about three times as long to get clean than other films. It does not take to waxes well because of the aforementioned tacky/porous nature and will become hazy with many of them. I have it on my TTS and I had to have it completely coated with Opticoat Pro Plus and Reload just to make it manageable and smooth to the touch and to clean. Oh and it costs more to boot ... imo, just stay away from it. Unfortunately my incoming RS is also covered with Xpel, but it has Modesta on top so hopefully it'll be smooth, otherwise I'll have to have Reload applied to it as well to make it easy to clean.
Suntek is very good from what I hear but I've never tried it, the newest 3M Pro is the best imo. It is smooth to the touch like your car's paint, has all the self healing properties, takes waxes if you want to wax it, and takes any of the coatings like Cquartz, Opticoat pro Plus, Modesta, etc, very well.
As far as the templates, most installers use the Xpel software to do the precuts no matter which film they end up using, so that's not an issue. The templates will have existing gaps for all the badges and emblems. Now if you want a complete custom job where you see zero seams and film edges and everything is tucked away then you have to start removing parts off of the car, but most people don't bother with that any more unless they are doing a full color or matte wrap as opposed to a protection wrap. Your installer should know all this ... the general rule of thumb with wraps is the result is 10% material quality 90% installer skill.
Suntek is very good from what I hear but I've never tried it, the newest 3M Pro is the best imo. It is smooth to the touch like your car's paint, has all the self healing properties, takes waxes if you want to wax it, and takes any of the coatings like Cquartz, Opticoat pro Plus, Modesta, etc, very well.
As far as the templates, most installers use the Xpel software to do the precuts no matter which film they end up using, so that's not an issue. The templates will have existing gaps for all the badges and emblems. Now if you want a complete custom job where you see zero seams and film edges and everything is tucked away then you have to start removing parts off of the car, but most people don't bother with that any more unless they are doing a full color or matte wrap as opposed to a protection wrap. Your installer should know all this ... the general rule of thumb with wraps is the result is 10% material quality 90% installer skill.
It seems like all of these films are a headache, I'm not planning on wrapping any cars in the future. From finding the right installer to the film taking away from depth and shine specially on darker cars, it's not worth it in my opinion.
Last edited by ///Armin; 06-06-2016 at 10:15 AM.
06-06-2016, 11:09 AM
#24
OP, there is a GREAT Suntek installer in Austin. He worked with the chemists at Suntek to develop the film and is happy to chat about clarity, smoothness, color stability workability etc. all day long.
I can tell you from having used 3M (old), Xpel and Suntek that Suntek looks the best and is the only one that honestly disappears when applied well. My installer says that Suntek is more forgiving to work with and many of the reapplication marks, blurring you see on Xpel are from less skilled installers.
My RS is a hybrid of a modified cut pattern with wrapped edges. PM me if you want his contact info. He had $4M worth of cars in his shop recently, works alone, good guy. An entire car is about $4K.
I can tell you from having used 3M (old), Xpel and Suntek that Suntek looks the best and is the only one that honestly disappears when applied well. My installer says that Suntek is more forgiving to work with and many of the reapplication marks, blurring you see on Xpel are from less skilled installers.
My RS is a hybrid of a modified cut pattern with wrapped edges. PM me if you want his contact info. He had $4M worth of cars in his shop recently, works alone, good guy. An entire car is about $4K.
06-06-2016, 11:24 AM
#25
Instructor
Good morning Pelo,
I can send you an email, but yes Jason uses houston paint protection film for install and they do EXCELLENT work and stand by it to boot! They can do laser cut kits or full sheet custom (Suntek or XPEL). Houston PPF is who Ferrari of Houston uses exclusively. They are some of the best in Houston (visit their facebook page to see their work -- LaFerraris etc). I am very happy with my car! The best part about it is that they work seamlessly with the paint correction (application of right polishes/products) so that the film is properly applied and then the coating placed over it. There is warranty all the way around and no pointing fingers as the detailer and film installer work under the same umbrella. I went with XPEL as it seems more durable and has a longer warranty but is admittedly not as clear/disappearing as Suntek. I chose a bit heftier protection over look. Depends on where the car will see most of its miles in my opinion. They are both great films!
Give me a call/text if you have any questions.
Grant
I can send you an email, but yes Jason uses houston paint protection film for install and they do EXCELLENT work and stand by it to boot! They can do laser cut kits or full sheet custom (Suntek or XPEL). Houston PPF is who Ferrari of Houston uses exclusively. They are some of the best in Houston (visit their facebook page to see their work -- LaFerraris etc). I am very happy with my car! The best part about it is that they work seamlessly with the paint correction (application of right polishes/products) so that the film is properly applied and then the coating placed over it. There is warranty all the way around and no pointing fingers as the detailer and film installer work under the same umbrella. I went with XPEL as it seems more durable and has a longer warranty but is admittedly not as clear/disappearing as Suntek. I chose a bit heftier protection over look. Depends on where the car will see most of its miles in my opinion. They are both great films!
Give me a call/text if you have any questions.
Grant
Last edited by Birel22; 06-06-2016 at 11:46 AM.
