Lightweight-Status-Seaching

Hi everyone, I am currently looking for a 1993 or 1994 RS America and was wondering if anyone had tips on how I could find one.. There is a dealership near me (Parcars) that has 2 RSAs but they are going for over $70,000.. Imo, ridiculous.. Well, I was wondering what I should plan on paying (does 40,000 for a low miles car sound right?) and has anyone seen anything at their local dealership? What I have been doing so far, is checking RSamerica.net, checking out the local dealerships on the internet, and also the NY times (but haven't come up with anything).. All and any recommendations are greatly appreciated..

Thanks

John
Formally known as Waiting, Wanting, Searching

J richard

Wanting,

Try the RS America home page classifieds www.rsamerica.net. There you will find what you seek...

Also try the Porsche Classified Network at http://209.235.46.224/pcd/pcd_911.shtml. Fill out the fields and let it rip.

There are many of these that are way overpriced ($60K+) but these are usually for very low mileage still in the box cars, a clean driver should be available for high $30's to low $40's.

Good hunting.

Bill Gregory

John,

Something you may already have thought about is how you will use the RSA. If you are planning anything more than casual track usage, you might want to buy a C2, taking the money you save and putting it into upgrades that will make it more competant on the track. Not that the RSA with the M030 suspension and 17" rims won't be comfortable on the track, however, if you do any serious track time, you'll be upgrading components anyhow.

When I was looking to buy a C2, I found the Porsche Classified Network to be frustrating to deal with. They had some good listings, however, getting them to return calls or get more specific information on certain 911's was hit and miss, at best. Other sources are the Northeast Region's mart at www.porschenet.com. I'd also look at some of the other PCA region's marts, that you can get to through www.pca.org. One place to go is the PCA Oregon region website, as they have an extensive collection of websites with Porsche's for sale.

Lightweight-Status-Seaching

Thanks guys, the Porsche Classified Network is great.. I found a couple of cars which are kinda far (also in my new favorite color-white) but still it wouldn't be bad driving the car over 1000 miles during the first week of ownership... I guess a trip like that would be a good indicator of how reliable the car will be.. If the classifieds turnout to be a waste I know someone that can probably get their hands on an RS for me..
Bill, Im not too sure what you consider casual track use, so maybe you can help me out.. I currently participate in auto-x (just about every week-Im hooked) and plan to do the same with the Porsche.. I also plan to do at least one DE event to see how I like it (little nervous about the added risks of pushing the car to its limits at triple digit speeds).. I guess the reasons I want the RS is because I would like to stay away from buying a perfectly good car and then modding it.. I was thinking about buying an Audi S4 but after making a list of the mods I would do (which ended up being very long) I crossed the car off the list.. I love the fact that the RS was built for racing.. It comes with everything you need and nothing you don't .. The main reason I am going with Porsche is because of its well known association with racing and the fact that the RS was taken one step further then the already great C2 .. I don't want leather seats, don't want a sunroof, don't want power seats, well you get the idea (just want what's needed for racing).. The car I get will be a daily driver but I can do without all those luxurious items that I looked for in my last car.. Truth is, if I wanted something with a nice soft quiet ride, cup holders, heated seats, and all the other stuff deemed useless when racing I'd probably be eying up a Mercedes.. Maybe someone will find this to be cool, about 8 months ago I was seriously considering the Audi TT but after telling a friend, who owns a Porsche, about my idea of the ideal TT, he laughed and told me such a car exists and went on to tell me about the RS.. Well, after hearing about the options that the RS lacked and the mods that Porsche granted it with, I was very impressed and interested.. I then started reading about Porsche and realized that the RS is the car for me... Truth is, if I can't find an RS I'll end up doing exactly what you recommended.. Saving the extra bucks and put it toward some modifications.. My only worry with mods is messing with the stuff that Porsche engineers worked so hard to create.. If I do any mods I will probably have them done by AWE in PA.. Ive seen some of their Audi S4 projects which are very impressive and have also heard nothing but good things from people that have dealt with them..

