Knocking/Slapping Noise
02-01-2014, 03:31 PM
#1
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Knocking/Slapping Noise
Hi All,
I bought a 2007 987 Boxster in November. I immediately had an oil/filter
change done (Liqui Molly 5W-40 full synthetic) after purchasing it, and
have put about 2,000 miles on it since as it's my daily driver... the
odometer is currently at 35k. The oil level has not dropped since I
had the oil change done, and I don't see any on the floor in my garage.
Recently, on rare occasions I've heard a slapping/knocking noise from the
engine/transmission area when idling and I happen to walk around the back of
the car. It is not audible from within the vehicle. This seems to occur once
a week or so, and only after the car has been driven for a while, and particularly
if I've been in stop and go traffic. Also, I just recently determined that
pressing the clutch a few times, and going through the gears a bit while it's
idle makes the noise go away. I've attached a video of what I'm
hearing... notice that after a few revs in neutral, right before I turned off the
ignition, I put it in first and the noise vanished.
When I first heard the noise, I was really concerned it was piston slapping
from a scored cylinder, a rod knock, or a failing IMS bearing. However, since it
is very intermittent, and I have had *no* oil loss in 2,000 miles, I'm starting
to think these are unlikely. Also, my understanding is that piston slapping would
be more likley to occur when the engine is cold, not warm. I do have a slight
lifter tapping sound when the car is very cold (slightly audible from within the
car), but it goes away once it is warm, and my understanding is this is fairly
normal, and may go away completely with continued frequent oil changes (i.e.
every 5,000 miles).
Some other things I've noticed about this car after driving it for 2 months:
1. If the radio, and heater/ac fan are off, I can hear a sound from the engine
as if it's whining a bit. Also, at certain RPMs I hear a bit of a rattle, also
only when it's quiet in the cabin. From my research on various forums I believe
this is probably normal and just the variocam actuators. From other's posts
it also seems the whining is basically normal. I'm probably just not used to
having the engine 6 inches away from my ears.
2. After a 20+ minute drive, I occasionally get a burning smell from the rear
wheel area of the car. It's more noticeable in my garage than elsewhere, likely
because I'm parking in an enclosed space. After reading the forums, my assumption
is this is just standard Cosmoline smell, or rubber kickoff from my new winter tires
burning on the exhaust system. The smell never lingers for more than a few minutes.
3. From a dead start, in either first or reverse, I sometimes get a slight shudder if
I don't rev the engine over around 1100 RPMs before engaging the clutch. This may
be normal... most other manuals I've driven don't need to be reved that high to
start.
4. The coolant was around 1 liter low when I bought it. The level has been
consistent since I topped it off, and I don't see or smell an anitfreeze leak.
I believe this was probably due to the cap in the trunk leaking, which I've
replaced.
I'm going to bring the car to my indy shop soon to have the noise looked at.
Just hoping to hear from others that this doesn't sound like piston slapping
or an IMS issue. I've got a two year aftermarket warranty on the car, but
I think they'd put up quite a bit of a fight to replace the engine at $16,000
if it needs it. For some reason, it seems a whole engine replacement is
generally done for a scored cylinder on these cars... does anyone know why
this is? Couldn't a rebuild be done for 1/3 the cost?
Thanks!
Chris
I bought a 2007 987 Boxster in November. I immediately had an oil/filter
change done (Liqui Molly 5W-40 full synthetic) after purchasing it, and
have put about 2,000 miles on it since as it's my daily driver... the
odometer is currently at 35k. The oil level has not dropped since I
had the oil change done, and I don't see any on the floor in my garage.
Recently, on rare occasions I've heard a slapping/knocking noise from the
engine/transmission area when idling and I happen to walk around the back of
the car. It is not audible from within the vehicle. This seems to occur once
a week or so, and only after the car has been driven for a while, and particularly
if I've been in stop and go traffic. Also, I just recently determined that
pressing the clutch a few times, and going through the gears a bit while it's
idle makes the noise go away. I've attached a video of what I'm
hearing... notice that after a few revs in neutral, right before I turned off the
ignition, I put it in first and the noise vanished.
