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Engine bay system simplifications

 
Old 12-21-2018, 01:24 AM
  #16  
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Old 12-24-2018, 04:24 AM
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Originally Posted by JesusFast View Post
Would that be worth the money?
Yes.
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Old 12-24-2018, 04:26 AM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by Peteinjp View Post

I just pulled out my engine/transmission as a birthday present to myself.




Whatís the story with that lift? Looks like something I could actually fit in my garage.
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Old 12-24-2018, 04:38 AM
  #19  
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I've been wondering that myself! I'm probably wrong, but it looks like 2 ATV lifts?
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Old 12-24-2018, 05:55 AM
  #20  
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It’s a cheapo scissors lift from china. Not sure of the maker but it is CE rated apparently. The 964 fits it well.

SO this started off as a simplification thread and quickly spiraled into full intake refurbishment options. Why you may ask- I’m the do it all and know that it’s done right type.

Stated goals are:

1- refurbish all the engine related systems and re-seal. Timing chains will come off but heads are not.
2. Future proof/simplify
3. Plan for future mods which will happen with the next rebuild- currently at 120,000km and good numbers for leakdown and compression
4. Make the engine look bad ***- or at least understandable
5. Get everything that requires an engine out done at once so I can keep it on the road

So its taken me a while to calculate all this stuff

Option one: refurbish current system so its basically good for another 20+ years. This includes all the fuel lines, electrical connectors, sensors, plug wires etc in addition to regular maintenance - but stops short of rebuilding the dizzy and replacing the air flow meter. NOT including labor and not including oil hoses this comes out in the $7000 range. Good reliable system for sure- but I’d basically be very limited in terms of future mods (3.8/993rs cams and re-chip) though still not bad at that. Also is quiet which is nice if live in japan where the local roads are dotted with houses.

Option 2- everybody's favorite- GT3 plenum itb’s and motec. It has the potential to make as much power as the internals are capable of while retaining the polish of the original system in terms of altitude, a/c, cold start etc etc. This raises the cost to around the $16,000 mark-not including tuning (which is significant if done properly.) Which is where the problem is for me. I don’t want to tune it myself. I do not have access to a dyno nearby. There is no one in my area that I trust to do it- and I’m a perfectionist- I don’t want to spend hours upon hours tuning. Plain and simple the learning curve is too steep and honestly without at least a chassis dyno I this the results would not live up to the potential the technology provides.

Option 3- most likely everyone’s least favorite but- I like it. PMO carbs and JB racing ignition. Yes- you read right- carbs. This come in at the middle of these cost-wise at around $11,000. It provides me with a simple, rugged, easy to tune system that looks and sounds great. A decent about of weight gets removed. Will provide a decent bump in power throughout the rpm range with a little extra up top which should fit my 6 speed gear ratio’s very well. I know carbs inside and out- though I have never used PMO’s before. Easy tune for future mods as well as diagnose any problems. Also its unique- it seems at least one of us should go the functional backdate route. Cons include harder starting- but I’m from the carb world so thats not a big dealt to me.

IF- I could do anything I’d 100% choose MFI because it is the best of all worlds. Somehow the most expensive least practical option always turns out to be the favorite......

I’m on the fence between 1&3. 1 is cheaper and retains the overall polish of the car for touring. 3. Is much more exciting of a project. I figure I can always go back if needed.

The fact is I have to chose one of these cause the oem stuff is showing this age. It’s going to need to be done in the next years and I’d just as soon get it out of the way and reduce near future labor costs at the same time.

In addition I’m going with the Benz pump up front for the power steering and hopefully a truck mounted A/c compressor....


Should end up looking similar to this:




But with in a 964 with a RS heater bypass tube- but I may get rid of that as well......

Pic credit: stolen from thirst build thread...

Pete








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Old 12-25-2018, 04:22 PM
  #21  
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Hello Pete,
Great project, keep us updated,
Where would you source the AC compressor and piping to fit in the front, I guess its an electric one ?

Cheers
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Old 12-27-2018, 10:34 PM
  #22  
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Thats one sweet engine bay

Originally Posted by Peteinjp View Post
Itís a cheapo scissors lift from china. Not sure of the maker but it is CE rated apparently. The 964 fits it well.

SO this started off as a simplification thread and quickly spiraled into full intake refurbishment options. Why you may ask- Iím the do it all and know that itís done right type.

Stated goals are:

1- refurbish all the engine related systems and re-seal. Timing chains will come off but heads are not.
2. Future proof/simplify
3. Plan for future mods which will happen with the next rebuild- currently at 120,000km and good numbers for leakdown and compression
4. Make the engine look bad ***- or at least understandable
5. Get everything that requires an engine out done at once so I can keep it on the road

So its taken me a while to calculate all this stuff

Option one: refurbish current system so its basically good for another 20+ years. This includes all the fuel lines, electrical connectors, sensors, plug wires etc in addition to regular maintenance - but stops short of rebuilding the dizzy and replacing the air flow meter. NOT including labor and not including oil hoses this comes out in the $7000 range. Good reliable system for sure- but Iíd basically be very limited in terms of future mods (3.8/993rs cams and re-chip) though still not bad at that. Also is quiet which is nice if live in japan where the local roads are dotted with houses.

Option 2- everybody's favorite- GT3 plenum itbís and motec. It has the potential to make as much power as the internals are capable of while retaining the polish of the original system in terms of altitude, a/c, cold start etc etc. This raises the cost to around the $16,000 mark-not including tuning (which is significant if done properly.) Which is where the problem is for me. I donít want to tune it myself. I do not have access to a dyno nearby. There is no one in my area that I trust to do it- and Iím a perfectionist- I donít want to spend hours upon hours tuning. Plain and simple the learning curve is too steep and honestly without at least a chassis dyno I this the results would not live up to the potential the technology provides.

Option 3- most likely everyoneís least favorite but- I like it. PMO carbs and JB racing ignition. Yes- you read right- carbs. This come in at the middle of these cost-wise at around $11,000. It provides me with a simple, rugged, easy to tune system that looks and sounds great. A decent about of weight gets removed. Will provide a decent bump in power throughout the rpm range with a little extra up top which should fit my 6 speed gear ratioís very well. I know carbs inside and out- though I have never used PMOís before. Easy tune for future mods as well as diagnose any problems. Also its unique- it seems at least one of us should go the functional backdate route. Cons include harder starting- but Iím from the carb world so thats not a big dealt to me.

IF- I could do anything Iíd 100% choose MFI because it is the best of all worlds. Somehow the most expensive least practical option always turns out to be the favorite......

Iím on the fence between 1&3. 1 is cheaper and retains the overall polish of the car for touring. 3. Is much more exciting of a project. I figure I can always go back if needed.

The fact is I have to chose one of these cause the oem stuff is showing this age. Itís going to need to be done in the next years and Iíd just as soon get it out of the way and reduce near future labor costs at the same time.

In addition Iím going with the Benz pump up front for the power steering and hopefully a truck mounted A/c compressor....


Should end up looking similar to this:




But with in a 964 with a RS heater bypass tube- but I may get rid of that as well......

Pic credit: stolen from thirst build thread...

Pete








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