06-06-2016, 01:02 PM
#26
The advice that my installer had:
"I use all precut patterns from Xpel software cut on Xpel Ultimate PPF and SunTek clearcoated Paint Protection Film. The SunTek film has a 5 year manufacturer's warranty and the Xpel Ultimate has a 10 year. I typically use the Xpel on light cars as it resists discoloring slightly better, and I use the SunTek on dark cars as it is much more forgiving and leaves less distortion in the adhesive."
Maybe something for others to consider. I have Xpel on my GT Silver for a year and a half, and am happy with the results.
"I use all precut patterns from Xpel software cut on Xpel Ultimate PPF and SunTek clearcoated Paint Protection Film. The SunTek film has a 5 year manufacturer's warranty and the Xpel Ultimate has a 10 year. I typically use the Xpel on light cars as it resists discoloring slightly better, and I use the SunTek on dark cars as it is much more forgiving and leaves less distortion in the adhesive."
Maybe something for others to consider. I have Xpel on my GT Silver for a year and a half, and am happy with the results.
06-06-2016, 01:04 PM
#27
Rennlist Member
Great points on XPEL, and don't you feel that on a black car, it takes away from the glossiness? you can immediately tell that the car has something on it. Suntek and XPEL are completely different in terms of thickness also, I'm still trying to figure out what film I have prior to replacing it, but I believe it's Suntek and I have stone chips all over on the sides near the back wheels. So if Suntek can't provide the protection necessary then it's also not the best choice.
It seems like all of these films are a headache, I'm not planning on wrapping any cars in the future. From finding the right installer to the film taking away from depth and shine specially on darker cars, it's not worth it in my opinion.
It seems like all of these films are a headache, I'm not planning on wrapping any cars in the future. From finding the right installer to the film taking away from depth and shine specially on darker cars, it's not worth it in my opinion.
As far as dulling the film plays a big part in it as well as what you do to it afterwards. Xpel will dull more than any other film, especially if you put wax on top of it, it just absorbs it like a sponge. IF one is going to use Xpel on a black car, then the paint has to be perfect, the installation has to be perfect, and they have to use a coating like Cquartz and then Reload on top of it. That's what I've done and now it looks almost like there's no protection on it and it's livable from a washing point of view.
3M Pro on the other hand is completely the opposite, you just put it on, it's as glossy as the paint, you don't need to use any ceramic coatings on it, just a little wax 2/3 times a year and forget it. Here's a pic of my old Z06 wrapped in it:
And the new Z in 3M next to the TTS in Xpel:
So it is possible to get the Xpel to look and feel like almost like it's not there, it's just an expensive ordeal to get it that way... that's why I would never recommend it to anyone. Just use the 3M Pro or Suntek ... they are simply superior products imo.
Last edited by soulsea; 06-06-2016 at 01:24 PM.
06-06-2016, 01:38 PM
#28
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
It's often recommended that if you do apply CQuartz, you do it on top of the PPF (be it Xpel or Suntek), and not below the PPF, because CQuartz is so slick that it interferes with the adhesion of the PPF.
06-06-2016, 02:30 PM
#29
Burning Brakes
My car is SBM and although I can tell there's Xpel on it no one else has ever noticed. The Xpel does have dings at the front and rear wheel arches and when hit with a stone no amount of "self-healing" is gonna work. My preference is to have film on to protect the paint and change the bra when needed if it starts to look real tatty. I know some couldn't live with this philosophy but it works for me and generally I get positive comments on how the car looks. People will look at the car and not for imperfections.
06-06-2016, 03:35 PM
#30
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Additionally it makes the car easier to clean as it appears to reduce the pores / surface area and so dirt, dust, etc is supposed to come off easier. I have had C Quartz over my Xpel pretty much since day one so haven't got a cleaning comparison between the two. However, I do notice that track rubber comes off an unprotected part (no Xpel or CQ just paint) with Mothers 3R far, far easier than when it's on CQ'd Xpel.
My car is SBM and although I can tell there's Xpel on it no one else has ever noticed. The Xpel does have dings at the front and rear wheel arches and when hit with a stone no amount of "self-healing" is gonna work. My preference is to have film on to protect the paint and change the bra when needed if it starts to look real tatty. I know some couldn't live with this philosophy but it works for me and generally I get positive comments on how the car looks. People will look at the car and not for imperfections.
My car is SBM and although I can tell there's Xpel on it no one else has ever noticed. The Xpel does have dings at the front and rear wheel arches and when hit with a stone no amount of "self-healing" is gonna work. My preference is to have film on to protect the paint and change the bra when needed if it starts to look real tatty. I know some couldn't live with this philosophy but it works for me and generally I get positive comments on how the car looks. People will look at the car and not for imperfections.
I have OptiCoat, and getting dirt and what-not (bird poop, etc.) is much easier. It also gives the car a nice sheen even if left unwashed for weeks, or months.
As to PPF (whether Xpel or Suntek), I think if you drive the car enough, you should plan on replacing the film about every 2 years -- obviously more so if you track. I know I've had to replace certain sections of my Xpel twice now, all within a year, because of souvenirs from the track.