When I first heard the noise, I was really concerned it was piston slapping
from a scored cylinder, a rod knock, or a failing IMS bearing. However, since it
is very intermittent, and I have had *no* oil loss in 2,000 miles, I'm starting
to think these are unlikely. Also, my understanding is that piston slapping would
be more likley to occur when the engine is cold, not warm. I do have a slight
lifter tapping sound when the car is very cold (slightly audible from within the
car), but it goes away once it is warm, and my understanding is this is fairly
normal, and may go away completely with continued frequent oil changes (i.e.
every 5,000 miles).
Some other things I've noticed about this car after driving it for 2 months:
1. If the radio, and heater/ac fan are off, I can hear a sound from the engine
as if it's whining a bit. Also, at certain RPMs I hear a bit of a rattle, also
only when it's quiet in the cabin. From my research on various forums I believe
this is probably normal and just the variocam actuators. From other's posts
it also seems the whining is basically normal. I'm probably just not used to
having the engine 6 inches away from my ears.
2. After a 20+ minute drive, I occasionally get a burning smell from the rear
wheel area of the car. It's more noticeable in my garage than elsewhere, likely
because I'm parking in an enclosed space. After reading the forums, my assumption
is this is just standard Cosmoline smell, or rubber kickoff from my new winter tires
burning on the exhaust system. The smell never lingers for more than a few minutes.
3. From a dead start, in either first or reverse, I sometimes get a slight shudder if
I don't rev the engine over around 1100 RPMs before engaging the clutch. This may
be normal... most other manuals I've driven don't need to be reved that high to
start.
4. The coolant was around 1 liter low when I bought it. The level has been
consistent since I topped it off, and I don't see or smell an anitfreeze leak.
I believe this was probably due to the cap in the trunk leaking, which I've
replaced.
I'm going to bring the car to my indy shop soon to have the noise looked at.
Just hoping to hear from others that this doesn't sound like piston slapping
or an IMS issue. I've got a two year aftermarket warranty on the car, but
I think they'd put up quite a bit of a fight to replace the engine at $16,000
if it needs it. For some reason, it seems a whole engine replacement is
generally done for a scored cylinder on these cars... does anyone know why
this is? Couldn't a rebuild be done for 1/3 the cost?
Thanks!
Chris
02-01-2014, 08:44 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
I don't know what to conclude about the knocking noise. It does not sound normal.
The whining sound I heard in your video sounds like my engine ('06 CS).
I occasionally notice the burning smell near the rear of my car. From what I've read on the forum, it's pretty normal.
I also experience the clutch shudder with low RPMs, typically when the car is cold. I've always used low RPMs too when driving manual cars, and I guess the Porsche clutches just need more RPMs to be smooth.
Yeah, I would definitely get the knocking sound checked out. Glad to hear you have a warranty!
The whining sound I heard in your video sounds like my engine ('06 CS).
I occasionally notice the burning smell near the rear of my car. From what I've read on the forum, it's pretty normal.
I also experience the clutch shudder with low RPMs, typically when the car is cold. I've always used low RPMs too when driving manual cars, and I guess the Porsche clutches just need more RPMs to be smooth.
Yeah, I would definitely get the knocking sound checked out. Glad to hear you have a warranty!
02-01-2014, 09:20 PM
#3
Race Director
When you hear the noise again just fully depress the clutch pedal and then release it. Nothing violent just a normal clutch pedal depress, release.
If the noise goes away it is from the gear box the RPM variation of the input shaft is causing some gear rattle. Also, the clutch disc could be a bit loose on the input shaft splines and making a bit of noise.
My 03 Turbo makes this noise often after driving in town on a warm day. The Boxster rarely if at all. That is I can't recall a time. The Turbo has a 6-speed while the Boxster has the 5-speed.
If the clutch depress doesn't make it go away, I take it the oil filter housing oil and filter element are free of any thing scary? Also, it would not be a bad idea to get the car to a dealer and in the air making the noise and let the techs have a listen.
I can't help you with the whining. It may be normal. Since you say it happens with extra electrical load you might want to have the car's electrical system checked, have the battery checked and the alternator checked to ensure it is making the right amount of electrical power.
Also, I note you say you hear it with the A/C on. You sure it is not the cabin fan or perhaps even a radiator fan you hear? These come on when the A/C is switched on.
The clutch judder can be due to a worn clutch. They get juddery. How's the clutch pedal pressure? You might want to have this checked out by an experienced tech before you condemn the clutch. The tech can also advise you about the juddering. It may be from a dual mass flywheel going bad.
