Take a look..what do you think? (photos)
07-13-2001, 05:19 PM
#1
Racer
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Take a look..what do you think? (photos)
I think this may be the one for me, but I value your opinions, folks...it's a 1991 C4, 43k, good service history, still has original flywheel (yikes!) and no distributor vent kit (yikes!). Does have aftermarket Koni springs/shocks and wheels. Take a look at these photos and give me your thoughts...owner is asking $30k
C4 Photos
C4 Photos
07-13-2001, 07:32 PM
#2
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Hi Robert,
Nice looking car!
I assume it runs/drives nice, or else you wouldn't think "it's the one for you."
How are the heads?
Price sounds good to me--not necessarily a steal, but reasonable for a low mileage, documented 964.
At a minimum, I would try knocking him down $1k on the price as "insurance" towards a replacement flywheel. All he can say is no
Good luck!
Nice looking car!
I assume it runs/drives nice, or else you wouldn't think "it's the one for you."
How are the heads?
Price sounds good to me--not necessarily a steal, but reasonable for a low mileage, documented 964.
At a minimum, I would try knocking him down $1k on the price as "insurance" towards a replacement flywheel. All he can say is no
Good luck!
07-14-2001, 04:00 AM
#4
Looks good.
Check the serial number to see if it has the updated cylinders with gaskets...could be a good bartering point if it has the old type. I consider the installation of the distributor vent kit to be a sign of good/aware ownership. Odds are the DMF will fail so you should budget for that. When? WHo knows...it may last another 100K, it may fail next week! You will need to get a PPI done. I would get a collision check done as well at a qualified body shop. Make sure all the needed maintenance has been done, including the brake fluid change every two years regardless of mileage. Adding the vent kit is a piece of cake...I let my dog install mine. Be aware of the costs to fix the transaxle should you have problems with it...not cheap, but they appear to be VERY reliable.
Good Luck,
Bill Wagner
'91 C4, 21K Miles
Check the serial number to see if it has the updated cylinders with gaskets...could be a good bartering point if it has the old type. I consider the installation of the distributor vent kit to be a sign of good/aware ownership. Odds are the DMF will fail so you should budget for that. When? WHo knows...it may last another 100K, it may fail next week! You will need to get a PPI done. I would get a collision check done as well at a qualified body shop. Make sure all the needed maintenance has been done, including the brake fluid change every two years regardless of mileage. Adding the vent kit is a piece of cake...I let my dog install mine
. Be aware of the costs to fix the transaxle should you have problems with it...not cheap, but they appear to be VERY reliable.Good Luck,
Bill Wagner
'91 C4, 21K Miles
07-16-2001, 07:58 AM
#5
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Hi Robert,
We are in a very similar position, both have found a nice black 1991 C4 964 which we would like to buy. Thing is, I am on the other side of the pond!
As such, I can tell you what thoughts run through my mind looking at yours.
First, are those wheels 18 inch? If so, then I would stay clear! In genral 911 up to 1995 should not be fitted with 18 inch wheels. Something to do with structural rigidity. Also, do you say they are Koni wheels? I have never heard of Koni making wheels (of course could be disinformed). If not, then who fitted the wheels, and what brand are they? There is a whole procedure lined out by a TSB on fitting 17" wheels.
Second, I would not buy a car without the distribuitor vent kit. To me it shows the car has not been looked after well enough if that was forgotten.
Third, same as above for original DMF. Of course the miles are still low, but are they original? Still, it would be nicer if it had been done.
Fourth, how many other 964s have you seen? How does this one compare with the others? I have seen 10 and only found one which I have really considered spending my money on.
Fifth, who is selling it? I would not trust small luxury car dealers with the odd Porsche for sale. If it is a private guy then ask and try to understand as much on how he used the car and why he is selling as possible. If it is an Official Porsche Center then what warranty do they give you.
Get in writing from the seller that the car has never been crashed and also a PPI done.
If I still haven't put you off, then good luck in buying! Let us know how it goes.
We are in a very similar position, both have found a nice black 1991 C4 964 which we would like to buy. Thing is, I am on the other side of the pond!
As such, I can tell you what thoughts run through my mind looking at yours.
First, are those wheels 18 inch? If so, then I would stay clear! In genral 911 up to 1995 should not be fitted with 18 inch wheels. Something to do with structural rigidity. Also, do you say they are Koni wheels? I have never heard of Koni making wheels (of course could be disinformed). If not, then who fitted the wheels, and what brand are they? There is a whole procedure lined out by a TSB on fitting 17" wheels.
Second, I would not buy a car without the distribuitor vent kit. To me it shows the car has not been looked after well enough if that was forgotten.
Third, same as above for original DMF. Of course the miles are still low, but are they original? Still, it would be nicer if it had been done.
Fourth, how many other 964s have you seen? How does this one compare with the others? I have seen 10 and only found one which I have really considered spending my money on.
Fifth, who is selling it? I would not trust small luxury car dealers with the odd Porsche for sale. If it is a private guy then ask and try to understand as much on how he used the car and why he is selling as possible. If it is an Official Porsche Center then what warranty do they give you.
Get in writing from the seller that the car has never been crashed and also a PPI done.
If I still haven't put you off, then good luck in buying! Let us know how it goes.
