View Poll Results: PCCB or Steel Brakes on your 991 GT3?
PCCBs, the car is for street driving only.
150
22.76%
PCCBs, and I'll track it that way too.
148
22.46%
PCCB, but buying steel rotors or system for track.
44
6.68%
Steel brakes, it's the way I roll.
317
48.10%
Voters: 659. You may not vote on this poll
PCCB or Steel on your 991 GT3?
07-28-2013, 06:44 PM
#31
Nordschleife Master
$10,000.00 is a lot of money for optional ceramic brakes. It's very very expensive.
It would be worth it if the Porsche ceramics were truly long term and proven to last on the race track with long term empiracle data. .
Do you all remember when Porsche installed ceramics on the 996 GT2 and claimed 100,000 mile guaranteed lifetime durability ....... What a joke mess that was.
Eventually the stuff will work I hope. Ferrari only installs ceramics on all their cars since 2008 and Porsche installs ceramics on all GT3 RS cars how are these cars holding out to major repeated Red run group open track day abuse?
Have a great sunday
It would be worth it if the Porsche ceramics were truly long term and proven to last on the race track with long term empiracle data. .
Do you all remember when Porsche installed ceramics on the 996 GT2 and claimed 100,000 mile guaranteed lifetime durability ....... What a joke mess that was.
Eventually the stuff will work I hope. Ferrari only installs ceramics on all their cars since 2008 and Porsche installs ceramics on all GT3 RS cars how are these cars holding out to major repeated Red run group open track day abuse?
Have a great sunday
07-28-2013, 07:02 PM
#32
When I was looking for my GT3RS I was convinced I wanted PCCB's until a friend of mine, Leh Keen, advised me against getting them. He pointed out the wear/expense issues mentioned earlier in this thread as well as even a rock becoming wedged between the pad and the rotor which could score the PCCB rotor and ruin it as well. He pointed out that the cars that run in the ALMS series (like his 59 Brumos Porsche) do not utilize carbon rotors. I wound up getting a set of Demand rotors (supplier to many of the race teams) with Pagid yellows and the car stops like no other. Wear has also been great with a set of pads lasting around 16-20 track days for my style of driving (intermediate to advanced solo). I plan on removing the stock steels rotors and pads when I get my 991 in the spring and going with the Demand rotors again.
07-28-2013, 07:06 PM
#33
Race Car
Join Date: Mar 2004
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what makes the deman rotors so special vs. stock? B/c of the slotting? I've always liked slotted rotors better than drilled, but there's no magic in the metallurgy of iron rotors to my knowledge.
07-29-2013, 12:14 AM
#35
That's a good question. I'm no expert so I'll ask to find out. The rotors do have a golden hue to them, but I'm not sure what that could be attributed to. I don't know if it's due to the slotted design or not, but I can lap them for 30 min without any fade. The tires give up adhesion before the brakes give up anything. Leh drove the car at Road Atlanta and was really impressed with the setup.....
07-29-2013, 12:44 AM
#36
Rennlist Member
Slotting would provide good bite and no drilling equals no cracks...
There is definitely a difference in metals used for rotors... Running PFC, they are awesome. 3000 hard track kms on them thus far and still great... my oems lasted 1400kms before they had 10mm cracks (Porsche quote 7mm to be max allowable)... Heard nothing but good things about brembo too but pad options more limited. When last I checked, there were no deman rotors for CL cars...
There is definitely a difference in metals used for rotors... Running PFC, they are awesome. 3000 hard track kms on them thus far and still great... my oems lasted 1400kms before they had 10mm cracks (Porsche quote 7mm to be max allowable)... Heard nothing but good things about brembo too but pad options more limited. When last I checked, there were no deman rotors for CL cars...
07-29-2013, 10:57 AM
#37
Racer
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When I was looking for my GT3RS I was convinced I wanted PCCB's until a friend of mine, Leh Keen, advised me against getting them. He pointed out the wear/expense issues mentioned earlier in this thread as well as even a rock becoming wedged between the pad and the rotor which could score the PCCB rotor and ruin it as well. He pointed out that the cars that run in the ALMS series (like his 59 Brumos Porsche) do not utilize carbon rotors. I wound up getting a set of Demand rotors (supplier to many of the race teams) with Pagid yellows and the car stops like no other. Wear has also been great with a set of pads lasting around 16-20 track days for my style of driving (intermediate to advanced solo). I plan on removing the stock steels rotors and pads when I get my 991 in the spring and going with the Demand rotors again.
