While visiting a customer of mines home who was having an issue with a product I represent, I happened out into his shop/garage area and there sits a 90 C4, which he proceeds to tell me about and then informs me he is probably going to sell. 31k miles. Suh-weet!

Looking at the book stores on the topic I read of the oil leak issues, dual mass flywheel and dual belt driven dist as the primary issues with these cars. I've ordered Paul Zimmerman's book. There is a pile of speedi-dri under the motor. Found this forum and have gone "back in time" reading about 964s, and their owners. Very enjoyable. My only Porsche experience prior to driving this car was driving a 67 Targa 911S...when it was new, so there is my time line for you. For the past 12 yrs or so I've been tied up with BMW 2002's. I sold my finished 72 and currently have a 75 Turbo. There was a nice article on my car in Bimmer last Dec .

The 90 car is clean. We had to jump start it but the car drove well, but again I don't have much point of reference. I liked it! A couple red lights on the dash, showing an exclamation mark and lighting up the "four wheel-drive line" symbol gave concern and as a result I didn't run it hard. This second owner has had the car for 6 yrs and put only 6k mi on it, most in the first two years, which means it has sat for extended periods. What issues does that cause with these cars, in a cold climate and specifically with the running gear, engine internals? One of the things I like about earlier cars is that they had the amenities (AC, stereo etc) as well as ABS and EFI (I've had it with Webers) but don't have massive electronics as in the new cars.

If I was to buy this car, after a ppi, from what I have learned, I would be looking at dropping the motor for the "lack of a gasket repair" because the oil leak would drive me nuts. While there look at a clutch with a flywheel mod. With the two "engine rebuild" threads on pg 1 of this forum, and with what I went thru on the Turbo I know there is no limit to how far you can unwind that ball of string, so, what would I be looking at as a cost "range" for these repairs. If I was to buy this car, my goal is to make it a durable, long lasting driver that I can lavish great care and moderate necessary treasure on. Not sure if moderate and necessary go together here but you get my drift. I might occasionally go to a driving school/track day, but this car would be a driver.

How would you handle this? Much obliged!

 

Jackfe,
Welcome and great story about your customer's 964, reawakening the desire to own a Porsche again!

Having experience with older cars, in your case the awesome 2002, will serve you well as you learn about 964s. You're off to a great start reading old threads, but don't get too worried about the various faults that may have been mentioned...leaks being one.

You mentioned leaks could drive you nuts...it might not be leaking from the cylinder/head junction at all? Maybe it's leaking from the oil pressure sender gasket, or power steering line, or valve covers, etc...

Point being, hopefully you won't have to drop the engine at all and definitely won't have to rebuild because of the gasket issue...(it's an overblown concern).

The car has sat much too long, it's good to hear that under your - potential - stewardship it would get driven much more.

Welcome! Now I'll stand out of the way why the experts address your concerns...

 

the lights can mean various things. the AWD light can mean bad sensor or as simple as the battery being very low. I had that issue on my c4 if I did not run for a while the battery was so low that the light would come on, but when the battery is charged don't have any issues at all.

 

Having an '89 C4 - I can tell you that they are great cars. Mine was also a garage queen when I purchased here and she soon developed small leaks with the new amount of use she was getting. Mine were getting rather bad because I tracked her, so I opted for the engine drop with a full reseal. About a year later there is a small leak that has developed, but I think that these cars need to leak a little bit or something else bad will happen to them (IMHO ). if you plan to drive like she should be just be prepared for more small leaks to possibly develop - but don't let it scare you off.

Just the other day my AWD light decided to stay on for a while. Let the car sit for a bit and when I got in the light didn't come on. There are lots of small things that are associated with this - don't let it scare you off.

These cars are a blast to own, hopefully you join the club here soon.

Ian

 

At this point it is difficult to get to the mechanic for a ppi. He wanted to just drive it and then tell me if it was worth the cost of a ppi. But, the salt trucks are out. Owner is in no hurry so this may wait a while. I just got PZ's book yesterday. That was a good read last night.

I'm moving to CA this summer. Do you have any issues with overheating? Do you add supplemental oil cooling in hotter climates for a road car?

 

Warning lights (Christmas Tree effect) are usually the result of aged/faulty ignition coils, wires and/or district caps. These were the first Porsche's with many electronic sensors, which were sensitive to leaks in the ignition system. Easy fix, although wires will set you back $250-$500. With so few miles, I doubt seriously that it's a weak hydraulic pump.

Even though this car may have issues related to not being driven regularly, you would have a huge advantage of a very low mileage car, which is very rare. Internals would just be broken in, so even if you did the engine you would not be encountering replacing parts from wear.

Look for rusr at the bottom corners of the windshield seal and on engine tins.

Finally, JUMP AT THIS OPPORTUNITY, or let me know so I can! Be very careful how you approach the prospective seller, because I'll bet he will get cold feet and reconsider whether he really wants to sell.

