Looking to upgrade my '94 968 for the track - PICS - Rennlist - Porsche Discussion Forums

Go Back  Rennlist - Porsche Discussion Forums > 924/944/951/968 Model Specific Technical Forums > 968 Forum
Reload this Page >

Looking to upgrade my '94 968 for the track - PICS

Notices

Looking to upgrade my '94 968 for the track - PICS

 
Old 12-27-2018, 03:40 AM
  #1  
inv3ctiv3
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 12
Default Looking to upgrade my '94 968 for the track - PICS

So I'm looking to get suspension, wheels and an exhaust for my 968 and given how few of these seem to be modded I'm having a hard time nailing down exactly what I can and can't use. There is a world of info on the 944 but not the 968's and I have always ran Ground Control Coilovers on my M3's but they were always really loud and clunky so I'm debating between these:

https://groundcontrolstore.com/colle...ont-assemblies
https://www.vividracing.com/H&R-RSS-...150910470.html

Does anyone have any experience with these kits on a 968? The car is my DD but also my track/auto-x fun car and I don't really care if it's a little rough on the road.

Next up, I would love some Kinesis Supercups and have found a few in 18x8 and 18x10 but I wanna find out if that's the ideal width, I'm kinda new to the Porsche scene and when I had my M3's we always ran square set ups so I'm not used to looking for staggered wheels. Is it better to run a 17x9 and 17x10 (is that possible with rolling the fenders?

And finally exhausts, any recommendations? I may look into getting one made like I had done on my last M3.

Some pics from a drive today:









inv3ctiv3 is offline  
Old 12-27-2018, 10:06 AM
  #2  
Isaacsracing
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
Isaacsracing's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Orange,CT
Posts: 84
Default

Great Pics! Love the Red and White.
I have a square set up and believe that's ideal with 17x9 or 17x9.5 and 275/40 tires. But with 275, you need to have everything set just right. 255/40 all around will fit much easier.
For suspension, I have Bilstein coilovers, and am not familiar with your choices. The ground control set up is quite the bargain though and look nice. IMO, if you are going staggered on the tires, use a little more total spring in the rear and if you are going square on the tires use a little more total spring in the front. Keep in mind that some people continue to use the rear torsion bar with their coilovers, so you need to consider that spring rate and add it in. Or plan to deactivate the torsion bar.
My exhaust thoughts are that a 968 can get very loud if you are not careful. My car is a full track car with a 2.5 pipe into a Magnaflow unit that is the largest I could fit, and it winds up very loud. Personally, for a dual use car, I would leave the long triangular muffler that runs down the center of the car, take measurements of the rear canister and find a Borla or Magnaflow free flow muffler to replace the rear unit. They are cheap. Just start with one thing and see how it is. Then if you want it louder, you change something else later.
Isaacsracing is offline  
Old 12-27-2018, 03:32 PM
  #3  
inv3ctiv3
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 12
Default

Originally Posted by Isaacsracing View Post
Great Pics! Love the Red and White.
I have a square set up and believe that's ideal with 17x9 or 17x9.5 and 275/40 tires. But with 275, you need to have everything set just right. 255/40 all around will fit much easier.
For suspension, I have Bilstein coilovers, and am not familiar with your choices. The ground control set up is quite the bargain though and look nice. IMO, if you are going staggered on the tires, use a little more total spring in the rear and if you are going square on the tires use a little more total spring in the front. Keep in mind that some people continue to use the rear torsion bar with their coilovers, so you need to consider that spring rate and add it in. Or plan to deactivate the torsion bar.
My exhaust thoughts are that a 968 can get very loud if you are not careful. My car is a full track car with a 2.5 pipe into a Magnaflow unit that is the largest I could fit, and it winds up very loud. Personally, for a dual use car, I would leave the long triangular muffler that runs down the center of the car, take measurements of the rear canister and find a Borla or Magnaflow free flow muffler to replace the rear unit. They are cheap. Just start with one thing and see how it is. Then if you want it louder, you change something else later.
Thanks that's some really good info! I'd love to be able to fit a 17x.9.5 all around and should be able to with the right amount of camber and fender rolling. The GC's are nice looking for sure and I would be removing the torsion bar cause I hate torsion bars but would need to look into the M030 sway bar and end links it sounds like? As far as brakes are a good pad and OEM blank rotor sufficient on these? And you're right about the magnaflow free flow that's what I've done in the past.
inv3ctiv3 is offline  
Old 12-27-2018, 03:52 PM
  #4  
Cloud9...68
User
 
Cloud9...68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 974
Default

I'm running 17 x 10.5" Signature SV103 wheels all around, with Maxxis RC1 275/35-17 tries. I was running 255/40-17 Bridgestone RE71R's on these same wheels, and was surprised to find virtually no improvement in lap time after switching to the wider tires, despite their grippier compound. The wheels are custom forged alloys, with a 49 mm offset, and I'm running 2.25" i.d. coilovers, which gives me more room on the inside relative to the stock springs, and I didn't have to roll the fenders. I was running 17 x 9" wheels all around, with 245/40-17 and 225/45-17 tires on different occasions. The wider wheels reduced my lap times by a disappointingly small ~1s/lap (out of a ~1:04 lap on a very technical, ~1 mile track), and again, I saw absolutely no difference in lap times between the 225 and 245 tires. Not sure if this helps you much, but it is a point of reference. I appears that the wider wheels/tires are a double edged sword - more grip, but also more rolling resistance. More power would solve that, but now I'm afraid of grenading my torque tube! (see isaacsracing's excellent thread on his incredible torque tube refurbishment).