07-16-2001, 10:45 AM
#6
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Looks like a nice car, Robert. Do PPI, of course. Price seems about average. I would immediately get a new distributer belt & vent kit. Also the wheels? does he have the originals? If these are 18", then I would not run them. Adrian had a good post on this subject sometime ago. Use the fact that it has the original flywheel as a bargaining point. The new flywheel (parts only) will probably cost about $1100. Ad to that the fact that while the eng/tranny is out you wil probably want to replace the clutch plate, mabey the disc, etc, and you aught to be able to talk him down abot 2K. I Like the color- I'm getting tired of having "nail my *** red"
07-16-2001, 09:37 PM
#7
Racer
Thread Starter
Let me reply to some questions:
> First, are those wheels 18 inch?
No, they are 17 inch BBS "Porsche Factory" wheels, according to the owner.
> Second, I would not buy a car without the distribuitor vent kit.
The owner is aware of the problem, but says the shop where the car has been serviced had a difficult time finding a kit. Obviously, I will want to get the belt changed and the kit installed ASAP.
> Third, same as above for original DMF. Of course the miles are still low, but are they original?
It does have the original DMF, but only 43k miles. I spoke with the shop that has done the service on the car and they say they inspected the flywheel and gave it a good bill of health. I think it is more of a dynamic test rather than an inspection, but I didn't ask.
I've looked at two others (both C2s). I have not actually seen this one yet (1200 miles away), but I am scheduled to see and drive it on Saturday. If the drive goes well, and I'm happy with everything about the car, I'll likely buy it.
> Fifth, who is selling it?
Private owner. Guy is getting divorced and openly admits he needs the money.
> Get in writing from the seller that the car has never been crashed and also a PPI done.
A second inspection is being done on Wednesday. Carfax report is okay...here's the VIN if anybody can check it elsewhere:
wp0ab2968mf410119
Finally, market values...I've been shopping for about six weeks now for a '90-'93 C4 Coupe with under 50k miles. So far, I've found this one and one other for exactly $30k. I've yet to find one for less than $30k, and the other one had been hit (accident) and totally repainted. If any of you folks know where I can find a '90-'93 C4 coupe with less than 50k miles for $30k or less, please let me know ASAP. I've been to autotrader.com, usedgermancars.com, cars.com (a good site for used cars) yahoo.com, excite.com and lycos.com to name but a few.
> First, are those wheels 18 inch?
No, they are 17 inch BBS "Porsche Factory" wheels, according to the owner.
> Second, I would not buy a car without the distribuitor vent kit.
The owner is aware of the problem, but says the shop where the car has been serviced had a difficult time finding a kit. Obviously, I will want to get the belt changed and the kit installed ASAP.
> Third, same as above for original DMF. Of course the miles are still low, but are they original?
It does have the original DMF, but only 43k miles. I spoke with the shop that has done the service on the car and they say they inspected the flywheel and gave it a good bill of health. I think it is more of a dynamic test rather than an inspection, but I didn't ask.
I've looked at two others (both C2s). I have not actually seen this one yet (1200 miles away), but I am scheduled to see and drive it on Saturday. If the drive goes well, and I'm happy with everything about the car, I'll likely buy it.
> Fifth, who is selling it?
Private owner. Guy is getting divorced and openly admits he needs the money.
> Get in writing from the seller that the car has never been crashed and also a PPI done.
A second inspection is being done on Wednesday. Carfax report is okay...here's the VIN if anybody can check it elsewhere:
wp0ab2968mf410119
Finally, market values...I've been shopping for about six weeks now for a '90-'93 C4 Coupe with under 50k miles. So far, I've found this one and one other for exactly $30k. I've yet to find one for less than $30k, and the other one had been hit (accident) and totally repainted. If any of you folks know where I can find a '90-'93 C4 coupe with less than 50k miles for $30k or less, please let me know ASAP. I've been to autotrader.com, usedgermancars.com, cars.com (a good site for used cars) yahoo.com, excite.com and lycos.com to name but a few.
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07-19-2001, 07:42 AM
#8
Racer
Thread Starter
Well, I had my airplane ticket in hand and was ready to fly 1200 miles to go buy this car, but the seller got a very pushy "take it or leave it" offer from a local buyer.
He took it. <sigh> That stinks...I'm now out the $50 it will cost me to convert the ticket to a credit, AND I don't have the car.
Oh well. Easy come, easy go. If you know of a '91 or '92 C4 Coupe with less than 50k miles for aprox. $30k, let me know.
He took it. <sigh> That stinks...I'm now out the $50 it will cost me to convert the ticket to a credit, AND I don't have the car.
Oh well. Easy come, easy go. If you know of a '91 or '92 C4 Coupe with less than 50k miles for aprox. $30k, let me know.
07-19-2001, 08:52 AM
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Well, sometimes these things are just not meant to be. I remember one of the first cars I saw was very nice (sport seats, lowered, exhasut etc) but it got sold even before I got to drive it (and this was a dealer 10 minutes from my house).
There are many nice cars out there and many dogs too. The more you see, the more you learn and have a "database" in your mind of what to look for.
Best luck in your search. I have temporarily halted mine, until september.
There are many nice cars out there and many dogs too. The more you see, the more you learn and have a "database" in your mind of what to look for.
Best luck in your search. I have temporarily halted mine, until september.