Good luck and welcome the most valuable resource a 964 enthusiast can have, the Rennlist 964 Forum.

 

I hate this auto correct feature on my DroidX keyboard:

Distributor, not district.

I'm turning it off now.

 

Oh yeah, Adrian Streather's book is a MUST HAVE.

 

Welcome - many of the faults of these cars are overblown which makes them a hidden gem compared to some other 911 variants.

Get Adrians book, read lots here, and plan to get your hands dirty to fix a few things (seals, belts, hoses, etc) if the car has sat a lot.

Marc

 

These are great cars - almost bullet proof in comparison to older BMWs. Go for it!

 

No, they don't "overheat" in any sense of the word, unless you're subjecting the car to hardest use on the track in high temperature and/or altitude.

Nothing has been mentioned about the price range of this car. I think that is paramount to the discussion. (Theoretically there's a ~140K '90 C4 floating around locally that's supposed to sell for ~$10K. Wholly different story, but there are petty cash purchases and blue chip purchases.)

C4 flywheel isn't the same as the problematic C2 unit.

Be sure you do want an AWD 911. Both my 964 C4 and 993 C4S kind of found me. Each found their ways to being nasty weather snow cars. (Only took 6 years with the C4S!) So I'm well aware that guys end up with something different than if they were spec'ing a car out new. But the preference for the other 99+% of the miles you'll put on the car will tilt you toward having a RWD car.

 

[QUOTE=Jackfre;

I'm moving to CA this summer. Do you have any issues with overheating? Do you add supplemental oil cooling in hotter climates for a road car?[/QUOTE]

I live in Adelaide where temperatures regularly hit 45 degrees Celsius and have no problems even after a good thrash around the hills or in city traffic sitting at lights getting baked. Worst thing is our air con doesn't cope over about 30 deg. :-( and usually too hot for roof down :-(

 

Asking price is 25K. Reasonable? I'll be living in Nevada City. Foothills, about 3K' elevation and will be up and down the Sierras regularly. One daughter in LA, so... Know any good shops up that way, or should I make my way to Oakland?

I don't know if I want AWD or not. More to the point, I don't know if I want an early 964. I was not in the 911 market whatsoever, but bumped into this 964 and well, swoon, etc! That generally means trouble for me, but I'm not going to jump at this. We have sold the house and have to be out by end of Feb, pack/ship/store all our gear, woodworking tools/machinery, welders, plasma, hand tools...everything, rent an apt for 6 mos to finish work contract and then move west. I have 3 vehicles to move as well. That, is a load.

I've decided to sell the Turbo but haven't put it out there yet. I intended that as a driver, and it is a splendid car, the best I've ever owned, but I had it professionally restored and every question was answered with, "do it right". As you know, that adds up, so the Turbo became an asset rather than a car I can just drive. Ray Korman did the mechanicals and www.sports-car-restoration.com did the chassis/paint. Good restoration photos on that site. He is doing some nice 911s in that shop also. Prudence dictates that the Turbo goes before a 911 arrives.

The 964 owner isn't in a rush to sell and the salt trucks rolled out locally this week, so the car is up until April. Back here, after a long winter, you have to wait not until warmer weather but for enough rain to turn the roads back to black, from salt white. For my cars that has been mid to late April, sometimes into May. Imagine living where you can drive all year around!

Will I have issues with CA emissions with and out of state car? It may be best to wait until I'm out there to find a car. Time to learn, but then again, a 31k, 90 964. hmmmm tasty!

 

I'm usually the one lowballing prices around here, but if that car is truly that low miles and you like the colors, I think $25 is acceptable.

Re: AWD, I've owned 3 - 2WD mid-70's 911s and I will never buy another 2WD 911. If you never caught yourself in the middle of a curve going too fast in a 2WD 911, you wouldn't understand. I love the way a C4 tracks on the curves, especially in the wet. Although some try to assume additional maintenance cost for them, search here and you'll find very few issues with the AWD system.

As I said before, I think you're being too trusting about this prospective seller and this car waiting til you're ready for it. I would definitely try to get the guy to accept a deposit, creating a contract to buy the car. Don't come back here in two months crying about how the guy changed his mind or someone scooped it up right from under your nose.

 

While I am excited about the car, this has to take a bit of time for me. We are in the process of helping one of our kids get into a house and the banks today are, shall we say, less than pleasant and I'm A+. If he decides to move it sooner, I'll help him. He is a good guy and a good customer. As well, if I pull out of this I'll announce it here.

If I miss this car, I won't complain. That would be like blood in the water here. And I get that!

As to color, I don't even know the name of it. Its that metallic burgundy color. I like white cars, but I think I could like this a lot too.

Off to a Christmas Eve party. Best wishes to all!