JoeW

One reason for the weight is Porsche's insistence on sustained reliability under competitive situations. This isn't to say there aren't "better" clutches (RS being the traditional example), but the company has usually tried to give performance and, especially, durability. The idea has been that to win the race you have to finish the race -- this philosophy has been part of Porsche's stock in trade.

I also want to assure you that some of the people who complain about the stalling of the RS pkg have a lot of experience both on and off track -- there are ways (chip map, etc.) to moderate the difficulty, but if you plan to use the car on the street it really might be a good idea to find an example to drive before you commit quite a bit of cash to it. Otherwise, I certainly agree that it is a highly desirable upgrade.

As far as modifications I'd suggest, take a look at my sig. It's a long and slippery slope and pretty easy to drop $20k into the car without doing anything to the engine. Get into the engine and another $20k can soon be history. Thereby the suggestion to take it slow and think it out so each step is value-added.

For starters, why not do a search on each and you can at least hear what owner's think. (I've never owned an M, but I've beaten a couple, and been beaten by more than a couple -- locally we have a "rumble" each fall vs. the BMW club... lots of fun and good folk!)

Hope this helps.
Joe

ltc

Sumtoc,
I apologize in advance for sounding forward, but it would seem as though the RSAmerica is not exactly what you are looking for.

IMHO, it sounds like you would be happier with either of these 964 cars (considering it sounds like a 996GT3 is not to your style liking):

1. 964 Carrera Cup USA
http://www.carreracupusa.org/


2. (Euro) Carrera RS (imported/federalized).
There is a rennlist member, Steve Patti, from TX (can't remmber his rennlist user name), who does this. http://euro-rs.com/.
There is one for sale in the PCA Mart, race car section, ad# 1291
http://www.pca.org/mart/classifieds....uery=retrieval

I've been in/driven both of these and they are an RSAmerica and then some. I believe it would be a turnkey solution to what you are searchng for.

Best of luck.

JW in Texas

That is Steve's personal Club race car that is for sale. Let me assure you, it's very strong & well set up. A great car for the money! He runs with me down here in "D" class.

Sumtoc

Very interesting. Appreciate the input, but for me half the fun is putting on the mods/upgrades myself. Not really looking for a track car (I know...never say never...), instead opting for a street car for recreational driving and some light track use, DEs, etc. Thinking that I find a MY 93-94 964, build it up with selected mods and see if I can resist the tempation to take it to RS levels of performance, which of course would be a lot of work and more $$. At some point you have to decide when to stop that process and just buy a car like Steve's. But for now I think I'd like to start with the basic 964. Kinda begin my own journey if you know what I mean....

tonytaylor

My C2 has slowly evolved from a standard car to a track orientated one, via an intermediate stage half way between the two extremes. On the basis of if I knew then what I know now, here's my thoughts.

If you want a hard core track type car then buy a factory car; either a Euro RS clubsport or a Cup car. There are too many differences, that are significant for track use, to make converting a standard car into a replica. Whenever I have looked into upgrading various aspects of the car for track use invariably the answer is to use RS parts, unfortunatly these are often very expensive and difficult to come by used. If you buy a Euro RS or Cup car it will retain its value whereas a modified RSA or C2 won't give the money used to modify back at resale.

Having said that a halfway house between RS and standard can make a far better street car and give 90% of the RS experience on track. Fast road suspension ( I used H+R coilovers and would recommend them), light weight RS flywheel/clutch, lightweight Recaro seats and basic performance upgrades to the engine to give 35-50bhp more, cup tyres and you have near as dammit RS performance for nowhere near RS money.

I agree that part of the fun is doing the upgrades and seeing the differences. A labour of love but best not think too hard on the financial implications.

Sumtoc

Good points Tony. I strongly suspect I will be happy with the 90% approach. (I may actually stop somewhere before that point.) If I need that extra 10% for an all out track car, I would probably just buy a dedicated track car like those you guys have suggested for that purpose and keep the first car for street use. Had a friend who did this and helped him work on the track car. It was an older 911 with Webers, those are fun to keep in tune/synch..... His street car was a 911 Turbo. Kinda doubt that I will be bitten that bad by the track bug though.

Resale value is an issue, but having gone through this with other cars I know that you really never recover the money (or much of it anyway) you spend on modifcations/upgrades. But that is part of the deal going in.

Cupcar

I agree with Tony, carefully chosen parts from Porsche RS and Cup cars plus tastefully removing weight is the way to go. A car with a lot of aftermarket parts depreciates like a refridgerator flies.

A friend recently completely removed his interior and converted it to RS spec with carpeting kits and door panels he got on eBay. This is what I mean by tasteful weight reduction.

Also using OEM supplier parts seems to bolster resale. Recaro and BBS for example are OEM supplier to Porsche and I feel using their parts will retain value better than say a set of Sparco seats and OZ wheels.

joey bagadonuts

One last consideration. If you think you may want to participate in PCA Club Racing some day, then you'll want to peruse the rulebook before making any changes. The LWF is a good example of a very reasonable peformance upgrade which, unfortunately, gets you promoted to a faster racing class.

Other than that, I say go for it. I bought a bone stock car and have had a lot of fun modifiying it.