Adrian

Just to let everyone know. I wrote a letter to Michelin complaining that their selection of tyre sizes for Porsches in the 17 inch size for the new Sport cup tyres was not very good.
I have driven with these tyres on a BMW M3 CSL and they were brilliant if not rather quick wearing.
I received a reply today from the chief. He assures me that they have developed a range of new sizes for the Porsche models. I have the list and it is quite long but for the 15/16 and 17 inch wheels they will be offering
205/50ZR15
225/50ZR15
205/55ZR16
225/50ZR16
245/45ZR16
205/50ZR17
225/45ZR17
255/40ZR17

Michelin also tell me that they will be re-launching the Rally Tyre Range of the 70s and 80s in 15 inch sizes. They will also manufacture the only street legal race tyres for the Carrera 2.7RS and RSR

Ciao,
Adrian
964C4

PS: No there is nothing in this for me.

Bill L Seifert

Adrian,

Quick wearing? You gotta be kidding me. We ran the 10 Heures du Man at Gingerman (Southhaven, Mich.)with Pilot Sport Cups., We took two sets, because we had never used them before. We did not shave them, because there was a forcast of rain, and we wanted to have them last as long as possible. 10 hours is a long time to race. We swapped the sets at 5 hours and the first set was less than half worn. We finished the race and the second set was even less worn. (Rain, you know)

Anyway, we could have done all 10 hours of racing (rain or not) on one set of Pilot Sport Cups. They were just a few tenths off the times with Hoosiers. Try that with any other brand. I think they are great, and they wear like iron.

Bill L. Seifert

1991 C2 Cab
1987 944 Race Car

DJF1

Adrian can you please post the sizes for the 18" as well?

TIA

Adrian

Difficult whilst cleaning my teeth but here goes,
225/40ZR18
265/35ZR18
285/30ZR18
295/30ZR18
235/40ZR18
315/30ZR18
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4

Jeff Curtis

Adrian, the 225 and 255s in 17" are already available...as a matter of fact they were the first sizes out!?? I have a set of 225s and 255 series 17" MPSC tires on my track wheels.

So, WHY would the "Chief" claim that they will be offering these sizes?? ...I'm confused.

Roygarth

Are these the tyres considered by some to be lethal in the wet?!

Was thinking of them for my RS which I use in dry only...good idea?

Adrian

Dear Jeff,
The tyres that first came out were for the BMW M3 not Porsches. Obviously they could be fitted to Porsches but they were actually developed in conjunction with BMW. Michelin went back (we knew about this in August 2003 but we do not know when they started the process. Michelin said in August they were still waiting for Porsche approval) and worked with Porsche to make them suitable for the 911s. These are the sizes that Porsche and Michelin working together have come up with for the Porsche. You will find these are slightly different to the original versions which you mention. What I do not know is if these tyres will replace or be added to the existing lot. Maybe they will actually be N rated like before. An N rated and non N rated version.
Here in Europe they were only offering 225 and 245s as I said. I went back and checked the charts. These two tyres were not approved by Porsche for fitment to Porsches. The tyres and sizes in the letter are approved and will be available soon in a very select group of stores.
Dear Piers,
Yes these tyres are not suitable for high speed use in the wet. They are brilliant but fast wearing dry weather tyres. Not cheap either but I have driven the M3 on them and they are just superb.
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4

Patrik S

The Michelin Pilot Sport Cup Tyres have been on sale here in Sweden to Porsche Club Sweden members since spring 2003. Michelin say they are specific to Porsches and that is why they are not for sale to non porsche cars.

I have had them on my RS for about 4-5 month. They are good track tires. But so were also the previous Pirelli p-zero Corsa. The Corsa did also work great in the wet. The Pilot Sport Cup is not as good in the wet. But I have not yet used the Pilot Sport Cup on a wet track.

JC in NY

Michelin is a major sponsor of Porsche Club racing here in the USA for 2003. During this time they are promoting the Sport Cup tires for use on Porsches all year long. So I don't know who's telling you they are not approved for Porsches.

joey bagadonuts

Piers,

If you look at the tread, there are a numbe of x-type grooves on the shoulder as well as diagonal channels--these are VERY shallow and disappear after several heat cylcles. The two longitudinal grooves on the inside are the only significant aqua channels--the rest of the tire is like a slick.


Now, look at the Yoko's. Yeah, they're loud but they also work in the rain.


The new HOT tire seems to be the Toyo RA1's.


Give this recent thread from the Racing board a read for more information.

Roygarth

Thanks Joey and others!

Adrian

Please go argue with Michelin France. I only posted what a very senior manager in Michelin wrote to me in his letter. Mr Biabaud the chief of Michelin motorsport group.
To be Porsche approved they have to carry the N rating number.
Sometimes guys you make me I wonder why I bother passing on information.
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4

JC in NY

Adrian,
Your participation on this forum is greatly appreciated. My comment is not meant to annoy you or but rather to provoke discussion.

This apparent internal contradiction within Michelin is very interesting. Maybe the "Bibendum" creature himself will appear here and clear it up for us!

Adrian

Dear JC,
This contradiction has to do with business not technicalities. Michelin USA may well be saying and doing what they are doing but if the tyres do not carry an N rating they are not Porsche approved for road use.
There was a post sometime ago from a 964 owner who participated in a Michelin USA 18 inch wheels day for all Porsches including the 964. The 18 inch wheel is not approved by Porsche on a standard 964. He had them installed and damaged his car.
I am only interested in the technical side of these discussions and what is coming out for our Porsches. I only post what I have been told. Contradictions in business activities cannot be explained. Look at PCNA and PAG and how they clash sometimes.
Kumho sponsor some Porsche competitions but do not have N rated tyres.
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4

Bill L Seifert

Adrian,

I also don't want to upset you, but, when I first checked on buying the Pilot Sport Cups, the ad in most magazines said that Tire Rack (where I buy my tires) said they would only sell to customers that were involved in PCA racing, even BMW guys could not buy them. I realize that PCNA says that only N labled tires are approved for Porsches, but does anyone think those tires know what kind of car they are on. I don't mean to sound like a smart alec, but my race car is 16 years old, and the Pilot Sport Cups worked great.

I talked above about your statement that they are fast wearing. We ran in a 10 hour enduro, and ran them solid for 5 hours, and wore them less than half. We were the second fastest car in our class, and finished third in class, due to bearing problem. Please tell me about a tire that will last that long, I sure don't know of one. Also, we ran for 2.5 hours in the rain, (On the next set)and they were not that bad. Not as good as Hoosier Dirt Stockers, but we were as fast as other cars with Toyos, and faster than the Khumos.

Bill Seifert

1991 C2 Cab
1987 944 Race Car