Thanks again for everyone's help..

John

Adrian

Dear John,
You keep mentioning the RS. The 964 RS is "VERY" different from the 964 RS America. I hope you know this. The RSA is basically a lighter and originally cheaper version of the C2 for the American market only. Unfortunately a large numbers were modified up with options and ended up only 50lbs lighter than standard. Basically a C2 without power steering.
The ride heights of the C2 and RSA are the same. M030 suspension provides a 40% stiffer ride but does not lower.
For track use I would consider a C2 Coupe, stripping it out but keeping it road legal and making more of a RS replica rather than a RSA or an RS out of a RSA. I know the RSA guys make some changes to their machines and they go very well. I am just wondering if this can be achieved with less cost with a C2 in maybe less than pristine condition,
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4

Lightweight-Status-Seaching

Adrian,

Yes sir, good call.. I believe the US only got the RSA while Europe had a choice between 2 RS models (the Carrera RS and plain RS)? I read a recent article in Classic & Sports car that said the RS Carrera got thinner glass and a few other goodies (don't think the RSA got that).. In 94 (for Europe only) Porsche introduced a 993 based RS (please correct me if I am wrong) which got a 300hp 3.6 liter engine and the double wish bone suspension (to my knowledge the US did not receive a 993 based RS).. In the same article on the RS line (RSA excluded), they had a picture of the 993 interior and the 964 interior.. After checking out both pictures I was shocked but extremely happy to see that both interiors were almost identical.. I thought that was pretty damm cool, because its like Porsche is telling us, we did it right the first time so why the hell should we go and screw with an already great thing.. Wow, I just checked out the picture of the 73's interior and what do you know, Porsche has left things close to the same for 20 years.. Ah man, the more I learn about this car and company the more I fall in love it with them.. Oh yes, Ive noticed that most of the RSA's being sold are equipped with the sunroof, a/c, and stereo options and Ive decided that I will narrow my choices down to the RSAs lacking a sunroof... I was thinking about getting a C2 and trying to convert it into a RSA replica but I figured why not save the time, effort and money and go for the real thing which will probably be worth more in 20 years (Beside I don't have the heart to gut a perfectly good car).... But I guess time will tell..


Thanks

John

Adrian

Dear John,
There were actually three versions of the 964 RS.
The NGT, the basic model and the touring model. The touring model was a fully optioned up, similar to RS America. Only 11 were built.
One of the 290 NGTs are the sought after models here in Switzerland.
After the 964 RS came the mighty 964 Carrera RS 3.8. Very rare (about 80 built I believe). The 993RS was a 1995 model knowledge and these are superb machines.
I know you are in the USA but RS land for us is AMAG in Lausanne. What a place. It is the main service for RSs in the French Sector of Switzerland. Very popular down there because there are quite a few race tracks in fairly easy commutable distances. Motorsport is banned here in Switzerland, except in a few special cases.
The RS America is a great base to make something even better. Lack of power steering is a good start. I have checked out the rsamerica web site and there are quite a few for sale at reasonable prices. $30-40K range.
Anyway, good luck with your challenge and I hope it works out for you,
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4

freetrog

John,

I wouldn't go down the road of modifying a C2. The joy of owning a porsche is in it's originality. As you'll find when you're looking for a car, a well cared for, clean, original porsche is a rare beast and worth the money.

It's also money in the bank. A clean original car will sell in a heartbeat. You'll have to find a special person that wants a car that's modified just the way you want it, and that could take time.

Get the RSA and you won't regret it. I bought mine almost 4 yrs ago and would do it again in a heartbeat. I've now got 46k on mine and I'd trade up but the problem is there isn't another vehichle out there like it.

