darth

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgvIYQPLa_A&feature=fvhl

BlueHeeler

The video leaves me feeling a little meh. I am sure it is engineered to the 10th degree and goes like a bat, but does it have the go-kart feel of the old cars?

From a look and feel perspective, have Porsche realized they have gone astray and are trying to reinvent the past?

jimq

I like driving my Turbo

Trevor Ely

My feelings are mutual.

I personally think the 'retro' thing is just really un-Porschelike. With some exceptions, Porsche seems to be a manufacturer that always looks forward and is always trying to perfect their current models and create new models and segments (i.e. Cayenne/Panamera/etc.)

I think the Sport Classic is a terrible attempt to show the older 911 enthusiast that Porsche's aware of them. Why not bring us what most of us want...A lightweight, no frills version of the venerable 911 or a Cayman instead of another 'special edition' car that's nothing more than a standard car w/ aesthetic changes. I'm so tired of 924 "Martini Editions" and Orange Boxsters w/ no real difference from the standard models.

On top of all this, from a marketing standpoint, that video conveyed very little...Especially the Turbo Cab. segment, which was about as inspiring as a slice a bread. C'mon!

BlueHeeler

Yet the technological advancement of a 996 turbo leaves you with a 964 NA in the stable.

Can you explain this? I am uber curious why people that can afford technically superior, more powerful, and better engineered cars still keep a 911/964 around.

Serious question btw. I have a hunch.

BlueHeeler

I agree 100%. I strongly considered a Cayman before I bought a 964. The Cayman was a nice ride no doubt, but it removed driving from the driver. It was too technical, too many buttons, and much accessory.

OTOH if they had a lightweight RS version stripped down with belt loops as door handles and all associated goodies I would have been MUCH more interested.

jimq

I keep the 964 because it is a automatic for bad traffic and a convertible for nice days and going to the beach plus its value is to low to sell it right now.

DaveK

I guess I've only been in this situation for 3 weeks. However - I am keeping the 964 because I consider them totally different cars. The 996TT is certainly not a newer faster version of the 964.

I do think the 964 is very go cart like - even my fat old C4. I don't know what the weight differences are - but the turbo feels very much heavier, especially when cornering or braking. It also feels a lot more comfortable and refined - which, as a daily car is what I wanted. But as a "fun" car, isn't a necessary ingredient.

The TT is exceptional in many ways. I took it down a twisty road at the weekend, and it's the first time I've really done that "properly". And the power out of bends was quite amazing. But the feel of what the car is doing is just totally different from the 964 (in fact, a lot of it is missing altogether).

It does take some adjustment to get used to the difference in power, and obviously the 964 struggles a bit there (relatively speaking). But I don't think I'll ever find my TT is much fun as the 964 - and I very much doubt it will make me smile as often.

Incidentally - "technically superior" isn't always a good thing anyway. For the first few days of owning the TT, every time I switched the ignition on and saw about 20 warning lights illuminate, all I thought was : There are so many things that might break!

Edit : So what's the hunch?

BlueHeeler

The hunch is exactly what you said. The 996 and 964 are two very different cars. Looking at early 911s, 964s, and even 993 you can see a clear progression of engineering. The car got better while staying the same.

The 996 looks unrelated. Maybe it is too civilized. Maybe it is too good at everything. I am not sure, I do not own one, but I would not complain if I did.

Nine11

The 996 is a better car all round vs the 964. It's just not a better 911 in my opinion. The numbers that the 996TT produces is amazing and can hold its own with the other cars out there from Ferrari and Lamborghini. But with the new safety regulations of today, the 911 got portly and with many people wanting everything jammed into a car, Porsche gave them that to keep sales. Navigation, stability control, etc....the old rule "you can't have your cake and eat it too" is so true. The 996, good at everything, but master of none.

DaveK

I agree with pretty much everything you said - except "better car all round". Better at lots of things, yes. But all round? No. As I said above - sometimes, less weight, less assistance, more noise are good things.

The way I see it is like this :

I own two Porsche's.
I own two 911s.
I only own one sports car.

elbeee964

hear, hear.


Re the vid-clip: They seem quite proud of their new bumper and tailpipes.
(***** all probably go to 11, too.) But I do like that ducktail.

Nine11

That's what I mean. The 996 is better at being a car (conventional car) but it's not a better 911, which is iconic because of the more noise, less weight, assistance etc....

jimq

what is really funny is owners of previous models all say their car is the last real 911
911 911SC guys say the same thing Carreras
the 911 Carrera guys say the same thing about the 964
the 964 guys say the same thing about the 993
the 993 guys say the same thing about the 996
the 996 guys say the same thing well they will say something
the 997 guys will say the same thing
we wont go into what the 928 guys say

I like both of my cars and actually have more fun driving the TT because its more modern and does things the 964 could never do. Its my 4th 911 model and to me the best of all of them. Shoot i even drove the 964 to work today because it was actually cool out and perfect top down driving weather.

DaveK

Actually - although I've never driven one, I think the 911SC guys might have a point. From what I've read, compared to that the 964 is a bit too quiet and a bit too well refined.

The others are all wrong though.