Another factor can be you are just not that smooth with the clutch. Also, try changing your seating position. I found to get smoother clutch operation I had to sit further back from the steering wheel and as a result extend my left leg more and use the foot more than the leg to work the clutch. Someone described it as using the ballet foot.
There is too the condition of the clutch (and brake) fluid. A brake and clutch fluid flush/bleed should be considered (done) if it hasn't been done in a while (2 years). Even a bad flush and bleed can leave the clutch working funny so you want to make sure you eliminate a fluid problem before spending serious money.
There has arisen starting from the UK a scored bore scare -- bore scoring is the new IMSB problem -- that has UK owners talking about all sorts of "fixes". And at least one company that talks this bore scoring up also offering some kind of pricy extended service contract and possibly even some kind of warranty for this and other ills. Tens of thousands of cars are at risk and this company I guess is willing to "insure" every one...
The only thing I know is someone in one of the Porsche mags published in the UK had his car diagnosed with bore scoring and rather than do anything about it decided to just drive the thing including tracking. After IIRC 10K miles all the signs of bore scoring were gone and the engine was never better.
With no CEL with a corresponding misfire error code, with no oil consumption and fuel consumption ok and other sensor readings (like O2 sensors) ok I do not think you have any bore scoring going on.
Just be sure the cooling system is pressure tight -- it is the pressure the develops when the engine is hot that keeps the hot coolant from flashing to steam at the hottest places in the engine -- and the oil reasonably fresh and topped up. Do not allow the oil level to run down to far before you add oil. Do these things and I think you'll do all you can to keep that big old bad bore scoring wolf from your door…
Oh, under factory warranty generally the engine is replaced. Most dealers are not set up nor have techs trained to perform an engine rebuild. I know of one 996 engine that was rebuilt so to speak after an IMSB failure was caught in time. Not to take anything away from the tech who is a superb tech but the rebuild consisted of disassembly, cleaning the engine and id'ing what needed to be replaced (IMS and its bearing, one or two cam chain guides (the plastic got beat up from excessive chain play as the IMSB got sloppy) and reassembly. There was no machining or stuff like that involved.
The replacement engine has been gone over at the factory and tested and deemed in good operating order. This reduces the risk the replacement engine will develop a problem after being put into service and this whole thing gone through again by the owner.
If the noise goes away it is from the gear box the RPM variation of the input shaft is causing some gear rattle. Also, the clutch disc could be a bit loose on the input shaft splines and making a bit of noise.
My 03 Turbo makes this noise often after driving in town on a warm day. The Boxster rarely if at all. That is I can't recall a time. The Turbo has a 6-speed while the Boxster has the 5-speed.
If the clutch depress doesn't make it go away, I take it the oil filter housing oil and filter element are free of any thing scary? Also, it would not be a bad idea to get the car to a dealer and in the air making the noise and let the techs have a listen.
I can't help you with the whining. It may be normal. Since you say it happens with extra electrical load you might want to have the car's electrical system checked, have the battery checked and the alternator checked to ensure it is making the right amount of electrical power.
Also, I note you say you hear it with the A/C on. You sure it is not the cabin fan or perhaps even a radiator fan you hear? These come on when the A/C is switched on.
The clutch judder can be due to a worn clutch. They get juddery. How's the clutch pedal pressure? You might want to have this checked out by an experienced tech before you condemn the clutch. The tech can also advise you about the juddering. It may be from a dual mass flywheel going bad.
Another factor can be you are just not that smooth with the clutch. Also, try changing your seating position. I found to get smoother clutch operation I had to sit further back from the steering wheel and as a result extend my left leg more and use the foot more than the leg to work the clutch. Someone described it as using the ballet foot.
There is too the condition of the clutch (and brake) fluid. A brake and clutch fluid flush/bleed should be considered (done) if it hasn't been done in a while (2 years). Even a bad flush and bleed can leave the clutch working funny so you want to make sure you eliminate a fluid problem before spending serious money.
There has arisen starting from the UK a scored bore scare -- bore scoring is the new IMSB problem -- that has UK owners talking about all sorts of "fixes". And at least one company that talks this bore scoring up also offering some kind of pricy extended service contract and possibly even some kind of warranty for this and other ills. Tens of thousands of cars are at risk and this company I guess is willing to "insure" every one...
The only thing I know is someone in one of the Porsche mags published in the UK had his car diagnosed with bore scoring and rather than do anything about it decided to just drive the thing including tracking. After IIRC 10K miles all the signs of bore scoring were gone and the engine was never better.
