996 to RSA: Do I have realistic expectations
06-26-2009, 12:40 AM
#1
Instructor
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: ATL, Georgia
Posts: 143
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
996 to RSA: Do I have realistic expectations
I am hoping to avoid an insult fest about my 996 here in an aircooled section of the forum...
I am considering selling my 99 996 for a 93 RSA and wanted to know if anyone had some general comparisons between the two.
I am looking for a car to drive 2-3 days a week, track maybe 6 times a year. A consideration I am having with the 996 is that the reliability of the car when tracking it (DE stuff, eventually more serious) is in question and I dont want to risk it.
That being said, is the RSA (964 in general) a car that is generally reliable to track?
Additionally, what are the comparisons between maintaining the two?
I am considering selling my 99 996 for a 93 RSA and wanted to know if anyone had some general comparisons between the two.
I am looking for a car to drive 2-3 days a week, track maybe 6 times a year. A consideration I am having with the 996 is that the reliability of the car when tracking it (DE stuff, eventually more serious) is in question and I dont want to risk it.
That being said, is the RSA (964 in general) a car that is generally reliable to track?
Additionally, what are the comparisons between maintaining the two?
06-26-2009, 01:28 AM
#2
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
You are mistaken to think that your 99 996 will be too unreliable to drive on the race track. You can keep the car entirely stock if you are only doing 6 DE's a year. There are many upgrades that you can do to a 996 to make it close to a Cup car if you chose. Carlos Ragudo just finished his lightweight 99 996 race car and is doing quick laps at our local tracks. His car has been very reliable and he does not baby the thing.
The RSA is a much more basic car and feels more visceral than the 996. It can also be very quick on the track, and it will need as much attention to detail as your 996 to make it fast and reliable. I find that air cooled Porsche parts are in general more expensive than their 996 counterparts. The 996 was made in huge numbers. Their parts are relatively cheap. Their motors and transmissions are ridiculously cheap. I could have bought a used M96-01 motor for what it took to adjust my valves, change the fly wheel, and inspect the clutch on my 93 RSA. The flip side of the equation is that I enjoy driving my RSA much more than my 04 996 40th Anniversary. It's not as fast or comfortable, but it has all the right smells and sounds and feels like a Porsche should.
The RSA is a much more basic car and feels more visceral than the 996. It can also be very quick on the track, and it will need as much attention to detail as your 996 to make it fast and reliable. I find that air cooled Porsche parts are in general more expensive than their 996 counterparts. The 996 was made in huge numbers. Their parts are relatively cheap. Their motors and transmissions are ridiculously cheap. I could have bought a used M96-01 motor for what it took to adjust my valves, change the fly wheel, and inspect the clutch on my 93 RSA. The flip side of the equation is that I enjoy driving my RSA much more than my 04 996 40th Anniversary. It's not as fast or comfortable, but it has all the right smells and sounds and feels like a Porsche should.
06-26-2009, 02:28 AM
#3
GT3 player par excellence
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
i second eric's words.
996 is only unreliable in the air head porsche guys. oh i mean air cooled head.
i have had maybe 10 or so air cooled cars. but they are no more reliable than water cooled.
you were looking at GT3 as well?
go drive the RSA and GT3, very very differnet cars. you will gravitate to one or another. if not, then buy both. i have driven just about every production porsche made after 78. they are all good and all different. my fav of the moment... chickster. and this is coming from someone who had had 964 cab, 993cs, c2s, and more GT3 than you can count with all the fingers on both of your hands!
996 is only unreliable in the air head porsche guys. oh i mean air cooled head.
i have had maybe 10 or so air cooled cars. but they are no more reliable than water cooled.
you were looking at GT3 as well?
go drive the RSA and GT3, very very differnet cars. you will gravitate to one or another. if not, then buy both. i have driven just about every production porsche made after 78. they are all good and all different. my fav of the moment... chickster. and this is coming from someone who had had 964 cab, 993cs, c2s, and more GT3 than you can count with all the fingers on both of your hands!
06-26-2009, 08:05 AM
#4
Nordschleife Master
Having a GT3, a 996CAB, and a RSA I can say they are ALL different animals. WIth that said, quit drinking the "unreliability juice" of the masses regarding the 996. It's just flat wrong. I tracked my CAB for several year (very hard too) and to this day with 75K miles and have had it for 8 years, she has had ZERO problems or leaks. The GT3 is a whole 'nother beast and to be respected.
