stevepaa

Drove to mall, came out and car will not start up. Cranks well, even a little running, but no response to pedal and dies. Replaced DME relay, no change. Had it towed home. I jump the DME relay 30 to 87b to check fuel pump and get no noise. Take off panel and it does not run.

Where is best place to get fuel pump? thanks

sundog

Hi Steve,

Same thing happened to me back in the spring. Has it been reluctant to start over time? Mine would require an extra crank every week or two.

I ordered the pump from Sunset Imports. They have changed their website and you can't just get prices like you used to though.

Indycam

If you do replace your fuel pump and the old ones junk ,
can I have it ?

bpras@msn.com

Do a search on the ignition coils and how to test them. They can cause the same symptoms if the fuel pump doe not fix the problem.

jim_l

I replaced my fuel pump this summer just because it was on my todo list, was working fine if you want it for pd use pm me. mines a 91 c2 with 52k miles on it. btw you could check the voltage and current to the pump and see if it got voltage and drawing any current.

dutchcrunch

Hey Sundog, what do you mean cant get prices like it used to be. has sunset changed something i dont know about. i spend hundreds maybe thousnands whats changed.

sundog

You used to be able to enter a list of part numbers and get prices and stock. Unfortunately they have changed their site, and now you need to fill out a form and wait to have somebody call you. At least that's all I could find.

sundog

I replaced mine, and I think I still have it. If I find it next week I'll PM you.

stevepaa

yeah, checked voltage to pump, ~12 volts, but pump does not work. I will replace and you can have it , Indy.

sundog and Jim, did you also change the suction hose and internal fuel filter while you were there. I have 196k miles on mine.

jim_l

the ones in the fuel tank ? no i didnt. i still had gas in the tank so i did it as quick as possible. I did disconnect the battery and i did leak so fuel swapping the hoses over, but then i always make a mess.

stevepaa

okay, changed pump, and when I jump 30 to 87 on DME relay sockets, the pump runs, yeah

but when I put the DME relay in and turn the ignition on, the pump does not run, tried a spare DME, no change

from the wiring diagram it looks like the voltage from the airbag control module pin 11 is the necessary voltage to make the first relay in the DME package function to send volts to the second relay to send power to the pump.

I'll check tomorrow on the voltage at pin 1 on DME relay socket and go from there


oh, I also connected the old fuel pump to a battery and it runs, go figure.


also connected scan tool and could not connect to DME ???

f@tboy

If the DME relay is not energising, and the scanner cannot see the DME, then possibly the problem is at the DME, or between the DME relay and the DME?

From memory the DME energises the DME relay by sending ground from pin3. I would be inclined to disconnect the harness from the DME and check the state of the connectors. You could also try checking the continuity of the ground wire from the DME to the DME relay.

Also, I note that both times you have jumpered two connections at the DME relay. There are actually two relays inside what is called the DME relay, one for the fuel pump and one for either the injectors or the ignition control (sorry can't remember which). You do need to jumper both to live supply to start the engine for troubleshooting. You can also remove the cover from the relay and watch the contacts as you key the starter.

Also note that the pump does not run with the ignition on - the pump only runs when the engine is turning more than 30rpm, sensed by by the flywheel speen sensor. This si why it helps to remove the cover and eyeball it when starting.

stevepaa

the first relay is set off by the air bag control unit, that sends power signal to the DME pin 37 for ignition control and energizes relay for fuel pump if the DME provides a ground through pin 3.

so you think the DME does not provide a ground path via pin 3 for second relay until 30 rpm?

how do you get fuel pressure for injectors before 30 rpm?

I popped off the canister top of the DME relays I have and will move the contacts by hand and work from there.

1) I disconnected DME connector and gave a direct ground to pin 85b which would have come from DME pin3 and fuel pump operates.

2) checked continuity between 85b at relay socket to DME pin 3, and get good continuity

3) at DME connector, gave a direct ground to pin 3 and fuel pump operates




BTW, anyone notice that the old german dme relay package does not have the two resistors added in the hungary version?

stevepaa

4) factory pin out for the DME from factory manual is not like my DME connector

I do not have a connector at pin 37 of DME plug and pin 24 is not ground.

Anyone have an updated schematic for a 1992 DME connector? My plug violates the pin out configuration given on sheet 5 of the wiring diagrams, so I guess I will go see the dealer.

f@tboy

Your connections sound good, at least between the DME and the DME relay. pop the cap off the relay and eyeball it. the coil for ignition control will energize first, the coil for the fuel pump will energize after you have commenced cranking. It is dependant on a signal from the flywheel sensor located at the upper left side of the bellhousing (viewed from rear of car) this signal comes into the DME on pin 47/48. There is a plug for these wires in the front of the engine bay behind the blower. You can check for a signal when cranking on these wires. no signal, means no ground going out on pin3, means no fuel pump when cranking.