With no CEL with a corresponding misfire error code, with no oil consumption and fuel consumption ok and other sensor readings (like O2 sensors) ok I do not think you have any bore scoring going on.
Just be sure the cooling system is pressure tight -- it is the pressure the develops when the engine is hot that keeps the hot coolant from flashing to steam at the hottest places in the engine -- and the oil reasonably fresh and topped up. Do not allow the oil level to run down to far before you add oil. Do these things and I think you'll do all you can to keep that big old bad bore scoring wolf from your door…
Oh, under factory warranty generally the engine is replaced. Most dealers are not set up nor have techs trained to perform an engine rebuild. I know of one 996 engine that was rebuilt so to speak after an IMSB failure was caught in time. Not to take anything away from the tech who is a superb tech but the rebuild consisted of disassembly, cleaning the engine and id'ing what needed to be replaced (IMS and its bearing, one or two cam chain guides (the plastic got beat up from excessive chain play as the IMSB got sloppy) and reassembly. There was no machining or stuff like that involved.
The replacement engine has been gone over at the factory and tested and deemed in good operating order. This reduces the risk the replacement engine will develop a problem after being put into service and this whole thing gone through again by the owner.
02-03-2014, 05:20 PM
#4
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I had a very similar sound...see my video here..
Car has been in the shop for 5 weeks and I hopefully pick it up tomorrow with a new engine. My engine was a mess. Good luck to you.
Contrary to what my video says, it didn't end up being lifters. I had major scoring in the cylinders as well as some blown valves whatever that means.
Contrary to what my video says, it didn't end up being lifters. I had major scoring in the cylinders as well as some blown valves whatever that means.
02-03-2014, 11:15 PM
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Hi All,
Thanks for the responses.
Macster, I'm hopeful the problem is what you've described: a loose clutch disc or gearbox rattle. The fact that the noise went away after pressing the clutch and moving into first seems to point to that. Next time I hear the sound, I'll try just depressing the clutch, as you mentioned, and see if it goes away.
My mechanic said the oil looked OK when I had it changed two months ago, but I don't know if he cut open the filter. He installed a magnetic
drain plug, and indicated he'd look for metal shavings next time I have
a change done.
Ottawaman, thanks for posting your video. Sorry to hear about your engine... best of luck with the new one! How many miles did you have on it (looks like 100K from video)? Was your sound intermittent, or
constant? Was your check engine light on (seems not from the video),
and/or were you losing oil? Glad to see someone else is driving their
car in the snow
Got about 8 inches on Long Island today, and I had
to go to work. With the Pirelli Sotozero II's I have on, it's been
handling great.
Chris
Thanks for the responses.
Macster, I'm hopeful the problem is what you've described: a loose clutch disc or gearbox rattle. The fact that the noise went away after pressing the clutch and moving into first seems to point to that. Next time I hear the sound, I'll try just depressing the clutch, as you mentioned, and see if it goes away.
My mechanic said the oil looked OK when I had it changed two months ago, but I don't know if he cut open the filter. He installed a magnetic
drain plug, and indicated he'd look for metal shavings next time I have
a change done.
Ottawaman, thanks for posting your video. Sorry to hear about your engine... best of luck with the new one! How many miles did you have on it (looks like 100K from video)? Was your sound intermittent, or
constant? Was your check engine light on (seems not from the video),
and/or were you losing oil? Glad to see someone else is driving their
car in the snow
Got about 8 inches on Long Island today, and I had to go to work. With the Pirelli Sotozero II's I have on, it's been
handling great.
Chris
02-08-2014, 01:23 PM
#6
Former Vendor
I know this noise well... We only experienced it a little more than*20 times in 2013.
Its not lifters, but you won't know that till you spend wasted money and don't solve it.
One reason it goes away with the clutch depressed is because doing so loads the crankshaft longitudinally and creates a variable.
The fact that you've been driving in the recent cold weather and thats when this occurred is certainly characteristic of the constants that we see with this over and over again.
Its not lifters, but you won't know that till you spend wasted money and don't solve it.
One reason it goes away with the clutch depressed is because doing so loads the crankshaft longitudinally and creates a variable.
The fact that you've been driving in the recent cold weather and thats when this occurred is certainly characteristic of the constants that we see with this over and over again.
02-08-2014, 06:58 PM
#7
Rennlist Member
I know this noise well... We only experienced it a little more than*20 times in 2013.