As far as the rest of your project, I suggest you contact Karl Poeltl of Racers Edge - he has all the parts and expertise to hook you up. The extreme amount of weight that will be taken out of your wallet as a result of your upgrades is sure the take a huge chunk out of your lap times!
Cloud9...68 is offline  
Old 12-27-2018, 09:42 PM
  #5  
inv3ctiv3
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 12
Default

Originally Posted by Cloud9...68 View Post
I'm running 17 x 10.5" Signature SV103 wheels all around, with Maxxis RC1 275/35-17 tries. I was running 255/40-17 Bridgestone RE71R's on these same wheels, and was surprised to find virtually no improvement in lap time after switching to the wider tires, despite their grippier compound. The wheels are custom forged alloys, with a 49 mm offset, and I'm running 2.25" i.d. coilovers, which gives me more room on the inside relative to the stock springs, and I didn't have to roll the fenders. I was running 17 x 9" wheels all around, with 245/40-17 and 225/45-17 tires on different occasions. The wider wheels reduced my lap times by a disappointingly small ~1s/lap (out of a ~1:04 lap on a very technical, ~1 mile track), and again, I saw absolutely no difference in lap times between the 225 and 245 tires. Not sure if this helps you much, but it is a point of reference. I appears that the wider wheels/tires are a double edged sword - more grip, but also more rolling resistance. More power would solve that, but now I'm afraid of grenading my torque tube! (see isaacsracing's excellent thread on his incredible torque tube refurbishment).

As far as the rest of your project, I suggest you contact Karl Poeltl of Racers Edge - he has all the parts and expertise to hook you up. The extreme amount of weight that will be taken out of your wallet as a result of your upgrades is sure the take a huge chunk out of your lap times!
All good info as well! I may run like a 255/40 or so as a good in between, I'm trying to do this on somewhat of a budget as it's not my main project I just can't stand stock cars and would love to get back into tracking. That said I don't need full blown race parts but a decent mix of DD and track use (which is always hard to balance).

So I'll have to look into either doing the H&R's which means I'd have to buy camber plates so they'd be slightly more than the full kit straight from GC and find a decent wheel that's 17x9 or 9.5 that isn't going to break the bank.
inv3ctiv3 is offline  
Old 12-28-2018, 05:19 AM
  #6  
jtedgar
User
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Roseville, CA, US
Posts: 10
Default

Make sure that the exhaust upgrade does not reduce power for the sake of sound. Also DB level limitation should be considered relative to which tracks you drive. Race/time trial classification can be affected by upgrades such as suspension. Chassis stiffening especially front suspension is another area of possible upgrade.
jtedgar is offline  
Old 12-28-2018, 04:14 PM
  #7  
951and944S
Super User
 
951and944S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: New Orleans/Baton Rouge
Posts: 3,290
Default

We are installing and just about to trial the UK GAZ Gold coilovers on a 968 owned by a friend and raced by my son in the upcoming PCA event at NOLA Motorsports Park next month.
Will have some real world feedback on these at that time but they should be equal to the LEDA shocks we run on 944.
Should be able to get you dealer pricing on these if you can wait that long.
Ground Control is just Koni sport shocks in a GC housing.

If possible, if I were you, I would stay with the square setup, 17" in a width to run the 255/ would be plenty tire...., lesser weight of the 17" combo is a no brainer.

The header for the 16V 3.0 liter cars sold by RS BArn and Racer's Edge is a proven winner.

T
951and944S is offline  
Old 12-28-2018, 06:18 PM
  #8  
Boeing 717
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
Boeing 717's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Dallas
Posts: 12,389
Default

Originally Posted by 951and944S
We are installing and just about to trial the UK GAZ Gold coilovers on a 968 owned by a friend and raced by my son in the upcoming PCA event at NOLA Motorsports Park next month.
Will have some real world feedback on these at that time but they should be equal to the LEDA shocks we run on 944.
Should be able to get you dealer pricing on these if you can wait that long.
Ground Control is just Koni sport shocks in a GC housing.

If possible, if I were you, I would stay with the square setup, 17" in a width to run the 255/ would be plenty tire...., lesser weight of the 17" combo is a no brainer.

The header for the 16V 3.0 liter cars sold by RS BArn and Racer's Edge is a proven winner.

