Graham L

Morning rennlist - got my car back yesterday after 5 weeks while it was rebuilt. Am running it in for 1k miles, so cant really comment on the increase in performance (if any - but given the work required it must be better!), but the clutch is unbelievable - previously this was v hard, and I thought - 'hey , it's a big hairy sports car, of course the clutch is hard', but this is bollocks. the new set up (all std) is incredibly light. The secondary bypass is v noisy, as it should be, and generally the car feels wonderful. Additionally it is, as you'd expect, bone dry from an oil point of view. Parts used shown below - can post individual prices if needed. Am v pleased with the work done - all from JZ Machtech.

Rebuild costs

Top end overhaul
Head gasket set
Valve guide
Guide inlt
Timing chain
Chain tensioner (L&R)
Tensioner (O/S)
Tensioner (N/S)
Piston ring set
Tensioner S/rail (x2)
Rear crank seal
Front crank seal
o-ring (x2)
return tube
oil filter
Sundries (bolts, washers, grease, hot wash, gaskets, oil)
Big end bearing set
Con/rod nut
Con/rod bolt
Through bolt seals
Valve spring kit
Cam timing pin
Rocker bolt
Ht lead clips
Engine cover (O/S/R)
Engine cover (N/S/R)
Clutch kit
Clutch bolts
Clutch shaft
Clutch shaft seal kit
Clutch slave cylinder
Inlet stack
HT leads
Distributor cap
Rotor arm
Injector overhaul
Gearbox earth strap
Hot air hose
Secondary bypass
Clutch fork
Rear exhaust bracket
Tin plate
Oil pressure sender
Door micro switch

Total (inc VAT) = £6831.

Andy Roe

Glad to hear you've got it back Graham!

DaveK

I've been told by several people now that my clutch needs replacing because it's so heavy. I've always wondered whether a new one really is that light. I guess now I know - time to start saving I guess!

Andy Roe

Yep - like chalk & cheese! Very light, but you soon get used to it!

Graham L

New clutch is really VERY light - i thought it was broken when i first got in because i put the pedal in and it went stright to the floor, no effort required whatsoever. Makes the car feel 'nimble' for want of a better word. You can try it at Brands if youre going...

DaveK

Well, that's very generous. What time is my track session in your car then?

Graham L

perhaps not on the track, but only because i've got to keep the revs low. you are more than welcome to try it on roads though...

citychap26

You getting that suspension sort

Glad to hear that you've got your motor back but 7k is flipping steep.

DaveK

I'm actually curious to know what is "standard" on a JZ top end overhaul and what is "recommended since we are in there"? Things like injector overhaul seem like a good idea - I'm sure my car would benefit from that - but is this something they consider part of a basic top end rebuild or is this stuff you thought would be good to have done?

For the work that was done, I'd say the price isn't all that bad (taking into account the cost of maintaining these cars). On the other hand - I must confess that when you posted how much your rebuild was going to cost I realised that I would not be willing to spend that.

I have been having some thoughts about selling my car next year anyway (I'll start an Arjan type thread!) - and things like that make me realise it may well be time. I'm fairly certain that I am not willing to spend £7K repairing my car - and if I'm not, then it's probably not the car for me.

Graham L

I think the standard £3500 top end is the following :
Head gasket set
Valve guide
Guide inlt
Timing chain
Chain tensioner (L&R)
Tensioner (O/S)
Tensioner (N/S)
Piston ring set
Tensioner S/rail (x2)
Rear crank seal
Front crank seal
o-ring (x2)
return tube
oil filter
Sundries (bolts, washers, grease, hot wash, gaskets, oil)


based only on the fact that everything else was itemised separately and these were all lumped into one price. It is a lot, but given the state of it once all the seals had gone I would have only been able to sell it at a discount equivalent to the top end rebuild cost. admittedly the other bits helped up the cost quite a lot - but they were REALLY thorough - i could have chosen to leave the clutch alone, but decided to do it while the engine was out. secondary by pass was £130 that i didnt need to spend, but there were other, non-discretionary expenses too, once you find you've got valve springs broken you have to have a set. Also i had no tin plate heat shields, they'd all rotted - another £600 ish there...
I know i wont get the money back when i do sell it, but it should sell at the top end of the scale given the work done. I hope.

Jerry Garwick

Andy Roe said ;"Yep - like chalk & cheese!" For we ignorant American colonialists, what the hell does that mean? Is it good or bad? I just saw "Charlie and The Chocolate Factory" and don't remember that being said by the actors.

Andy Roe

Totally different!!

Johnny G Pipe

'Evening Graham!

Thanks for the gory details. 6k's a sting all in one go, but your car's gone up 2 or 3 in value, and she won't depreciate, so its still a cheap way to own a 170mph 911.

I have wondered for some time about re-builds for oil leaks: basically you seem to have had an engine whose oil seals went South at 150k - no shame in that - but your posts gave no indication of signs any internal engine trouble - and yet you have had all your engine internals rebuilt.

I know its a 'whilst the engine's out' decision - but this posted by someone on your previous thread:

"A good shop should be able to drop the engine in less than 3 hours. Replacing gaskets and seals should take anywhere from 1 to 6 hours, depending on what is replaced. If it is the timing chain cover seals, then probably about 2 hours and then reassembly."
..sounds like it would have been a lot cheaper..

Where were your big leaks coming from in the end?

IanR

Hi Graham,

Did JZ split the crank case during this? I need to get a rebuid due to leaks, and speaking to Jonas he said they only split the case if the main bearings or oil pump need replacing - can do the big end bearings and through bolt seals without splitting the case.

Cheers
Ian

Graham L

Hi Guys –


Johnny: re internal problems – I didn’t know I had any. The car may have been down on power, but still had plenty there so I didn’t notice it. I should also mention, to my huge shame, that I haven’t ever driven, or indeed actually been driven, in another 964, so I really didn’t have anything to compare it to. Since the rebuild I haven’t been able to compare and contrast before and after as I’m short shifting and keeping the revs low until it’s run it properly. JZM reckon that I was probably about 20% down on power as a result of the internal issues, mainly compression and a couple of broken valve springs. While I appreciate that it is possible to get the engine out etc quickly I wasn’t able to find anywhere that would do a top end for at least £3k, JZM quoted more for the basic job, but gave me the most confidence as they had the best set up that I saw. Main leaks were from the through bolts and the main seal that drives the pulley connected to the fan. This meant that oil was pooling at the bottom of the pulley and being lifted to the fan by the belts – then spraying out of the back of the car or running onto the heat exchangers and burning off. Looked very dramatic, but made the car a bit of a pariah to be around (when we drove the Le Mans circuit Kevin (warmfuzzies) followed me, rather wisely, about 700m back. I was losing a litre of oil every 150 or so miles, although it didn’t actually leak all that much when stationary.

Ian: the crank wasn’t split, the BE bearings we scored, but not all of them. Jonas said (IIRC) that they look at the bearings as they move back towards the main bearings, and if the ones furthest into the oil flow are damaged then they split the case, otherwise they believe the main bearings to be ok. I had light marks on 3 BEB’s, so they reckon that the MB is fine. As you say the BE and through bolts were fixed without splitting it.