To the point....I just sold (just this past week
) my beloved 93 RSA that I club raced and I can honestly say that it takes a tremendous amount of work to go fast. Physical work and reflexive work. It will oversteer more than a 996 (wheelbase), it will be more raw (visceral) as has been discussed, and it will be more rewarding.
If you are trying to find the more reliable car and more fun on the street to use as a DD, then stick with the 996. A 964 is a special car (as are all the different 911 variants) and either it connects with you or it doesn't. Just don't move to it b/c of perceived reliability. They are all great on track. If you take care of them, maintain them religiously, are smart about upgrades on track, they will give you a lifetime of worry free fun.
To the point....I just sold (just this past week
) my beloved 93 RSA that I club raced and I can honestly say that it takes a tremendous amount of work to go fast. Physical work and reflexive work. It will oversteer more than a 996 (wheelbase), it will be more raw (visceral) as has been discussed, and it will be more rewarding.If you are trying to find the more reliable car and more fun on the street to use as a DD, then stick with the 996. A 964 is a special car (as are all the different 911 variants) and either it connects with you or it doesn't. Just don't move to it b/c of perceived reliability. They are all great on track. If you take care of them, maintain them religiously, are smart about upgrades on track, they will give you a lifetime of worry free fun.
06-26-2009, 09:00 AM
#7
Rennlist Member
I had a 92 US Carrera Cup, 993 Cup, 996 GT3 Cup, a regular C-2 and two 996s, one being a twin turbo and finally a 997S. I have to go along with what is said above. Although I am a purist and thought Porsche was out of its mind for leaving the air cooled market, the newer cars have their place.
As for a track car, all the cars mentioned are all reliable. My only advice is drive them first. The older cars are more demanding on the track. To go fast, it takes a lot of driver input (tail wagging the dog). I loved driving the older cars, but you would be "worn out" physically out after a race. The newer the car, the easier it is to drive fast, to a point. To go from "fast" to the car's limit, takes a lot of seat time. That is why you see fast laps in most GT3 Cup cars right out of the box, but there are a few people that are the fastest. I think Porsche has made the newer water cooled cars more friendly at high speeds. But when you get to the limit, you better be prepared.
I agree there are some great deals on 996TT. That is where I would be looking. Those are great daily drivers and fun on the track. They are super smooth and enjoyable to drive. You could spend all day in a DE and enjoy the car all the way home.
Just my two cents.
As for a track car, all the cars mentioned are all reliable. My only advice is drive them first. The older cars are more demanding on the track. To go fast, it takes a lot of driver input (tail wagging the dog). I loved driving the older cars, but you would be "worn out" physically out after a race. The newer the car, the easier it is to drive fast, to a point. To go from "fast" to the car's limit, takes a lot of seat time. That is why you see fast laps in most GT3 Cup cars right out of the box, but there are a few people that are the fastest. I think Porsche has made the newer water cooled cars more friendly at high speeds. But when you get to the limit, you better be prepared.
I agree there are some great deals on 996TT. That is where I would be looking. Those are great daily drivers and fun on the track. They are super smooth and enjoyable to drive. You could spend all day in a DE and enjoy the car all the way home.
Just my two cents.
Last edited by clubrcr; 06-26-2009 at 09:37 AM.
Trending Topics
06-26-2009, 09:02 AM
#8
Nordschleife Master
Well put Jim. Same experience here.
Bottom line seems to be (as most will tell you)....drive all the variants you are thinking of and one will definitely "talk" to you.
Bottom line seems to be (as most will tell you)....drive all the variants you are thinking of and one will definitely "talk" to you.
06-26-2009, 11:30 PM
#9
Racer
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Maryland
Posts: 320
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think if you plan to track the car 6 times a year - why not buy a standard C2. These days the price of an RSA will allow you to buy that C2 and save money for repairs.
Granted - the RSA is a bit better track car.........
When I have been on the track in my RSA, or the autocross, the only thing I would dislike about tracking a C2, is the lack of headroom for my driving position with a helmet on, and the power steering. I would consider those issues ONLY - not the overall performance of the cars........
Flagg
Granted - the RSA is a bit better track car.........
When I have been on the track in my RSA, or the autocross, the only thing I would dislike about tracking a C2, is the lack of headroom for my driving position with a helmet on, and the power steering. I would consider those issues ONLY - not the overall performance of the cars........
Flagg