T
Hey those Gaz Shocks look pretty neat. Good price for the road setup. Do you know much about them?
Boeing 717 is offline  
Old 12-29-2018, 02:44 AM
  #9  
inv3ctiv3
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 12
Default

Originally Posted by 951and944S View Post
We are installing and just about to trial the UK GAZ Gold coilovers on a 968 owned by a friend and raced by my son in the upcoming PCA event at NOLA Motorsports Park next month.
Will have some real world feedback on these at that time but they should be equal to the LEDA shocks we run on 944.
Should be able to get you dealer pricing on these if you can wait that long.
Ground Control is just Koni sport shocks in a GC housing.

If possible, if I were you, I would stay with the square setup, 17" in a width to run the 255/ would be plenty tire...., lesser weight of the 17" combo is a no brainer.

The header for the 16V 3.0 liter cars sold by RS BArn and Racer's Edge is a proven winner.

T
inwouod be very interested in that definitely keep me updated! And I agree 255 is plenty on this car.
inv3ctiv3 is offline  
Old 12-29-2018, 11:23 AM
  #10  
951and944S
Super User
 
951and944S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: New Orleans/Baton Rouge
Posts: 3,290
Default

Originally Posted by inv3ctiv3 View Post


inwouod be very interested in that definitely keep me updated! And I agree 255 is plenty on this car.
Boeing 717 , inv3ctiv3 , I have some pics of the set in real life pics (not catalog pics) on another laptop that I use to play music in my shop.
I will post some of those up in next day or two.
Basically, we race LEDA 2 x adj with the remote nitrogen charged canister/accumulator.
When I needed to rebuild a few shocks I sourced the parts from GAZ (both UK) and noted that their top gland nut seal was way better quality than the LEDA part.
Impressed by their parts/service, I contacted GAZ a second time to see if they had fitments for 944/968.
Without going into much detail in public, for reasons I'd share via PM, these shocks are very very similar to the LEDA shocks, which we love btw, just that the fronts are prone to leaks, one of the things improved upon with GAZ.
They put us together a set of GAZ Gold which utilize the remote canister as well (they have others though) at dealer pricing with an offer from us that we could win/podium with these shocks.
Our intent was/is to P1 with these products installed, carrying their company decals on the car with plans of offering them for sale in a relationship with GAZ as an alternative to the sets that are 2 and 3 times more expensive.
First race on these will be SP3 in a 1992 968 at NOLA Motorsports Park PCA race early February.
I'm fairly confident we will be successful and these same shocks will be going on a brand new, no holds barred 2500# SP3 2.5L 16V car I am currently building.
I'm fortunate enough to build cars for a driver (my son) that could probably drive a wheel barrow to at least top 3.....
This said, the LEDA rears go years between reseal, I have a set of non adj, rear coilovers, maybe 30 hours on them, valved for and complete with 600# rear springs for cheap if someone is interested. Pics available on request.

T
951and944S is offline  
Old 12-29-2018, 03:33 PM
  #11  
Boeing 717
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
Boeing 717's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Dallas
Posts: 12,389
Default

Thanks, I'm going to look into their road set.
Boeing 717 is offline  
Old 12-30-2018, 01:06 PM
  #12  
951and944S
Super User
 
951and944S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: New Orleans/Baton Rouge
Posts: 3,290
Default

Originally Posted by Boeing 717 View Post
Thanks, I'm going to look into their road set.
I have the best email contact on my work PC that I can get to you Wed after holidays.

If you want, I could send them an email with your contact tagged and get them to reply directly to you explaining all the features of the set you are interested in learning more about.

T
951and944S is offline  
Old 12-30-2018, 01:44 PM
  #13  
Boeing 717
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
Boeing 717's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Dallas
Posts: 12,389
Default

Originally Posted by 951and944S
I have the best email contact on my work PC that I can get to you Wed after holidays.

If you want, I could send them an email with your contact tagged and get them to reply directly to you explaining all the features of the set you are interested in learning more about.

T
That would be great, thank you very much!
Boeing 717 is offline  
Old 01-02-2019, 08:45 PM
  #14  
Eric_k
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
Eric_k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Woodinville, WA
Posts: 375
Default

In the past I ran up to 275's on the front of my 968 with 2.25" springs and rolled stock front fenders. This was on 17x9 front, 17x10 rear Kinesis Supercups.
I would sell those wheels if you are interested. I also have a set of four 17x9 Cup II wheels that also work for a square setup that I'm going to sell.


Eric_k is offline  
Old 01-03-2019, 05:01 AM
  #15  
inv3ctiv3
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 12
Default

Originally Posted by Eric_k View Post
In the past I ran up to 275's on the front of my 968 with 2.25" springs and rolled stock front fenders. This was on 17x9 front, 17x10 rear Kinesis Supercups.
I would sell those wheels if you are interested. I also have a set of four 17x9 Cup II wheels that also work for a square setup that I'm going to sell.



i would be VERY interested shoot me a PM!
inv3ctiv3 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us About Us Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

© 2019 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: