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The 991 GT3 is the new 996.1 GT3!

 
Old 03-16-2013, 09:10 AM
  #31  
Bill Verburg
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Originally Posted by Macca View Post
Thanks Bill. Very interesting read.

Id also like to say from experience that the 964RS and 993RS were also very very close mechanically to the early Cup cars of the same model. Infact in 1993 the 964 Cup car wasnt very different than the 964RS road car at all. Over the years with the RSR versions that similarity started to deviate considerably (areo packages, ECUs etc).

Interestingly they all used the same block and similar heads (until the 3.8s came along). Main differences between base road cars and Cup cars back then was cams, strengthened bottom end with more bearings etc and some small motronics ecu tweaks.
The differences between the road, road RS and Cup got bigger as the years went by, RSR were always extremely different.
relatively minor differences in the 964 series, some big differences in 993 and more big differences in the 996Cups.

Though the GT3 is based on the 964/993 block it is a totally different animal. The nice thing is that though a 993 engine will never breath like a GT3, you can use the GT3 crank, rods and oil pump, w/ custom pistons, cams and Motec to make a nice little 400hp bastard for your 993.

Or as someone said earlier, put a Gt3 and its radiators into a 993.
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Old 03-16-2013, 12:45 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by Larry Cable View Post
...it will be a faster car, but will it require/extract the same from its driver that a 6.2 or 6.2 RS??? - I cannot imagine it will ...

Yes you are right, it will not require the same from the driver...With any shift in concept, it will require a new mindset to get the most out of it and may be pleasureable in a new way...

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Old 03-16-2013, 06:44 PM
  #33  
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Trakcar, Carrera GT, Porsche.collector. I feel for guys like you on this one. I'm bot being funny, I really do.

Having made it clear on these forums you will never except the new GT3 due to PDK, you paint yourself in the corner before the car is even driven by journalists. Furthermore I have a strong suspicion you wont be happy with the 991 GT3 RS either (as at this time we are hearing from factory sources its very likely PDK only again!).

For someone who obviously has the money to continually buy the latest and greatest Porsche GT3s as soon as they come out, this must be very frustrating. The good news I guess is that Peter has a GT3 4.0 which he can now keep a very long time.

Its not so bad guys keeping the car you have now for a decade or so and really tweaking it and getting to know it well. Trust me give it a go and you'll likely save a fair bit of wedge too and maybe can get back on board in 2023 when the all electric GT3/RS is launched at Geneva.

Assuming the 991 GT3 RS is also PDK-S only what will be your plans moving forward for track cars? Any other brands and models you'd consider tracking? Just curious as you have obviously make your mind up Porsches direction doesn't suit your liking and should they make the RS a GTS+ - you must have thought of that scenario....???

PS. Apparently the 991 GT3 is very easy to get sideways using the dual paddle pull back for clutch disengagement. When it re engages it takes the clutch up with some characteristics that give plenty of scope for adjustment of cars behaviors when using in conjunction with throttle (i.e. to break traction etc). Porsche will be releasing a video on youtube over the next few weeks to explain this and how it can be used to set the car up etc...
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Old 03-16-2013, 07:46 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Macca View Post
Trakcar, Carrera GT, Porsche.collector. I feel for guys like you on this one. I'm bot being funny, I really do.

Having made it clear on these forums you will never except the new GT3 due to PDK, you paint yourself in the corner before the car is even driven by journalists. Furthermore I have a strong suspicion you wont be happy with the 991 GT3 RS either (as at this time we are hearing from factory sources its very likely PDK only again!).

For someone who obviously has the money to continually buy the latest and greatest Porsche GT3s as soon as they come out, this must be very frustrating. The good news I guess is that Peter has a GT3 4.0 which he can now keep a very long time.

Its not so bad guys keeping the car you have now for a decade or so and really tweaking it and getting to know it well. Trust me give it a go and you'll likely save a fair bit of wedge too and maybe can get back on board in 2023 when the all electric GT3/RS is launched at Geneva.

Assuming the 991 GT3 RS is also PDK-S only what will be your plans moving forward for track cars? Any other brands and models you'd consider tracking? Just curious as you have obviously make your mind up Porsches direction doesn't suit your liking and should they make the RS a GTS+ - you must have thought of that scenario....???

