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982 GT4 Spyder?

 
Old 02-19-2018, 01:13 AM
  #136  
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Originally Posted by fast1 View Post
I don't disagree, but let'snot forget if the Spyder gets a GT3 engine it won't be an issue of increasing HP; it will be how detuned the GT3 engine will be in both cars. Of course eventually the tuners will break the code, and an ECU tune will provide a nice HP bump. The guys at TPC offer a 30 HP increase on a 981 with their ECU tune.
I assume Porsche will give the GT3 engine a smaller throttle body like they did on the 981 GT4 3.8L. That and a lessor redline.

Naturally, it will be simple to tune them back up with throttle body and software.
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Old 02-19-2018, 01:23 AM
  #137  
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Originally Posted by tcsracing1
I assume Porsche will give the GT3 engine a smaller throttle body like they did on the 981 GT4 3.8L. That and a lessor redline.

Naturally, it will be simple to tune them back up with throttle body and software.
What about the rest of the internals? Isn't the 4l in the GT3 way more expensive than the detuned Carrera engine they put in the last GT4/Spyder?
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Old 02-19-2018, 01:54 AM
  #138  
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Originally Posted by Archimedes View Post
What about the rest of the internals? Isn't the 4l in the GT3 way more expensive than the detuned Carrera engine they put in the last GT4/Spyder?
The internals are the big question.
In theory, they are producing enough of these engines now to probably keep the motor cost reasonable and share them across the board (except for bolt on bits perhaps..)

The GT4 will have to make less power then the 911, therefore Porsche might hold back on the heads, cams, intake and throttle body.... Or they might just very well only do the smaller throttle body and tune it down.

This is what I really want to know.
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Old 02-19-2018, 11:53 AM
  #139  
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Originally Posted by 63A 981510 View Post
I don't foresee this happening... all spy photos say otherwise. Spyder test cars have had the same diffuser, exhaust layout, brakes, wheels and even tires as the GT4. Makes zero sense just to make it the same as the 718 Boxster GTS with simply roof difference too much overlap between two convertible 982's. The Spyder is more than a roof. I feel many (not all) GT4 owners don't like the idea of a Spyder GT4 simply because many feel that the Cayman GT4 needs to sit above the Spyder performance wise. Yes, the 981 Spyder was not developed by the Motorsport Division... but let me remind everyone, that AP said that there is interest to do so in the future... that it was a matter of resources that limited it to the Cayman for the 981. The GT4 and Spyder was unknown territory for them... I honestly think Porsche was surprise of how much demand there was for it. My gut tells me that Porsche will make the Spyder and Cayman version nearly identical with difference simply the roof and wing... very similar to the 987.2 Spyder and Cayman R. Why wouldn't they want to? For the 981 Porsche did the mistake of launching the GT3RS and GT4 together... then month later the Spyder. This go, I have been informed that the GT3RS and GT4 will be launched separately. GT3RS at Geneva and IMHO the GT4 and Spyder will be launched late Summer / early Fall with Spring 2019 deliveries. Time will tell... all I know is I will be sooooo happy when details are announce no matter the outcome to end all of the all over the board speculation/assumptions (including mine ).
Humm. Seems as though many (not all) Spyder owners want the full GT4 performance (suspension, brakes, wheels). I would too if I had paid the same $$ for a Spyder as others paid for a GT4. I read all of these threads and donít see GT4 owners defending the performance hierarchy.

