Tiptronic vs. Manual
05-26-2008, 10:48 PM
#1
Three Wheelin'
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Tiptronic vs. Manual
Anyone have significant experience with both Tip and manual?
I am considering trading my '89 C4 5 speed for a later model C2 Tiptronic. Your comments will be appreciated. I just don't want to make the mistake of getting a Tip and not liking it.
Daily driver (21 mi. each way to work, freeway and big city traffic), some autocrossing, maybe DE's later on and I like those twisty Texas Hill Country drives. I'm pretty familiar with the differences between the 4 and 2, but I'm very concerned about the Tip differences.
I am considering trading my '89 C4 5 speed for a later model C2 Tiptronic. Your comments will be appreciated. I just don't want to make the mistake of getting a Tip and not liking it.
Daily driver (21 mi. each way to work, freeway and big city traffic), some autocrossing, maybe DE's later on and I like those twisty Texas Hill Country drives. I'm pretty familiar with the differences between the 4 and 2, but I'm very concerned about the Tip differences.
05-26-2008, 11:16 PM
#2
Three Wheelin'
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I just read a thread with a post comparing 964's to 993's. The 964 list included C2 Tips, C2's and C4's. It appears the Tips are significantly slower in all categories, but catch up a little in the 0-100 category.
05-27-2008, 12:07 AM
#3
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Just my two cents, but I think the manual would be my choice. Personally, I can't imagine driving a Porsche any other way. The other side of the coin is that you are not going to have to replace a clutch. A lot easier to drive in traffic, has a sport mode which simulates a manual. Many people enjoy using the tiptronic system which happens to be a really well devised system. All comes down to personal choice. What moves you?
05-27-2008, 02:40 AM
#5
Well, I have experience with stick shifts, but have a Tip 964, and love it. Seems to me to be the best of both worlds. If I want to control the gear selection, I just move the lever to the right and select away. So my left leg doesn't get as much of a work out, but that's no biggy 
Of course in heavy town traffic, the Tip wins hands down. No idea on the track, but someone on this forum races their Tip, and seems to do pretty well in it.
As someone else said, it's a matter of personal preference. I'd recommend at least trying the Tip to see how you like it. Another factor is that, if you are at all sensitive to what other people think, then you may want to avoid the Tip, as some will look down their noses at it
Of course in heavy town traffic, the Tip wins hands down. No idea on the track, but someone on this forum races their Tip, and seems to do pretty well in it.
As someone else said, it's a matter of personal preference. I'd recommend at least trying the Tip to see how you like it. Another factor is that, if you are at all sensitive to what other people think, then you may want to avoid the Tip, as some will look down their noses at it
05-27-2008, 03:55 AM
#6
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I have a tip,some times I bless it some times I miss the manual,it depends on the situation.
Unless you are really an excellent driver (I'm not) ,expecially on fast twisted roads,the Tip will make you go faster,taking out the possible mistakes with the gearshifts.
On the kart track a sloppy shifter driver is faster than a good single speed driver only on the straights, when it comes to real driving skills the single speed is usually faster.
Of course a very good pilot will benefit from the complete control the manual gives.
BUT THERE IS ANOTHER SIDE OF THE TIP NOBODY CONSIDER :
When I was chosing my car there were 2 things that made me chosse the tip,one is NO CLUTCH CHANGE and this has already been written.
Second thing that is even more important to me is that with the tip is IMPOSSIBLE TO OUT-REV the engine,so when you buy a tip car you know the engine has ALWAYS worked properly...for its entire life.
Also,the tip force the gear change (depending on the driving stile and wich gear you are in) at a number of revs wich is lower than the maximum allowed 2-300 rpm less.
The gear shift is forced ALSO IN MANUAL MODE if you don't tip when the revs are too high or too low.
When driving "sporty" on fast roads the tip feels a bit slow,it's very subtle but on certain turns it can make a difference,so you have to anticipate the shift compared to a manual.
Unless you are really an excellent driver (I'm not) ,expecially on fast twisted roads,the Tip will make you go faster,taking out the possible mistakes with the gearshifts.
On the kart track a sloppy shifter driver is faster than a good single speed driver only on the straights, when it comes to real driving skills the single speed is usually faster.
Of course a very good pilot will benefit from the complete control the manual gives.
BUT THERE IS ANOTHER SIDE OF THE TIP NOBODY CONSIDER :
When I was chosing my car there were 2 things that made me chosse the tip,one is NO CLUTCH CHANGE and this has already been written.
Second thing that is even more important to me is that with the tip is IMPOSSIBLE TO OUT-REV the engine,so when you buy a tip car you know the engine has ALWAYS worked properly...for its entire life.
Also,the tip force the gear change (depending on the driving stile and wich gear you are in) at a number of revs wich is lower than the maximum allowed 2-300 rpm less.
The gear shift is forced ALSO IN MANUAL MODE if you don't tip when the revs are too high or too low.
When driving "sporty" on fast roads the tip feels a bit slow,it's very subtle but on certain turns it can make a difference,so you have to anticipate the shift compared to a manual.
05-27-2008, 08:06 AM
#7
Burgled
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05-27-2008, 09:53 AM
#8
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21 miles to work....no brainer. TIP
My 996 is a DD Tip and I love it. Now it does have more programs in it than a 964 Tip but that is not always a good thing. Sometimes when it is stuck in a gear it feels like it needs to quit thinking. The 964 is manual and there is no way I would do all the talking on the phone I do in the car(real estate) and shift for 42 miles a day.
