mooty

people tend to say how good their cars are once they own them,
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no so. my 964 cab, pos
my 993 way way over praised
my elise, my s2k, my s4 avant, my cayman, my gt3, my c2 my c4s. all got many area i can criicize but all have good points as well.

i own most of the cars i talk about and i more than welcome criticism on any of them. feel free to criticize my gt3, in many respect it's a POS. or my 911 speedster or my 964 cab or get this, the worst gearbox i have used is the US spec g50 in 993. the gearing couldn't be more wrong. and bmw's are nice cars too, the one's i owned e30m3, e36m3 all got their share of prob. feel free to criticize those aspects such as useless water pump and weak headgaskets. i also owne e36/8 aka m coupe both with s52 and s54 motor. it's got guts, but the thing cannot handle like a cayman or elise. i have driven the current MZ roadster. it too doesn't handle like a boxster let alone cayman. and these aren't necessarily driven on street only, plenty of us live on the track every weekend.

Fongster

speak for yourself..

Cloud964

You can say whatever online. Roasted some 911, I don't think so. Cayman is a boxster coupe, nothing more.
And Fongster, I praise them all, just not as blind as some people here, because each car has its strong and weak points. When people say they switch from this to that and back, it is really not a valid arguement, because I can find as many people who did the exact opposite thing. Some people bought a 911 and hated it, and more people hated the boxster and boxster coupe. What can you say about that?

Budget M3

Croc,

I agree with you...to a point. I myself "upgraded" from an X5 to a Cayenne because I like the way the Cayenne handles better and it has at least SOME off-road capability which makes it more fun. But these two are at the exact same price point which makes for a fair comparison and makes the Porsche the better vehicle.

The Cayman is an awesome car...no denying that. Believe it or not, I applaud PCNA marketing for getting enthusiasts to part with even more of their hard earned cash--they are doing their job well! My only point was that comparing a $70K car to a $50K car is not a fair comparison. That's like comparing a 6-series to a CLK...again, both fine cars, but not a fair comparison...

pstoppani

I bet the M Coupe will be a fine car and a good track day competitor for the Cayman S.

Personally, I've owned many BMWs (2 E36 M3 and 1 E46 M3, E39 540, E39 M5 and currenly have a new 330i sedan), they are great cars. I've owned a few Porshe's as well (2000 Boxster S, 2005 40th Anniv 911 and currently a 97 Turbo and a Caymans S); great cars too. Both marques are of equal quality.

I have several friends that own the E36 M Coupes and they are quite quick on the track and they all love them. I'd expect the new M Coupe to be a great track toy.

However, in my experience, the BMWs are not at as track ready as Porsche's. The brakes are a great example. Lots of BMW owners upgrade their brakes, I put Brembos on my second E36 M3. Why? Because BMW brakes are just adequate for track use. Porsche brakes are stellar. BMW's push like pigs on the track without upgrading the suspension. No need in a Porsche; yeah, they push a tiny bit but nothing a tiny bit of throttle steering or trail braking can't fix.

Since I track my cars, I prefer Porsche's to BMW's because the P-cars are track ready out of the box. I just put on track rubber, change the brake fluid and pads and I'm ready (sometimes I don't even bother changing the pads). On the BMW's I've always had to change something. Brakes and suspension are a must. This is why the extra cost of the Cayman S vs. the M Coupe is worth it to me ($59K vs $50K). After upgrading the brakes and suspension on the M Coupe, you'll easily spend close to $9K. But, if it was just for street driving, yeah, I can see how the extra cost of the Cayman S is hard to justify.

So, I'd go for which ever one appeals to you the most. If you track the M Coupe, plan to spend a good chunk of the money you saved on a proper set of brakes and suspension. It still won't handle like a mid-engined car, if that matters, go for the Cayman S.

Budget M3

Having tracked BMWs for years, I agree in general. I don't think you'll have to spend much on the M Coupe, however, to allow it to keep company with the Croc S and vice versa. The rotors on the M are cross drilled Brembos (from the M3 Competition Pkg) which will be much better suited to consistent track use than the "standard BMW vented rotors". I believe the calipers are ATE which, although not with the same name recognition as Brembo, are fine for track use. Many race cars actually use ATE race setups.

Suspension may be another story....

mooty

pete, if you want the same motons you got on your m3 on the m coupe, it will be a lot more than just 9k, a set of good brembo or stop tech will be over 4k. moton cs with springs and alighment, corner wt, 5500 minium. adj sway bars, upper shock mount 1000, adj drop link 500... but i am sure you knew that on your well set up imola red machine.

the m3 comp has drilled rotors, but the caliber is still single piston. it does work well, but it doesn't have the feel of big reds.

and as far as cayman roasting 911's. check out the lap time mantis racing is doing over on the east coast. given equal driver, similar mods, cayman very competitive against 964 or 993's. you need to ask someone who's got at least 1000 track miles on each of those cars to get a real answer. bench racing is useless.

mooty

btw, a boxster s (987s) is very competive agaist 964 and 993 as well.