Fuel choices
05-12-2012, 03:48 PM
#1
Racer
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Fuel choices
Guys what are your thoughts about Non-Oxygenated Fuel Vs Oxygenated fuel. Non-Oxygenated Fuels are available here but only at certain gas stations. It is marketed towards older collector cars. Also its 91 octane.
TIA
TIA
05-12-2012, 05:04 PM
#2
RL Technical Advisor
Hi,
Maximum performance comes from the use of sufficient octane fuel and that means a minimum of 91.
93 octane will make more power in a 3.6 (especially when its hot), however most of those fuels contain ethanol and some fuel treatments are recommended to prevent long-term issues.
Maximum performance comes from the use of sufficient octane fuel and that means a minimum of 91.
93 octane will make more power in a 3.6 (especially when its hot), however most of those fuels contain ethanol and some fuel treatments are recommended to prevent long-term issues.
05-12-2012, 08:45 PM
#3
Race Car
If you are talking about fuel with and without ethanol, which I imagine you are since we haven't blended with mtbe in this country for years, then go with gasoline with zero ethanol. It burns more efficiently, is less corrosive and you with end up with less carbon buildup in the cylinders due to the more efficient burn. Further you get better gas mileage without ethanol in the gasoline.
05-12-2012, 10:02 PM
#4
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Hi, i'm interested to know whats readily available in different countries for your normal fuel grade and what's available at the pump?
Here in the uk the bog standard seems to be 95ron octane and super fuel at 98 - 99ron octane for the likes of shell or tesco do 99ron! At about an extra 5p a litre.
So far i've not bothered with super fuel in my 964 unlike other cars i've owned as assumed that the car was set up for a lower octane level. I have wondered if i did use a higher grade fuel in the car would i actually benefit fron it?
I used to swear by in it my other cars but not so sure in the pcar?
Here in the uk the bog standard seems to be 95ron octane and super fuel at 98 - 99ron octane for the likes of shell or tesco do 99ron! At about an extra 5p a litre.
So far i've not bothered with super fuel in my 964 unlike other cars i've owned as assumed that the car was set up for a lower octane level. I have wondered if i did use a higher grade fuel in the car would i actually benefit fron it?
I used to swear by in it my other cars but not so sure in the pcar?
05-12-2012, 11:05 PM
#5
Race Car
If your car isn't knocking, then higher octane will basically yield little to no power increase. Octne level basically measures the explosiveness or volatility of the fuel. The higher the octane, the less likely you will get pre-ignition under higher temps, so you can run the engine hotter and with much higher compression without knocking. But for street, if it was designed to run 90-92 octane, then 114 octane racing fuel does nothing. And if designed for 87 octane, then 91 does nothing.
The fuel blend itself can yield benefit, but minimally, and unfortunately at least here in the states we get little to no choice. And that's about to get worse in the coming years when we move to e15 at the pump to meet the higher blend requirements of the RFS2 standard. I'm not an e15 fan...
The fuel blend itself can yield benefit, but minimally, and unfortunately at least here in the states we get little to no choice. And that's about to get worse in the coming years when we move to e15 at the pump to meet the higher blend requirements of the RFS2 standard. I'm not an e15 fan...
05-13-2012, 12:27 AM
#6
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Hi, i'm interested to know whats readily available in different countries for your normal fuel grade and what's available at the pump?
Here in the uk the bog standard seems to be 95ron octane and super fuel at 98 - 99ron octane for the likes of shell or tesco do 99ron! At about an extra 5p a litre.
So far i've not bothered with super fuel in my 964 unlike other cars i've owned as assumed that the car was set up for a lower octane level. I have wondered if i did use a higher grade fuel in the car would i actually benefit fron it?
I used to swear by in it my other cars but not so sure in the pcar?
Here in the uk the bog standard seems to be 95ron octane and super fuel at 98 - 99ron octane for the likes of shell or tesco do 99ron! At about an extra 5p a litre.
So far i've not bothered with super fuel in my 964 unlike other cars i've owned as assumed that the car was set up for a lower octane level. I have wondered if i did use a higher grade fuel in the car would i actually benefit fron it?
I used to swear by in it my other cars but not so sure in the pcar?
05-13-2012, 01:15 AM
#7
RL Technical Advisor
For those interested in the details, its important to understand that two fuels with the same AKI can behave totally differently depending on the proportions of MON & RON used to blend the fuel. This is just one reason why race gas makes such a difference in drivability, throttle response, and torque,....
Complex subject!!
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05-13-2012, 02:24 AM
#8
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Thanks Steve...I've posted it before in this forum, but didn't feel like going into it right now.
As an aside, does race gas give any benefit over 94 (my local Sunoco carries it, and that's what I typically run, save for road trips) street gas on a stock motor?
As an aside, does race gas give any benefit over 94 (my local Sunoco carries it, and that's what I typically run, save for road trips) street gas on a stock motor?
05-13-2012, 02:31 AM
#9
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05-13-2012, 03:23 AM
#10
RL Technical Advisor
94 octane (R+M/2) fuel does offer performance advantages depending on engine software. If you have a good chip in your car, using 94 gives more torque through the whole RPM range.
One should use Marine Stabil in the fuel to help prevent system damage from ethanol. It also helps keep the fuel from deteriorating so quickly.
One should use Marine Stabil in the fuel to help prevent system damage from ethanol. It also helps keep the fuel from deteriorating so quickly.
05-13-2012, 09:52 AM
#12
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(you saved me having to search through your many, many helpful posts to find the answer)
Wong 93 chip, using 93 Ocatne in North Carolina
05-13-2012, 02:07 PM
#13
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94 octane (R+M/2) fuel does offer performance advantages depending on engine software. If you have a good chip in your car, using 94 gives more torque through the whole RPM range.
One should use Marine Stabil in the fuel to help prevent system damage from ethanol. It also helps keep the fuel from deteriorating so quickly.
One should use Marine Stabil in the fuel to help prevent system damage from ethanol. It also helps keep the fuel from deteriorating so quickly.
Marc
05-13-2012, 02:08 PM
#14
For clarity, our US "AKI" means Anti-Knock Index which in this case is an average of Motor Octane numbers (MON) and Research Octane numbers (RON). US pump octanes are MON + RON divided by 2.
For those interested in the details, its important to understand that two fuels with the same AKI can behave totally differently depending on the proportions of MON & RON used to blend the fuel. This is just one reason why race gas makes such a difference in drivability, throttle response, and torque,....
Complex subject!!
For those interested in the details, its important to understand that two fuels with the same AKI can behave totally differently depending on the proportions of MON & RON used to blend the fuel. This is just one reason why race gas makes such a difference in drivability, throttle response, and torque,....
Complex subject!!
It is and octane is not a true indicator of the fuel quality and can be meaningless. The only true indicator is specific gravity of the fuel being used.
A high quality 89 octane with a high density can out perform a 94 octane that is low quality fuel with a low density.
05-13-2012, 02:14 PM
#15
Oxygenated fuels was generally means alcohol or some other addititve in an attempt to reduce CO emissions. It is also a lower density fuel (see above) which can damage older, particularly, older performance cars.