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Old 04-16-2014, 11:22 AM
  #16  
kosmo
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Originally Posted by SamFromTX View Post
I always decline to sign the arbitration document (allowed in TX) when I buy a new car. Check this out and weep:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/8104...new-video.html
F! I signed the arb doc. idiot.
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Old 04-16-2014, 11:32 AM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by kosmo View Post
F! I signed the arb doc. idiot.
Does anyone know about the law in California?

Naively, I've never given it much thought until now.
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Old 04-16-2014, 01:54 PM
  #18  
Mike in CA
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Originally Posted by WSH View Post
You must be kidding to think the '14 GT3 will be a collectible
Will be viewed as the early 996's are, a work-in-progress for Porsche, and value will follow similar path.


Allan, its not worth the worry. Your car will not be back until June at the earliest. Life is too short--take the money and enjoy something else. You can always come back for a '15 when (if) they straighten the problems out. I feel the same way about Porsche, from my GT3 & Cayenne experiences, could only imagine the 991 GT3 mess.


Bill
Won't speculate on the collectable issue. But drawing comparisons between the 996 and 2014 GT3 isn't valid, IMHO. There were never long waiting lists for the 996 and having owned one for 8 years, it wasn't the best looking 911 by any means. The 2015 GT3 will sell like hotcakes and be identical to the 2014. The 2015 RS will have essentially the same mechanicals and will have people lined up for them too. The 996 was a transitional car with relatively modest specs while the new GT3 is likely to be the last of the normally aspirated GT's and fights well above it's weight. Respectfully, your 996 analogy just doesn't stand up.

As for taking the money and "enjoying something else" that's fair advice, although I'd suggest that having no skin in the game makes that advice much easier to give. It also makes me wonder if you've driven the car. Anyway, I am curious as to what you think "something else" would be.
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Old 04-16-2014, 02:40 PM
  #19  
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I have a problem with the attitude that only those with "skin in the game", and only those who have driven the car are qualified to give advice. There have been enough reviews and anecdotal reports that everyone knows the car is an epic drive. I'd also argue that those without the burden of current ownership are in the best position to give advice, as they are without bias and don't have to constantly defend the car. I think "stakeholders" are the last to give advice for obvious reasons.

I seem one of the few, if only owners, that agrees that most people would be better off passing on the 2014 and just get a 2015. The hilarious thing about current owners saying that there is nothing else to drive is that they don't have anything to drive. As the old saying goes, a car not driven is just another car.
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Old 04-16-2014, 02:45 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by ScottKelly911 View Post
honestly, I'd hold onto it. Most likely you have other toys to play with in the mean time. It's my own pure speculation, but I have a feeling that the '14 GT3 will be a collectible car down the road as long as it's as good as has been advertised (from a performance aspect). Think about it, it's the first year of a new engine design and even though the '14's will have replaced engines, they'll all be like that and it's from the factory, so I don't see a problem with that as the numbers will correspond with the cars in the paperwork. Also, many firsts for the '14, first year of PDK (like it or hate it, it's hear to stay most likely and the benefits are undeniable, even if they do take some of the fun out of rowing through the gears), as well as being the first year for rear wheel steering which is sure to be a watershed moment that was a huge performance advancement. Take all of that into consideration with the very low numbers of the 2014 model year due to the stop sale and I see this as a future collectible. I know it must suck during the stop sale and Porsche certainly hasn't been very communicative (at least in our community here on Rennlist), but they're German, they have a problem, they say nothing until it's fixed and then offer you a car that is incredible. Here in the US we've gotten too soft and too accustomed to Valet Parking and a Valet lifestyle and expect everyone to jump at our feet. Truth is, I guarantee once the fix is done and people start receiving their GT3's back, people will forget about this entire fiasco and start raving about how good the 991 GT3's really are and then the RS lists will be overflowing with people who want to throw their money at it. My advice, baton down the hatches, loosen your tie and wait it out, I really think it'll be worth it! That's just my $.02.
I agree, keeping mine...
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Old 04-16-2014, 02:49 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by Elephant Chuck View Post
Buy back to include purchase price, taxes, registration, dealer prep and other fees, interest paid, etc?
Per my call from Ian this morning, buyback includes "tax, title and fees".

I got no pushback what so ever when discussing a buyback. They gave me the impression that they don't care either way.
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Old 04-16-2014, 02:54 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by Bluehinder View Post
Per my call from Ian this morning, buyback includes "tax, title and fees".

I got no pushback what so ever when discussing a buyback. They gave me the impression that they don't care either way.
It may be a negotiation tactic on their side, so you don't try to counter-negotiate a better compensation package if you sense they would rather not buy the car back.

Are you selling your car back to PCNA?
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Old 04-16-2014, 03:09 PM
  #23  
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^^Not sure yet, still working out some details.^^
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Old 04-16-2014, 03:37 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by Bluehinder View Post
Per my call from Ian this morning, buyback includes "tax, title and fees".

I got no pushback what so ever when discussing a buyback. They gave me the impression that they don't care either way.
Of course they don't care. They will be able to sell the car fairly fast after it gets an engine. And, won't have to deal with any compensation issues.
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Old 04-16-2014, 03:55 PM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by kosmo View Post
F! I signed the arb doc. idiot.
Don't worry. The Arbitration agreement is only to protect the dealer, not the manufacturer. You can still use the lemon law or sue the manufacturer if you are so inclined.
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Old 04-16-2014, 03:57 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by RayDBonz View Post
Of course they don't care. They will be able to sell the car fairly fast after it gets an engine. And, won't have to deal with any compensation issues.
I have a different opinion, with due respect. The car will have to be titled as a "manufacturer buy back" later, aka Lemon. Porsche, or any other car maker for that matter, would want to minimize the number of such cars.
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Old 04-16-2014, 04:05 PM
  #27  
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You know Sam, you may be right, but I think they are sincere. When discussing the options with Ian, he said, and I quote, they just want me to be happy. We spoke at length, and discussed all three options, and he said Porsche recognized that everyone was in a different situation, and they were cool with whatever we decided. He didn't seem like a bull****ter, I really don't they care either way.

Anyway you cut it though, they are willing to commit to a buyback, with full payment in 2-3 weeks, so they mean it. I guess that's the ultimate proof.
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Old 04-16-2014, 04:09 PM
  #28  
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SamFromTX - When a car manufacturer buys back a car it is titled, as such??
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Old 04-16-2014, 04:09 PM
  #29  
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^ I see and agree. Think more about it then. The car is awesome and I really have no idea whether it will deprecaite much or not. I am aware of all the opinions out there but none convince me either way. I am very willing to take the chance, even though I will trade it in for the RS.
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Old 04-16-2014, 04:10 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by Zucc View Post
Don't worry. The Arbitration agreement is only to protect the dealer, not the manufacturer. You can still use the lemon law or sue the manufacturer if you are so inclined.
Could you explain this a little further? In what situations would the dealer need protection? I was under the (possibly wrong) assumption that if the car is considered a lemon, it is always the manufacturer that would have to buy it back, not the dealer. Is the arbitration document in place to protect the dealer in situations where the car was not a lemon to begin with, but something the dealer did made the vehicle irreparable?

Like a couple others, this is also a subject I had never taken into consideration.

Thanks.
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