PS. Apparently the 991 GT3 is very easy to get sideways using the dual paddle pull back for clutch disengagement. When it re engages it takes the clutch up with some characteristics that give plenty of scope for adjustment of cars behaviors when using in conjunction with throttle (i.e. to break traction etc). Porsche will be releasing a video on youtube over the next few weeks to explain this and how it can be used to set the car up etc...
LOL, Macca you are getting funnier by the post. Not being sarcastic
If I drive a 991 and it is more fun I will get one. They will probably be available 3 deep at the dealers like the other 991's at 10+% off.

For now I guess just to make a point I will get a Corvette, manual, real drive sump, sport seats, CF roof and hood for 60k, all not possible on a 150k VW'ed GT3..
The vette is probably a POS and likely, won't even fit in it, but if I fit I will test it a Sebring. The 4.0 is not going anywhere and I think CGT and collector have one as well. Mine is CPO till 2017.

Viper is also an option. They probably feel like dump trucks, but they will be fasterder than the 991 GTS and if the GTS feels anything like a 991C2s I will take the dump truck.

I will never be able to afford an la Ferrari, mp1 or 918, but even at 200k I have zero interest in those cars.
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Old 03-16-2013, 07:53 PM
  #35  
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A 2011 or 2012 Z06 with CCB is around $65K, and will likely drop another $5K to $10K once the new Z06 is announced.
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Old 03-16-2013, 07:56 PM
  #36  
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You can get a new C6 GrandSport now out the door for 53k. Faster than a GT3.
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Old 03-16-2013, 08:13 PM
  #37  
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Peter you have just posted you will buy a 991 GT3 "if its more fun" after making the comment below in your previous post? Not being smart, honestly, but is that what you call a last minute "place holder" comment? I think the bold parts are very churlish. Im looking forward to revisiting some of this after the July press drives and later when the car is delivered. Better still when they announce the engine being used in 2014+ motorsports.

"Why is this one even called a GT3?? Isn't that a reference to motorsports?
It isn't a GT3. It is a GTS X51 with a fake badge.

I would have thought the 991GT3 would be a great GTS just like the current wide body 997 GTS. It isn't a GT3 I dont care how many gadgets they ad or how many ridiculous promo movies they shoot of it going sideways at the track. I wonder if they had to pull some fuses to make that happen.....

Like the GTS it will be a great daily driver that is somewhat track worthy (To be proven on many levels.), a bit boring with PDK but convenient if you are stuck intrafic a lot I guess and comfy with ventilated non track seats. It now is available to the masses, but it now has a load of competitors, I hope that sales will be so bad right out of the gate that they will be forced to repair the image with the next RS. Doubt it.

I'd have to remove the badge to not feel like a poser on this one."
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Old 03-16-2013, 08:22 PM
  #38  
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The Z06 and C6 sound interesting as track ******, but we no nothing of them downunder and I suspect like the GT3 they would cost us twice what they cost you once landed here.

There isnt much MT left looking at the timeline on most Euro car development. I guess you could try a Morgan now the TVR is dead. The R8 still has a manual option with the Gall-ado but Im not sure either are great track day cars.

Why dont you guys go all old skool hairy chested hardcore and buy a 964 or 993 Cup car to race. Would be alot of fun surely and save the assle of flipping every 12-24 months - 1100 kg can be alot of fun with a 320bhp power plant.

The other option is KTM or Cateram. Not sure if you race those over there but as close as you can come to racing a ducati on 4 wheels....
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Old 03-16-2013, 08:42 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Macca View Post
Peter you have just posted you will buy a 991 GT3 "if its more fun" after making the comment below in your previous post? Not being smart, honestly, but is that what you call a last minute "place holder" comment? I think the bold parts are very churlish. Im looking forward to revisiting some of this after the July press drives and later when the car is delivered. Better still when they announce the engine being used in 2014+ motorsports.

"Why is this one even called a GT3?? Isn't that a reference to motorsports?
It isn't a GT3. It is a GTS X51 with a fake badge.

I would have thought the 991GT3 would be a great GTS just like the current wide body 997 GTS. It isn't a GT3 I dont care how many gadgets they ad or how many ridiculous promo movies they shoot of it going sideways at the track. I wonder if they had to pull some fuses to make that happen.....

Like the GTS it will be a great daily driver that is somewhat track worthy (To be proven on many levels.), a bit boring with PDK but convenient if you are stuck intrafic a lot I guess and comfy with ventilated non track seats. It now is available to the masses, but it now has a load of competitors, I hope that sales will be so bad right out of the gate that they will be forced to repair the image with the next RS. Doubt it.