Its not lifters, but you won't know that till you spend wasted money and don't solve it.
One reason it goes away with the clutch depressed is because doing so loads the crankshaft longitudinally and creates a variable.
The fact that you've been driving in the recent cold weather and thats when this occurred is certainly characteristic of the constants that we see with this over and over again.
Its not lifters, but you won't know that till you spend wasted money and don't solve it.
One reason it goes away with the clutch depressed is because doing so loads the crankshaft longitudinally and creates a variable.
The fact that you've been driving in the recent cold weather and thats when this occurred is certainly characteristic of the constants that we see with this over and over again.
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02-08-2014, 10:28 PM
#8
Race Director
The noise does not sound like a transmission input shaft/clutch disc rattle.
I do not believe it is an IMSB failure but no guarantees. If I had to guess I'd say a chain tensioner is if not bad getting bad.
Best have a pro tech listen and pinpoint the source of the noise. Where the noise is coming from will help him to know what the noise is from.
02-10-2014, 08:35 PM
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Hi All,
Thanks for the responses. I e-mailed my mechanic the video, and he
thinks it's probably gearbox rattle. I've got an appointment to get it
checked out next Monday.
Macster, Jake, are you commenting on the first video (mine), or Ottowaman's? I'm thinking mine has to be gearbox/transmission/flywheel
or clutch related, because if I depress the clutch the sound goes away,
even after I release the clutch pedal. I've uploaded a new video:
Notice at around 18 seconds, after I pressed and released the
clutch pedal, the knocking went away.
Jake, you seem to be indicating this may be an IMSB failure... is that
correct? If not, what do you think is causing the sound?
Thanks!
Chris
Thanks for the responses. I e-mailed my mechanic the video, and he
thinks it's probably gearbox rattle. I've got an appointment to get it
checked out next Monday.
Macster, Jake, are you commenting on the first video (mine), or Ottowaman's? I'm thinking mine has to be gearbox/transmission/flywheel
or clutch related, because if I depress the clutch the sound goes away,
even after I release the clutch pedal. I've uploaded a new video:
clutch pedal, the knocking went away.
Jake, you seem to be indicating this may be an IMSB failure... is that
correct? If not, what do you think is causing the sound?
Thanks!
Chris
02-11-2014, 02:56 AM
#10
I took Jake's post to mean that your sound is nothing to worry about - you can spend $$$ but won't find anything. Hopefully he'll chime in again to set the record straight.
02-13-2014, 12:16 PM
#11
Race Director
Well, I listened again and this time the whole way through and the behavior does strongly suggest it is gear box rattle. I hear something similar from my Turbo after everything is up to temperature and depressing the clutch and releasing it makes the noise go away.
A rev of the engine then allowing RPMs to return to idle often (always IIRC) brings the noise right back.
My advice is to have a professional give a listen and advise you. He can listen to the sounds with the car in the air and pinpoint the location of the noise which goes a long way to making an educated guess as to the severity of the concern one should have towards the noise.
A rev of the engine then allowing RPMs to return to idle often (always IIRC) brings the noise right back.
My advice is to have a professional give a listen and advise you. He can listen to the sounds with the car in the air and pinpoint the location of the noise which goes a long way to making an educated guess as to the severity of the concern one should have towards the noise.
02-17-2014, 03:41 PM
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OK, so my mechanic took a look/listen to the car and confirmed it was gearbox rattle today. He thinks I probably have some chipped or worn
gear teath from the previous owner occasionally grinding the gears,
which is throwing off the gear balances and leading to rattle. Nothing
has to be done about it now... but I'll probably call my extended
warranty company once it gets warmer out and see if they'll cover a trannsmission drop & rebuild or replacement. He mentioned I
could also just try putting thicker gear oil in the transmission, and
that might solve the problem, but would likely lead to harder shifts in
the winter time.
My mechanic also mentioned that the clutch shudder/vibration I'm getting
is probably the clutch starting to go. He said I don't have to replace it
now, but should keep an eye open for it getting any worse, and any slipping. Obviously, if I get the transmission fixed, that will be a good
time to have the clutch and flywheel replaced as well. I'll probably
have him try a clutch fluid bleed first at my next oil change and see if
that helps the problem.
Thanks for your responses everyone.