My 996 is a DD Tip and I love it. Now it does have more programs in it than a 964 Tip but that is not always a good thing. Sometimes when it is stuck in a gear it feels like it needs to quit thinking. The 964 is manual and there is no way I would do all the talking on the phone I do in the car(real estate) and shift for 42 miles a day.
05-27-2008, 10:05 AM
#9
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I drive my TIP in a lot of DE's! The TIP computer has a number of shift patterns (5 on the early version, more later) which adapt to the style of driving. As stated in previous threads, 0 - 60 is slower, but once rolling, there are just minor differences.
On the track, it "learns" quickly to go into the most aggressive mode. In this mode, it upshifts at it's max RPM (as stated...won't overrev) and downshifts to the meat of the power curve after braking. As for on-track performance...it gives up very LITTLE, as I can keep up with 993's, and pass 964's (because of some mods, hot-wire intake, chip, dual Fabspeed exhaust). I just leave it in "D" and "GO".... I just concentrate on driving, not shifting!
On the track, it "learns" quickly to go into the most aggressive mode. In this mode, it upshifts at it's max RPM (as stated...won't overrev) and downshifts to the meat of the power curve after braking. As for on-track performance...it gives up very LITTLE, as I can keep up with 993's, and pass 964's (because of some mods, hot-wire intake, chip, dual Fabspeed exhaust). I just leave it in "D" and "GO".... I just concentrate on driving, not shifting!
05-27-2008, 11:51 AM
#10
Three Wheelin'
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Thanks all.
Wow thanks for all the input. This is really helpful. I'm definitely going to take a long test drive to see how I like it first.
Any other comments still welcomed.
Any other comments still welcomed.
05-27-2008, 12:35 PM
#11
Nordschleife Master
High end race cars are more and more having Tip style transmissions / transaxles .
Someone of this list made his tip into a paddle shifter , he shifts just like the the guys in F1 .
Two hands on the steering wheel , one foot on the gas , one foot on the brake and a finger on the shift button = life is good .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sequential_manual_gearbox
Someone of this list made his tip into a paddle shifter , he shifts just like the the guys in F1 .
Two hands on the steering wheel , one foot on the gas , one foot on the brake and a finger on the shift button = life is good .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sequential_manual_gearbox
05-27-2008, 01:41 PM
#12
Race Car
I think the tip is great for commuting and in-town driving. My 964 tip is for sale at Ruf and is a great car. I actually liked the 4 speed gear spacing better than the 5 or 6 speed manuals for daily use.
05-27-2008, 03:31 PM
#13
I have a tip,some times I bless it some times I miss the manual,it depends on the situation.
Unless you are really an excellent driver (I'm not) ,expecially on fast twisted roads,the Tip will make you go faster,taking out the possible mistakes with the gearshifts.
On the kart track a sloppy shifter driver is faster than a good single speed driver only on the straights, when it comes to real driving skills the single speed is usually faster.
Of course a very good pilot will benefit from the complete control the manual gives.
BUT THERE IS ANOTHER SIDE OF THE TIP NOBODY CONSIDER :
When I was chosing my car there were 2 things that made me chosse the tip,one is NO CLUTCH CHANGE and this has already been written.
Second thing that is even more important to me is that with the tip is IMPOSSIBLE TO OUT-REV the engine,so when you buy a tip car you know the engine has ALWAYS worked properly...for its entire life.
Also,the tip force the gear change (depending on the driving stile and wich gear you are in) at a number of revs wich is lower than the maximum allowed 2-300 rpm less.
The gear shift is forced ALSO IN MANUAL MODE if you don't tip when the revs are too high or too low.
When driving "sporty" on fast roads the tip feels a bit slow,it's very subtle but on certain turns it can make a difference,so you have to anticipate the shift compared to a manual.
Unless you are really an excellent driver (I'm not) ,expecially on fast twisted roads,the Tip will make you go faster,taking out the possible mistakes with the gearshifts.
On the kart track a sloppy shifter driver is faster than a good single speed driver only on the straights, when it comes to real driving skills the single speed is usually faster.
Of course a very good pilot will benefit from the complete control the manual gives.
BUT THERE IS ANOTHER SIDE OF THE TIP NOBODY CONSIDER :
When I was chosing my car there were 2 things that made me chosse the tip,one is NO CLUTCH CHANGE and this has already been written.
Second thing that is even more important to me is that with the tip is IMPOSSIBLE TO OUT-REV the engine,so when you buy a tip car you know the engine has ALWAYS worked properly...for its entire life.
Also,the tip force the gear change (depending on the driving stile and wich gear you are in) at a number of revs wich is lower than the maximum allowed 2-300 rpm less.
The gear shift is forced ALSO IN MANUAL MODE if you don't tip when the revs are too high or too low.
When driving "sporty" on fast roads the tip feels a bit slow,it's very subtle but on certain turns it can make a difference,so you have to anticipate the shift compared to a manual.
+1...I've had both and agree w/the above. I loved the tip for LA driving and it even worked well in the canyons. Now the car has a 6-speed, but it also has a ++400 HP 993TT engine in back, so its for a different use now. If Porsche ever get's their act together and gets the PDK out, I may line up for a new car.
05-27-2008, 03:50 PM
#14
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I have never driven an Tip but based on market analysis around here they're for sale at lower price than Manuals.. But that's not the main difference, they seem to be on the market forever! I mean nobody buys them even if the price is really-really good when desperate sellers offer them. Then you see they're off the market and back on the next season...
Seems like people don't want a Porsche that is Automatic.
Seems like people don't want a Porsche that is Automatic.