demonfish

I have an increasingly leaky engine...

Full rebuild cost estimates are £6-8k...

Would you

buy a cheap 964 to break, and swap engines...

rebuild the engine currently in the car...

find a 993 engine instead...

??

Either way, all are too expensive, so car is now under covers for a few years...

Just interested in case some ebay bargain comes up...

ilko

If all you have is oil leaks, rebuild is not necessarily the way to go. Leaks could be cheap to fix, or pricey, depends. Have you taken it to a mechanic for an estimate to fix the leaks?

A rebuilt engine can last you many years and in general is a good investment IMO, if anything car-related can be an "investment."

If you buy another car to part out, it will most likely cost you more than to just rebuild the engine. It will also become your life's work. I've parted a car before it ain't fun if it's not your full time job. Sure, you will recoup a lot of the costs, but it's a PITA.

Depending on the year, a 993 engine may require a completely different DME, harness, etc. They switched to OBDII in the US in '96 (not sure about Europe), so to keep things simple you should be looking for an OBDI 993 engine.

demonfish

I'm taking a good look at it this weekend, identifying the actual cause of the leak.

I can see it running down the sides of at least two cylinders though.

I'll know more after the weekend when i clean it up and run it and go drip spotting...

altarchsa

There is another option, if you have the time and desire.

You could rebuild the engine yourself. While any rebuild is daunting, especially a Porsche engine, a reseal would be much easier and more realistic for a beginner than analyzing a major mechanical problem and fixing it. Then there are the tools. You can usually make do without all the special Porsche tools, but if you don't have any or can't borrow any tools, it's probably out of the question due to cost when you consider floor jacks, wheel stands, some special tools, etc. Finally, you have to be physically able to crawl around under the car for hours, contort yourself int a pretzel and manhandle the heavy lifting aspects. At a month shy of 60, I really felt it this last rebuild I did a couple of months ago.

However, there are some really good books that can walk you through the process, starting with Bruce Anderson's and Adrian Streather's. There's also a Rebuilding the 911 book that is not specifically geared toward the 911, but has some great photos and a more methodical description. If you're only worried because you've never done it before, and not for the other reasons above, a DIY might be an option.

There's nothing like the pride of tearing it apart and getting it back together right. I'd allow 80 man hours, at least.

tall02

Dear fellow porscher

I ran into the same dilema. I was planning on pulling the engine last winter to repair a few oil leaks. I decided to perform a compression test and found two cylinders had low compression. I ended up rebuilding the top end. But in your case I would test for compression and a leakdown to determine if the internals of your engine are still in good shape. Then I would clean the engine as good as you can and then run it to watch closely where the oil leaks are located. Then you can decide on your options on what action to take.

Typical oil leaks are:

Valve covers
Timing chain covers
Timing chain housing seal against the crank case
Top oil pressure switch (most common) but easy to fix
Cylinder head seals leaking
Front or rear main seals leaking
Engine crank case middle seal

Good luck
Tall02

Oracle

That's one expensive leak! 6k-8k buys a lot of oil quarts and rags for the floor..
It leaks... so?

springer3

I also leaks on the road, and washes into the waterways. Have some compassion for the fish, foul, and other creatures that live in and on the water.

Duck

I am planning to do my first rebuild when it comes time. I am almost positive that my wife would say take it to the junk yard before paying $10k on rebuild. If I do it myself, I can spread hopefully the smaller cost over a longer time frame.

I have the usual garage tools. From those that have done it, what things could I start looking for that would make my life easier when it comes time? I have seen that an atv jack seems to work very well for supporting the motor when removing it.

Thanks,
Duck

Rocket Rob

Duck,

I haven't rebuilt my engine but I did drop my C4's engine and replaced the clutch 2 years ago. I found this DIY to be very helpful in addition to Adrian's book and the factory manual. The main tools that I needed were

4 - tall jack stands
1 - ATV jack
1 - Floor jack (I used two)

I didn't remove the rear bumper. I had to replace the clutch on my new C2 and decided to try removing the bumper. It was amazingly easy and it made sliding the engine out from under the car a lot easier.

Good luck on the project.

joey bagadonuts

The cheapest option may be to buy a nice used motor and sell your leaky one.

Using US dollars, the going rate for a decent motor is approx $8K. A tired motor is probably worth $3-$4K as a package or possibly $5-$6K if you part it out. There are quite a few parts in there which have strong resale value: case, crank, cams, heads, p/c's, intake assembly, dual-plug distributor, cam towers, a/c, alternator, etc. Have you seen how much these parts cost new? So then the only labor involved would be an engine swap which, for most capable shops, shouldn't take more than a day.

Labor is the big expense for rebuilds and what the other gents have suggested will certainly save you big money. But if you don't see yourself dropping the motor and tearing it down, there is another way to go which might be less painful than you think.

$0.02

tonytaylor

You might want to consider selling the whole car for whatever it'll fetch and buying another that doesn't leak.

Otherwise get a compression test and a dyno run done. If the numbers are good I wouldn't worry to much until the leaks are catastrophic. I got another 2 yrs and twenty odd trackdays before I called it a day and went for a rebuild. It was using a liter and half every 150 miles but was still making the best part of300hp. When it was pulled apart it was obviously well worn but there was no apparent reason for it to go pop any time soon.

craig001

With only a few days in my 993 out of the 964, my vote goes to putting a 1995 993 engine in there. Slightly more power and best of all - hydraulic lifters.

demonfish

I have rebuilt engines before, but nothing of this scale, i'm talking 1.4 turbos, subb 200bhp... Not sure i'd have the required skill to work to the tighter tolerances.

I can take it out myself, and refit no problem, that will save a large wedge of cash.

I wont sell the car and buy a none leaky one, its taken 12 months of graft to get it this far, with around $15k spent...

It pulls 277 on minimal mods, so yes i could just reseal, but while its out, i may as well have it all refreshed... It is slightly tempting to do myself, but I just dont have the time, and the fear is starting, and not being able to finish, then forgetting where it all went.

The best case for starters is to strip down and take to someone who can warranty a rebuild.

I'll be taking a look this weekend to determine the problem... fingers crossed its something simple.

ilko

As Stephan Wilkinson says in his book "The Gold Plated Porsche," if you've ever rebuilt a lawnmower engine, you can rebuild a 911 engine.

race911

Or if you're 18 with a broken 911 engine and no hard automotive experience. Funny thing last night I'm changing the oil on the C4S, wife comes out, tell her it was just about 28 years ago that my '68 (same age relative to its production as the C4S......how's that for a reality check) was in the same spot ready to get its engine pulled and me have a go at it.