Chris
gear teath from the previous owner occasionally grinding the gears,
which is throwing off the gear balances and leading to rattle. Nothing
has to be done about it now... but I'll probably call my extended
warranty company once it gets warmer out and see if they'll cover a trannsmission drop & rebuild or replacement. He mentioned I
could also just try putting thicker gear oil in the transmission, and
that might solve the problem, but would likely lead to harder shifts in
the winter time.
My mechanic also mentioned that the clutch shudder/vibration I'm getting
is probably the clutch starting to go. He said I don't have to replace it
now, but should keep an eye open for it getting any worse, and any slipping. Obviously, if I get the transmission fixed, that will be a good
time to have the clutch and flywheel replaced as well. I'll probably
have him try a clutch fluid bleed first at my next oil change and see if
that helps the problem.
Thanks for your responses everyone.
Chris
06-06-2014, 03:14 AM
#14
Instructor
Hi Chris and other rennlist guys.
Just wondering if you have solved this problem? Did the transmission oil change help?
My first post here - I have the exact sound which disappears with the clutch. Quite loud and worrisome. No warranty so I try do most work myself as the dealer is way too expensive in South Africa!
Your feedback is appreciated.
Just wondering if you have solved this problem? Did the transmission oil change help?
My first post here - I have the exact sound which disappears with the clutch. Quite loud and worrisome. No warranty so I try do most work myself as the dealer is way too expensive in South Africa!
Your feedback is appreciated.
06-09-2014, 10:57 PM
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Hi TomiK,
A month or two ago, I decided to get an second opinion from a nearby
dealership on the noise I was hearing. I trust my indy mechanic fully,
but he didn't want to deal directly with my 3rd party warranty company,
and I didn't want the hassle of talking to them myself. Anyway, the
dealer tech who took a look at the car indicated he believed the noise
was clutch rattle, possibly caused by the previous owner abusing the clutch
a bit. The dealer told me it would not be covered by the warranty, and
quoted me at around $4,000 for a clutch replacement. However, they indicated
my clutch had "plenty of meat on it" (not sure how they could tell, because I
don't think there is an inspection window), and advised against replacing it at
this time. So basically, they told me not to worry about the sound.
Quite impressively, Macster told me the same two possible causes (gear
or clutch rattle) in his response to me back in February. I could have
saved myself some time/money if I just listened to him Anyway, having
had multiple people tell me not to worry about the sound, I've just been
enjoying the car at this point. I've put around 4,500 miles on it since
I first heard the noise, and neither the engine or transmission has blown
up, so I' guess I'm OK. I'm leaning more toward my indy mechanic's
gear rattle diagnosis. At the dealership, all of my communications with
the tech were relayed through a service rep who didn't seem extremely
knowledgeble, and I'm not 100% sure something wasn't lost in translation.
Anyway, it reminded me of why I go to a small indy shop where the owner
is the primary mechanic.
Hope that helps. Having the car looked at gave me a lot of peace of
mind... you may want to do the same.
Chris
A month or two ago, I decided to get an second opinion from a nearby
dealership on the noise I was hearing. I trust my indy mechanic fully,
but he didn't want to deal directly with my 3rd party warranty company,
and I didn't want the hassle of talking to them myself. Anyway, the
dealer tech who took a look at the car indicated he believed the noise
was clutch rattle, possibly caused by the previous owner abusing the clutch
a bit. The dealer told me it would not be covered by the warranty, and
quoted me at around $4,000 for a clutch replacement. However, they indicated
my clutch had "plenty of meat on it" (not sure how they could tell, because I
don't think there is an inspection window), and advised against replacing it at
this time. So basically, they told me not to worry about the sound.
Quite impressively, Macster told me the same two possible causes (gear
or clutch rattle) in his response to me back in February. I could have
saved myself some time/money if I just listened to him
Anyway, havinghad multiple people tell me not to worry about the sound, I've just been
enjoying the car at this point. I've put around 4,500 miles on it since
I first heard the noise, and neither the engine or transmission has blown
up, so I' guess I'm OK
. I'm leaning more toward my indy mechanic'sgear rattle diagnosis. At the dealership, all of my communications with
the tech were relayed through a service rep who didn't seem extremely
knowledgeble, and I'm not 100% sure something wasn't lost in translation.
Anyway, it reminded me of why I go to a small indy shop where the owner
is the primary mechanic.
Hope that helps. Having the car looked at gave me a lot of peace of
mind... you may want to do the same.
Chris