There is is an interesting question of market position and pricing. If the Spyder and GT4 are mechanical twins (from a development perspective this makes sense), how much more will the Spyder cost and can Porsche sell them. My local dealer had unsold, new stock Spyders. Other than dealers playing ADM games, I donít think this was the case for the GT4. The 981 Spyder and GT4 are both great cars but with different missions and, for whatever reason, the GT4 sold about 3x the Spyder. Agree that Porsche didnít expect that and with the MT GT3 available, maybe the GT4 demand will have softened. But, with the Spyders mission, can Porsche add cost, increase pricing (both assumptions) and sell to their projections?
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Old 02-19-2018, 01:55 PM
  #140  
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Porsche has never had any mid-engine competition in the Boxster/Cayman price range, but if the press is correct, the 2019 C8 Corvette will be mid-engined. The price range for the C8 is from a low of $70K to well over 100K. The consensus is that the C8's engine will be NA and produce 600 HP. Since I believe that competition makes the breed better, I hope that GM pulls it off.
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Old 02-19-2018, 08:35 PM
  #141  
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Seems like many people ignore that fact that the previous Spyders came from the consumer vehicles side of Porsche while the GT4 came from the motorsports division. Assuming the rumors of the next-gen GT4 getting the de-tuned GT3 4.0, it seems unlikely the Spyder would get the same engine unless the next-gen Spyder came from the motorsports division and would then also get the same suspension as the GT4 and they might as well call it the GT4 Spyder. Instant classic if that happens, although personally I think they would continue to have the Spyder and GT4 marketed to different sets of customers and therefore more likely they have different engines.
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Old 02-19-2018, 08:48 PM
  #142  
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Originally Posted by Pokerhobo View Post
Seems like many people ignore that fact that the previous Spyders came from the consumer vehicles side of Porsche while the GT4 came from the motorsports division. Assuming the rumors of the next-gen GT4 getting the de-tuned GT3 4.0, it seems unlikely the Spyder would get the same engine unless the next-gen Spyder came from the motorsports division and would then also get the same suspension as the GT4 and they might as well call it the GT4 Spyder. Instant classic if that happens, although personally I think they would continue to have the Spyder and GT4 marketed to different sets of customers and therefore more likely they have different engines.
Except the GT4 motor didn't come from the motorsport division, it came from the Carrera S, just like the Spyder's motor. So, it's not unrealistic to assume that they would get the same motor, whatever it is, in the next iteration. Unless of course, Porsche wants to differentiate them more. I'd bet they both get the same motor, but I'm not sold on it being the 4.0l from the GT3, unless the price jump is around 25 percent.
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Old 02-19-2018, 08:56 PM
  #143  
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In my opinion, even if the spyshots show that the next GT4 and the next Spyder are 'very similar', the drive train settings for the Spyder could be different from the GT4 ones, enabling different feeling while on the road (the GT4 being more 'track' oriented, probably). Now about putting different engines in the 2 models, while technically possible, I don't feel this as being a logical option, from an industrial point of view (production volumes for both models will be relatively limited). In addition, a Spyder with a 4 cyl turbo will be faster than a GT4 with a NA engine, if the powers are similar !
However, as I said in a previous post, the fact that a Porsche convertible could be at least as fast as a 'GT' of the same range might be an issue for Porsche... at least until they consider the profits they can make out of it !
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Old 02-19-2018, 10:52 PM
  #144  
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Originally Posted by Archimedes View Post
Except the GT4 motor didn't come from the motorsport division, it came from the Carrera S, just like the Spyder's motor. So, it's not unrealistic to assume that they would get the same motor, whatever it is, in the next iteration. Unless of course, Porsche wants to differentiate them more. I'd bet they both get the same motor, but I'm not sold on it being the 4.0l from the GT3, unless the price jump is around 25 percent.
this seems to be most sensible logic. The 981 GT4 was 86k base price with the GT3’s brakes, suspension (mostly), and similar aero (price wise). The interiors are basically the sam, so probably cost the same to produce. the $143k base price for the GT3, in my opinion, is due to the driveline. That’s a 56k price premium for the GT3 engine, which in my eyes is for the dry sump, titanium rods, forged pistons and the 911R 6 speed transmission. Financially, I can’t see how it would make sense for Porsche to put the 4.0l from the GT3 to be placed in a 86k priced car. They would have to charge 40k or more to probably make it financially fesiable. I also feel like I read somewhere that the exotic 4.0l parts couldn’t be produced at higher rates by Porsche due to supply shortages. With the GT3RS inbound, I can’t see that pressure being relieved.


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Old 02-19-2018, 11:52 PM
  #145  
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With all this speculation about the GT3 engine being offered in the 718 GT4 & Spyder, anything less will be huge letdown.
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Old 02-20-2018, 12:20 AM
  #146  
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That's a price we pay for highly placed expectations! However, I am betting a dime that the expectations would be met!! We have enough anecdotal evidences!
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Old 02-20-2018, 02:30 AM
  #147  
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very exciting times!
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Old 02-20-2018, 05:13 PM
  #148  
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Originally Posted by Five12Free View Post

this seems to be most sensible logic. The 981 GT4 was 86k base price with the GT3ís brakes, suspension (mostly), and similar aero (price wise). The interiors are basically the sam, so probably cost the same to produce. the $143k base price for the GT3, in my opinion, is due to the driveline. Thatís a 56k price premium for the GT3 engine, which in my eyes is for the dry sump, titanium rods, forged pistons and the 911R 6 speed transmission. Financially, I canít see how it would make sense for Porsche to put the 4.0l from the GT3 to be placed in a 86k priced car. They would have to charge 40k or more to probably make it financially fesiable. I also feel like I read somewhere that the exotic 4.0l parts couldnít be produced at higher rates by Porsche due to supply shortages. With the GT3RS inbound, I canít see that pressure being relieved.
This is a silly logic. While something like GT3 motor costs more to make, it does not cost 56k more. Or probably even 10k more.

In the price you're paying for the name and cachet a particular model brings. In other words, you're paying as much as the market will bear, generally speaking, unless Porsche makes a mistake and underprices a model. Still, little to do with the actual parts bin cost.
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Old 02-20-2018, 06:29 PM
  #149  
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Originally Posted by unclemat View Post
This is a silly logic. While something like GT3 motor costs more to make, it does not cost 56k more. Or probably even 10k more.

In the price you're paying for the name and cachet a particular model brings. In other words, you're paying as much as the market will bear, generally speaking, unless Porsche makes a mistake and underprices a model. Still, little to do with the actual parts bin cost.
That's absolutely not true when you're talking about a motorsport engine. It costs a lot more. $56k more? Doubt it. But it's not about the same price as the standard 3.8l Carrera motor. Not even close.
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Old 02-20-2018, 07:02 PM
  #150  
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None of these predictions make logical sense. But I can't think up one that would so something has to give!
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