07-29-2013, 11:14 AM
#38
Racer
Join Date: Apr 2013
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Couldn't upload the photo for whatever reason. Here's the rotors:
https://www.hrpworld.com/index.cfm?t...action=product
Grooved - not drilled.
The calipers were AP Racing - not Brembo, which come factory on the RSR.
https://www.hrpworld.com/index.cfm?t...action=product
Grooved - not drilled.
The calipers were AP Racing - not Brembo, which come factory on the RSR.
07-29-2013, 11:57 AM
#40
I've been a PCCB fanboy all this time. Main reason being unsprung weight and the corresponding steering feel which is definitely a noticeable upgrade in crispness.
HOWEVER with the electric steering in the 991 I'm questioning the validity of my logic. It's the computer simulating wheel feedback anyways, I frankly don't know if lower unsprung will translate into anything at the wheel.
Another thing for the more tech focused crowd: the ceramics on the 991 is actually a DIFFERENT technology from the PCCBs of old. It's a shinier finish with intrinsic glass-like cracks on day 1, akin to what we see on Lamborghini ceramics (as opposed to the fiber-laced matrices in present gen cars). So the longevity datapoints in our minds may go out the door until these cars start seeing real track miles.
HOWEVER with the electric steering in the 991 I'm questioning the validity of my logic. It's the computer simulating wheel feedback anyways, I frankly don't know if lower unsprung will translate into anything at the wheel.
Another thing for the more tech focused crowd: the ceramics on the 991 is actually a DIFFERENT technology from the PCCBs of old. It's a shinier finish with intrinsic glass-like cracks on day 1, akin to what we see on Lamborghini ceramics (as opposed to the fiber-laced matrices in present gen cars). So the longevity datapoints in our minds may go out the door until these cars start seeing real track miles.
07-29-2013, 11:07 PM
#41
Burning Brakes
That's a good question. I'm no expert so I'll ask to find out. The rotors do have a golden hue to them, but I'm not sure what that could be attributed to. I don't know if it's due to the slotted design or not, but I can lap them for 30 min without any fade. The tires give up adhesion before the brakes give up anything. Leh drove the car at Road Atlanta and was really impressed with the setup.....
07-30-2013, 01:12 AM
#42
Allan, I agree! We have to get together soon! Unfortunately, I head out to the Monterey/Pebble Beach car week with the 670SV right after that weekend so I won't be able to attend that event. We are doing Chin and MVP events at RA in the fall so let's coordinate. I got the rotors through Nathan at Topspeed using Leh's connection.....
Hope all is well with you and see you soon!
Hope all is well with you and see you soon!
07-30-2013, 07:54 AM
#43
Rennlist Member
The PCCB rotors are bigger, so ordering PCCB and shelving the rotors allows bigger after market bolt on rotors either steel or ceramic. OEM steel wont fit.
I assume the calipers are the same, except for color?
If you have to go steel, we'll have to wait to see what will be available and I also wonder if the steel in that size is just getting too heavy?
I assume the calipers are the same, except for color?
If you have to go steel, we'll have to wait to see what will be available and I also wonder if the steel in that size is just getting too heavy?
07-30-2013, 10:11 AM
#44
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
The PCCB rotors are bigger, so ordering PCCB and shelving the rotors allows bigger after market bolt on rotors either steel or ceramic. OEM steel wont fit.
I assume the calipers are the same, except for color?
If you have to go steel, we'll have to wait to see what will be available and I also wonder if the steel in that size is just getting too heavy?
I assume the calipers are the same, except for color?
If you have to go steel, we'll have to wait to see what will be available and I also wonder if the steel in that size is just getting too heavy?
Is there already an aftermarket 410 mm steel rotor?
Based on the poll lets say 1/2 of the buyers go PCCB and some small portion of those want to use steel discs and compatible pads - not much market so either they will not be supported by the aftermarket or the price would be very high. So the availability will be limited to the Porsche rotor and pad combination - not sure how that will compare to a real racing pad.
Ryan