I'd have to remove the badge to not feel like a poser on this one."
I have not been accused of being smart often. I have no idea what churlish means.

Place holder? What I read disgusts me, perhaps the few weekends at Sebring will prove me wrong. I'm wrong a lot.
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Old 03-16-2013, 08:46 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by Macca View Post
The Z06 and C6 sound interesting as track ******, but we no nothing of them downunder and I suspect like the GT3 they would cost us twice what they cost you once landed here.

There isnt much MT left looking at the timeline on most Euro car development. I guess you could try a Morgan now the TVR is dead. The R8 still has a manual option with the Gall-ado but Im not sure either are great track day cars.

Why dont you guys go all old skool hairy chested hardcore and buy a 964 or 993 Cup car to race. Would be alot of fun surely and save the assle of flipping every 12-24 months - 1100 kg can be alot of fun with a 320bhp power plant.

The other option is KTM or Cateram. Not sure if you race those over there but as close as you can come to racing a ducati on 4 wheels....
I want a car I can daily drive, has warranty and can take a beating at Sebring. But I want to shift and if at all possible race proven. The Corvette on paper delivers more of what I'm looking for at the moment. Viper maybe.
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Old 03-16-2013, 08:51 PM
  #41  
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There ya'll go again puttin' down my beloved GTS "Wanna Be GT3". LOL ;-)

Just reminding everyone John Tecce of BGB Motorsports took a showroom GTS with factory aero kit, never touched the stock engine other than exhaust, added GT3 stock brakes, shocks and safety gear and WON the 2012 Rolex GS Championship!
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Old 03-16-2013, 08:53 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by TRAKCAR View Post
I want a car I can daily drive, has warranty and can take a beating at Sebring. But I want to shift and if at all possible race proven.
You already own the closest thing to a race car for the street! Forget the 991GT3...the 4.0 is much more awesome in every regard.
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Old 03-16-2013, 08:57 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by mdrums View Post
There ya'll go again puttin' down my beloved GTS "Wanna Be GT3". LOL ;-)

Just reminding everyone John Tecce of BGB Motorsports took a showroom GTS with factory aero kit, never touched the stock engine other than exhaust, added GT3 stock brakes, shocks and safety gear and WON the 2012 Rolex GS Championship!
You have a valid excuse.
Look forward to point you by in either a 997TTS PDK or 991TTT PDK ;-)
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Old 03-16-2013, 09:04 PM
  #44  
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Well it will be interesting what the future brings there is no doubt. Its always this way. I mourn the passing of the MT in the Porsche GT model range but I celebrate the future with their PDK GT3 and I honestly cant think of a better Porsche sports model to do it in.

I do understand those who do not wish to go further without MT. I have an old Daytona I use to time my laps. A digital chrono would be so much easier to read and likely more accurate. Ill never use one tho as I prefer the analogue watch better. Different but similar experience.

How about 996 Cup (can be bought 50K usd). Buy a BMW 1M or a 997.2TT as a daily driver. 996 Cup car much cheaper to buy and maintain than a 993 or 964 Cup car (probably pushing 100k+ usd now just to buy one of those in the USA).

I have an old e39 M5 6 Speed V8 RWD as a DD and its a lotta fun with traction control off. We did the Canonball Run in it in 2011 and it was a fine distance muncher with 4 up. Worth nothing these days of course but you get alot of respect driving this stuff especially from people who know you can afford the lastest model if you really wanted it. I wouldn't own the new M5. Its too big. The 991 GT3 will be a step up in terms of DD from the old M5 though I must say...

You clearly like your toys Peter, but I think you set the bar high buying a 4.0 and tracking it (here they are collectors cars) , so your position becomes more difficult than most of us plebs here when replacing that ride. I imagine theres nothing now to replace it with for at least another 2 years. driving American iron (albiet very cheap for what it is) would be a bit second rate after owning a 4.0 GT3 surely?
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Old 03-16-2013, 10:08 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by TRAKCAR View Post
You have a valid excuse.
Look forward to point you by in either a 997TTS PDK or 991TTT PDK ;-)
LOL..yeah that would THE DAY!...you giving me a point by.

I often dream what I could do with my GTS if I sent it over to BGB for the Grand AM treatment and then did some cool for power and reliability mods.

But yeah a 997TTS would be a fun street/DE car.
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