Good luck

FT

Jim Michaels

Altho I certainly see Adrian's point about enhancing a regular C2, I kinda agree with FT (Mike?). We're both RSA chauvinists. I would have had a 993 before now, but they forgot to make a 993 RSA. Actually, they didn't forget that they had a hard time selling the RSAs new. Dealers were having to sell new no-option RSAs for below their cost. But RSAs are apparently now selling (not just asking prices) for a few more $k than similar C2s. I recently saw 15 RSAs at rsamerica.net, including some that had already been sold. The average milage was 36k and the average asking price was $42.7k. All owners of RSAs with over 40k miles were asking $40K or less, however. The cheapest was a white one with 70k miles for $33k. In contrast, those with less than 18k miles were around $45k. Some already have many "enhancements", and no doubt many miles on the track. I bought mine enhanced and tracked for $42k 3.5 years ago and have no regrets (I was going to track it anyway), except for wishing I'd bought it sooner.

J richard

John,

Given what you are looking for is exactly what most RSAmericas are modified for, I would look for one that someone has made the changes that you are looking for. You will be getting the upgrades that bring the car to a very high level of performance for very little cost over a tweeked C2. And you will have a relativily rare car. Keep looking you will find one that suits your need, they are out there. While the RSA's are very similar to the C2, if you get the 93, you are getting a european RS tub which is seam welded and has rolled rear fenders for additional clearance, reduced undercoating, no power steering, sport suspension, wide bolster sports seats & doorpanels wider wheels and a fixed wing. I don't think you can get closer (in the states) to an out of the box track car. Ones modified like Jims, (similar to mine) are a ball to drive on the track, AND the street.

Good Hunting

Lightweight-Status-Seaching

freetrog, I can't agree with you any more... You sound exactly like I do when I tell my friends about this car.. Quick question guys about the 1994 RSA's that were produced.. What exactly was their story? Were they exactly the same as the 93 RSA (besides the rear seats being installed) Was this car built on the European RS tub?

Thanks again for all your help

John

Adrian

Dear John,
To be only technically correct, the 93 and 94 RSA tubs were converted C2 tubs they were not actual RS tubs. How do I know this. Well I happened to have stumbled across the conversion process undertaken in the factory. Amazing what appears in the mail sometimes.
I also have the conversion process to convert a C2 tub into a RS tub which also includes suspension and axle modifications/reinforcements. However for this you have to wait for my book.
The difference of converting C2 tubs into RS or RSA tubs is just a few extra steps for the RS. However in the end it is just a play on words. To me a converted C2 tub into another specification makes it the new specification. The only physical difference is the part number, if you can find it,
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4

PS: According to my data only 114 1994 model year RSAs were produced.

Adrian

Oh I forgot. We have actually located a genuine RSA here in Switzerland. I do not know its background (yet!!) but I am trying to find out. It also is living in RS land down in Lausanne Switzerland.
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4

AR

John, I went through a similar deliberation about 6 months ago. And came to the realization that the RSA is nothing more than a set of decal and few less pounds. However, the euro RS are very special cars and rare. I bought the next best thing. And if you want a car that was built for racing and really a car that the RSA should have been you ought to consider the US Carrera Cup Car. These cars are the American version of the street legal euro RS cars. More importantly, given the price of these cars and the mods on the RSA that need to be made to make it a cup car, you will spend a similar amount. But you would get a car that is extremely rare 1 or 45 in existence and original. You should check out this website.... it will demonstrate that the RSA is just the decal car. URL= http://www.lynchracing.net/cups/1992...tar1@naxs.net. Here you will really get the appreciation of what Porsche builds when it builds a road going race car. I bought my car for DE, and unfortunately do not have time or the geography to drive it there. I am in Green Bay and the location just does not have enough PCA activities. I need to find a good home for it. My car has 4300 mile...and needs a new home. Take a look at these cars...good luck in your search.

Bill Gregory

Is this different than what's in the factory workshop manual in Volume 5, Body, sections 50-101 thru 53-101?